rocketpig said: Million said: rocketpig said: If you put all these bad elements(objectivley speaking) into a game then censorship of this is reasonable regardless of what you opinion is. And who, pray tell, gets to decide this? Good question , obviously there is no moral elite , people don't care about what the bible has to say about anything anymore so the only real decision make which we can (I don't think we should though) rely upon is society. If society feels it's bad then it's exactly that, the majority wins and no opinion is greater than the majority opinion no matter how valid it is. Slavery rocked, yo.

the world majority was aganist it but we were hanging on there--and since africa proably had a bigger population then us at the time they were the majority 

 

rocketpig said: mesoteto said: rocketpig said: mesoteto said: "We all know drunk driving is wrong. That's a given. But the moment you think a piece of artistic material should be changed to reflect the current popular opinion's viewpoint, you step onto a very slippery slope." see you agree that drunk driving is wrong...so why support its purpose in a game....drunk driving is not art dealing with the trials and tribulations of an upcoming thug as he quests to find his pplace in the urban society..that can be art Telling someone what or what is not art is one of the first steps to censorship. sometimes there needs to be censorship...its not always a bad thing   It's always a bad thing. Who decides what gets censored? Who declares themselves so omnipotent as to believe their line of thought is the only correct one? Most importantly, what happens when you disagree?

You know RP, you're talking about censorship being a good thing, with the exception that things shouldn't be censored from you. And i do understand your view. I'd take the same stand unless i'd know that the game is targeted to kids, who, by the way, will buy the most copies. But before saying anything about the drunkdriving, i'd like to know what kind of aspect the game has on it. If it's "not fun", it's perfectly fine to have it in the game.

this was expected anyways.

mesoteto said: rocketpig said: Million said: rocketpig said: If you put all these bad elements(objectivley speaking) into a game then censorship of this is reasonable regardless of what you opinion is. And who, pray tell, gets to decide this? Good question , obviously there is no moral elite , people don't care about what the bible has to say about anything anymore so the only real decision make which we can (I don't think we should though) rely upon is society. If society feels it's bad then it's exactly that, the majority wins and no opinion is greater than the majority opinion no matter how valid it is. Slavery rocked, yo. the world majority was aganist it but we were hanging on there--and since africa proably had a bigger population then us at the time they were the majority

At one point or another most cultures have practiced slavery, including Africans. Dunno why we think what they did was wrong, at one point the majority of people obviously thought it was okay.

Where did I ever imply that censorship was a good thing?

Parents have plenty of warnings showing that material is not appropriate for children and in most countries, children won't be able to buy GTA IV. I don't know what more can be done. You can't retrain stupidity.

@Rocket--You have appoint about where the majority dropped the ball but I can give you this one as an example where censorship was great
the minority (Hitler and his followers) thought the holocaust would be a good idea,
While the majority (every one that wasn’t affiliated to the Nazi party) thought it was bad—majority stepped in and put it down

mesoteto said: rocketpig said: Million said: rocketpig said: If you put all these bad elements(objectivley speaking) into a game then censorship of this is reasonable regardless of what you opinion is. And who, pray tell, gets to decide this? Good question , obviously there is no moral elite , people don't care about what the bible has to say about anything anymore so the only real decision make which we can (I don't think we should though) rely upon is society. If society feels it's bad then it's exactly that, the majority wins and no opinion is greater than the majority opinion no matter how valid it is. Slavery rocked, yo. the world majority was aganist it but we were hanging on there--and since africa proably had a bigger population then us at the time they were the majority

I didn't explain myself well enough , obviously all majorities aren't the same (I think you was just taking the word "majority" for it's pure meaning as opposed to trying to interprit what I was saying).

All the students, 90% of the school's population ("School population" including teachers,supervisors and other staff) can vote in favour of the school canteen being closed down , despite the vast number of people desiring a closure of the canteen their majority vote isn't as effective as say 75% of the teaching and supervisory staff wanting the canteen to remain open. 1% of the student's population's influence doesn't not equate to 1% of the staffs populations influence.

 A student sais "i'm leaving, I hate your decision making" No problem

Member of staff sais " i'm leaving , I hatey you decision making" Problem , cost's of looking for new staff , arranging new staff time tables , possibility of putting more workload on other staff etc etc. 

Society in in this modern day context has the power because democracy gave them that , the slave trade remained until the most powerful and influencial people didn't want it .

I made the assumption that you'd understand that I meant majoirty in the context of democratic decision making.

mesoteto said: @Rocket--You have appoint about where the majority dropped the ball but I can give you this one as an example where censorship was great the minority (Hitler and his followers) thought the holocaust would be a good idea, While the majority (every one that wasn’t affiliated to the Nazi party) thought it was bad—majority stepped in and put it down

Were they really the minority? Not in Germany.

And the majority (rest of the world) only stepped in because Germany made half of Europe its bitch. Let's separate "self-serving agenda" from "majority rule". 

Heh, pretty stupid.

It should be obvious by now that video games don't cause ppl to become violent.

If i was an aussie, i would be well pissed.

@Rocket- i think he means this

“Nope, but when I do, I'll pay damned close attention to what they're doing. It's not society's job to raise a child.
I read my first Stephen King book at age nine and watched A Clockwork Orange at eleven. My parents were of the opinion that if I could comprehend what was happening and deal with it in a rational manner, it was acceptable to let me explore somewhat questionable material. I will do the same for my children.”

b/c the moment you stop your kids from seeing something you have censored them and by keeping inappropriate material out of there hands you might have been doing a good thing, but it could easily fall into the “necessary evil” catalog for you

 

@and my nazi example is sound, but it all depends on what you define as majorty b/c its a subjective word