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Forums - Politics Discussion - Many Google employees disagree with the firing of the memo writer

DonFerrari said:

I'm aware of that. But liberals in USA consider themselves to be left, and you are right about Google as for most companies. I consider myself classic liberal (british denomination) or minaquirst.

They consider themselves, but most liberals in the US are still economically right. I'd consider myself a left-wing christian democrat. Quite normal here, but not as common in the US, at least not in the media.



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WolfpackN64 said:
DonFerrari said:

I'm aware of that. But liberals in USA consider themselves to be left, and you are right about Google as for most companies. I consider myself classic liberal (british denomination) or minaquirst.

They consider themselves, but most liberals in the US are still economically right. I'd consider myself a left-wing christian democrat. Quite normal here, but not as common in the US, at least not in the media.

A colleague in Brazil is probably similar to you on designation.

Well I wouldn't say they are economically right or liberal since they want several government control of economy, but sure we can agree they are a lot more attached to money and big corporations than what any liberal should be or a left wing person that wants more rights for employees.



duduspace11 "Well, since we are estimating costs, Pokemon Red/Blue did cost Nintendo about $50m to make back in 1996"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=8808363

Mr Puggsly: "Hehe, I said good profit. You said big profit. Frankly, not losing money is what I meant by good. Don't get hung up on semantics"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=9008994

Azzanation: "PS5 wouldn't sold out at launch without scalpers."

Dark_Lord_2008 said:
An employer does not need to state reasons for firing an employee. Business is just business and it is just capitalism. Google is a business and it is a capitalist system. The employees making noise, should remain silent or else they can be fired for being disruptive.

I agreed with the guy but this 100%. If you have a problem with your company publicly trying to out them is not the way to handle it. Privately talk to them about it or find another company. My company was paying me very little money at one point. I got an IT certification, 2 weeks later we had a meeting saying we would get raises if we got certifications. 2 weeks later I still didn't see or have anyone talk to me about a raise.

There was a few ways I could have handled this situaton but I already felt disrespect an unappareciated. I sent out resumes and got a company to pay over double what I was making. My company asked what it was the day before my last day and said they couldn't match it (nor would I have accepeted a simple matching of the offer).

3 years later I had the company emailing me to see if I could come back because they were having trouble finding employees that would stick around and that were reliable. I was with them for 4 years so they knew I was reliable. I did interview with them and got them to give me an offer which I should to my current company who offered me $8,000 more to stay. So I stayed.

My point is people like this guy have options why waste your time complaining when you dont even have to be there and can just find a diferrent company that falls more in line with your thinking.



method114 said:
Dark_Lord_2008 said:
An employer does not need to state reasons for firing an employee. Business is just business and it is just capitalism. Google is a business and it is a capitalist system. The employees making noise, should remain silent or else they can be fired for being disruptive.

I agreed with the guy but this 100%. If you have a problem with your company publicly trying to out them is not the way to handle it. Privately talk to them about it or find another company. My company was paying me very little money at one point. I got an IT certification, 2 weeks later we had a meeting saying we would get raises if we got certifications. 2 weeks later I still didn't see or have anyone talk to me about a raise.

There was a few ways I could have handled this situaton but I already felt disrespect an unappareciated. I sent out resumes and got a company to pay over double what I was making. My company asked what it was the day before my last day and said they couldn't match it (nor would I have accepeted a simple matching of the offer).

3 years later I had the company emailing me to see if I could come back because they were having trouble finding employees that would stick around and that were reliable. I was with them for 4 years so they knew I was reliable. I did interview with them and got them to give me an offer which I should to my current company who offered me $8,000 more to stay. So I stayed.

My point is people like this guy have options why waste your time complaining when you dont even have to be there and can just find a diferrent company that falls more in line with your thinking.

He sent an internal Memo, he wasn't publically complaining... and several companies say they incentivize employees to voice their opinions...

You can even see the answer google gave (according to someone before in this thread) that they are favorable to voice out, but since he was saying woman are inferior (he didn't say it) it would cause a bad environment so they had to fire him. So you can see they are very mischevous on the dealing of issues.



duduspace11 "Well, since we are estimating costs, Pokemon Red/Blue did cost Nintendo about $50m to make back in 1996"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=8808363

Mr Puggsly: "Hehe, I said good profit. You said big profit. Frankly, not losing money is what I meant by good. Don't get hung up on semantics"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=9008994

Azzanation: "PS5 wouldn't sold out at launch without scalpers."

DonFerrari said:
method114 said:

I agreed with the guy but this 100%. If you have a problem with your company publicly trying to out them is not the way to handle it. Privately talk to them about it or find another company. My company was paying me very little money at one point. I got an IT certification, 2 weeks later we had a meeting saying we would get raises if we got certifications. 2 weeks later I still didn't see or have anyone talk to me about a raise.

There was a few ways I could have handled this situaton but I already felt disrespect an unappareciated. I sent out resumes and got a company to pay over double what I was making. My company asked what it was the day before my last day and said they couldn't match it (nor would I have accepeted a simple matching of the offer).

3 years later I had the company emailing me to see if I could come back because they were having trouble finding employees that would stick around and that were reliable. I was with them for 4 years so they knew I was reliable. I did interview with them and got them to give me an offer which I should to my current company who offered me $8,000 more to stay. So I stayed.

My point is people like this guy have options why waste your time complaining when you dont even have to be there and can just find a diferrent company that falls more in line with your thinking.

He sent an internal Memo, he wasn't publically complaining... and several companies say they incentivize employees to voice their opinions...

You can even see the answer google gave (according to someone before in this thread) that they are favorable to voice out, but since he was saying woman are inferior (he didn't say it) it would cause a bad environment so they had to fire him. So you can see they are very mischevous on the dealing of issues.

In that case Google is just dumb. I read what he said and in a way he was saying women were inferior but nothing was factually incorrect as far as I saw. Men and Women are both inferior to each other in different ways. This isn't something that is new we've known this for a while.



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method114 said:
DonFerrari said:

He sent an internal Memo, he wasn't publically complaining... and several companies say they incentivize employees to voice their opinions...

You can even see the answer google gave (according to someone before in this thread) that they are favorable to voice out, but since he was saying woman are inferior (he didn't say it) it would cause a bad environment so they had to fire him. So you can see they are very mischevous on the dealing of issues.

In that case Google is just dumb. I read what he said and in a way he was saying women were inferior but nothing was factually incorrect as far as I saw. Men and Women are both inferior to each other in different ways. This isn't something that is new we've known this for a while.

Someone could arguee that he said they were inferior. But he were talking more about difference in interest and not in capacity, and that the capability distribution of the male and female population are different but there is a very big overlap. So in a way even arguing he said women are inferior he didn't said all women are inferior to men. It would be like a female could be better than any male and vice-versa at something, but on the average population men are better with math and woman are better at team work and things like that. But that hiring anyone based on the steriotype would be dumb, same on policies, each of those would need to look at each individual person traits. But aknowledging the differences between people and groups they could tailor better their diversity driver in a way that would attract more individuals of that group they want without having to make discrimination.

Like, if a reason for females to not thrive to CEO positions or engineering is the long hours and stress, allow someone to be part-time engineer without discrimination, take a little of the burden of the CEO so that a mother can have the position without leaving the childs behind, etc.



duduspace11 "Well, since we are estimating costs, Pokemon Red/Blue did cost Nintendo about $50m to make back in 1996"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=8808363

Mr Puggsly: "Hehe, I said good profit. You said big profit. Frankly, not losing money is what I meant by good. Don't get hung up on semantics"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=9008994

Azzanation: "PS5 wouldn't sold out at launch without scalpers."

DonFerrari said:
method114 said:

In that case Google is just dumb. I read what he said and in a way he was saying women were inferior but nothing was factually incorrect as far as I saw. Men and Women are both inferior to each other in different ways. This isn't something that is new we've known this for a while.

Someone could arguee that he said they were inferior. But he were talking more about difference in interest and not in capacity, and that the capability distribution of the male and female population are different but there is a very big overlap. So in a way even arguing he said women are inferior he didn't said all women are inferior to men. It would be like a female could be better than any male and vice-versa at something, but on the average population men are better with math and woman are better at team work and things like that. But that hiring anyone based on the steriotype would be dumb, same on policies, each of those would need to look at each individual person traits. But aknowledging the differences between people and groups they could tailor better their diversity driver in a way that would attract more individuals of that group they want without having to make discrimination.

Like, if a reason for females to not thrive to CEO positions or engineering is the long hours and stress, allow someone to be part-time engineer without discrimination, take a little of the burden of the CEO so that a mother can have the position without leaving the childs behind, etc.

Women can't handle stress huh? I'd like to see a man take four hours to push a baby out of his asshole and see how cool he is under pressure, lol. How many men can deal with a baby yelling in their face for 20+ hours a day? I'd say working in an office is child's play compared to that. 

To be honest too the math thing is not really my experience, in my experience the girls in my junior high and high school classes often scored higher in math. White males ironically were actually probably the lowest testing group. 

A lot of these studies are not conclusive. IMO most of this stuff is because of cultural issues, girls are pushed very hard to like certain types of things from a young age, as are boys, but if you reversed that I would say in many fields you would probably see a flip. 



Dark_Lord_2008 said:
An employer does not need to state reasons for firing an employee. Business is just business and it is just capitalism. Google is a business and it is a capitalist system. The employees making noise, should remain silent or else they can be fired for being disruptive.

What a pile of uninformed nonsense. Yes, employers can fire employees for any reason but if it isn't for cause then they can be sued by the employee for wrongful termination. Using the internal forum to voice a concern about the company is not an offense that would be considered for cause by any sane person. If anything, there would be corrective action in the form of a warning, then escalation for each additional infraction up to and including termination.

Google did not take appropriate action and they will have to pony up for their decision on this, I've no doubt.



Google should have gave a proper warning instead.



nanorazor said:
Google should have gave a proper warning instead.

The damage was done. Other female employees were already complaining that they didn't want to work with him and that's fair on their part IMO. 

If you're a white man, would you want to work alongside someone who believes you to be biologically inferior and easily rattled by stress? Probably not. 

Even if Google has to settle out of court it's easily worth it to prevent more spread of poor PR ... they are a company that makes products after all that are used by a lot of women (go figure) and that kind of toxic PR would've likely led to a boycott of their products/services if Google did not act. And that is the free market. People can vote with their wallets, and when over 50% of the marketplace is women, you better bet your ass that group carries a lot of sway.