Woh! look at the big brain on brad!  Oh, and I forgot to mention this LA Times.  Can you ring me up for that too?

Watch your step, buddy. No personal insults.

lol, we aren't the ones getting our philosophy from a videogame, and claiming it's deep. I'm pretty sure Rocketpig, and myself has studied far more philosophy (you know the kind in books, without the moving pictures) than you will ever find in the metal Gear series, which apparently only the second one because you say the first and third are shallow and dumb.

 What do you call people spamming up my thread and not anwering legitimate questions with legitimate answers?

*looks around*

I see plenty of legitimate answers flying from all sides around here. You just happen to not agree with them. That's okay, too. But we have to draw the line at personal insults and name-calling. 

 You call this a legitimate answer?

 I'd like a 2 pump venti mocha and a blueberry scone please and could you warm that up for me?  That would be great, thanks.

 Maybe you should clean up your own backyard before complaining about name calling, afterall you're the one allowing spam and off topic posts like the above to fill up the remainder of this thread. That's against ToS I believe.

You're right, Billy. Lets get back to talking about The Republic . . . err Metal Gear Solid 2.

I believe this sum up Kojima's intentions. He was trying to reproduce a good surprise ending like the one that was in the first MGS. For me he was successful as I was totally surprised of how crappy the ending was. All of a sudden out of the blue he tried to throw in 30 minute philosophy lession into the game. I wouldn't have been more surprised if he tried to teach me about gun safety at the end of the game.

Joke posts are allowed now and again. If I was to chase people around for doing that sort of thing, I wouldn't have time to post. Every thread over one page descends into humorous posts sooner or later.

PS. Don't tell me how, when, or where to moderate. I told you politely to stop name-calling. Take the advice and leave it at that.

I agree with your comparison between Deus Ex and Blade Runner. I actually made that connection in my previous post. The difference is that I do not consider Blade Runner to be a work of profundity. They both do what they do exceptionally well, but neither work requires much interpretation.

"The game tackles political philosophies, greed and ambition of the god-like, world domination, freedom of speech; and to a smaller scale the loss of identity, cloning and religion."

All of which are fine subjects for philosophical enquiry, but none of which necessarily relate to an understanding of broader philosophical concepts. Let me clarify again that I am a fan of Deus Ex, but to suggest that it's conspiracy plot is not utterly typical of contemporary sci-fi is patently absurd (see the Illuminatus! Trilogy as a starting reference point).

I strongly suggest you go and read the work of prominent postmodernists such as Baudrillard or McLuhan, and if you think you have a firm grasp on their ideas, come back and discuss them in relation to MGS2, Deus Ex, or any other game to which you think such theories may apply. If not, just stick to William Gibson and Philip K. Dick (not that there would be anything wrong with that).

I agree about the lack of consequence to your actions in Oblivion, and I could name a hundred other shortcomings too. The depth I referred to was in the gameplay mechanics. The stats system was thorough and I have never played a game with a deeper alchemy (or equivalent) system. But this isn't a thread to discuss the ins and outs of good RPG design, so I will put the kibosh on that particular line of argument right now.

@ billy07
"If you told your philosophy professor at college you want to learn all the basics in the shortest amount possible from the thinnest book he'd laugh at you. Most philosophy books are 500 pages or more."

Nietszche said: "It is my ambition to say in ten sentences what other men say in whole books — what other men do not say in whole books."

@ Profcrab
To be fair, the ideas touched upon in MGS2 are more complex and intellectually demanding than anything found in The Republic. That's the advantage of an extra 2400 years of civilisation!