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Forums - Politics Discussion - More Americans died in Chicago than in the Iraq & Afghanistan wars combined

Australia had a similar problem before they banned guns.



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VGPolyglot said:
Aura7541 said:

They'll use them when necessary (e.g. someone charging at an officer with a knife). JRPGfan makes a valid point because guns have range. Physical weapons have limited range that requires an attacker to get in close vincinity to cause harm.

They don't just shoot people running at them, they also shoot at people running away from them.

 http://www.dailymail.co.uk/video/news/video-1173602/GRAPHIC-Charleston-cop-fatally-shoots-man-runs-away.html

And even if most cops don't do it, many black people will still know that it does happen and will be scared and instinctively try to flee.

You provided a report showing one cop shooting a person running away. 'They' is plural. Why do I have to go over this again?

You also made the same mistake of making a generalization from a single incident. Prove to me that the cited incident is representative of what the police does in general.



The best way to combat this problem is by giving life sentences to anyone who tries willingly to kill someone. Also, make everyone in jail do manual labor to pay for their stay in jail so tax payers won't feel the burden.



Snoopy said:
JRPGfan said:

If someone is dumb enough to charge a police officer with a knife, they can shoot them in the leg, shoulder ect.

If someone has a gun to pull on a police officer, that guy has no choice but to shoot to kill (its self defense for the cop).

 

By non police not haveing weapons, police leathal shootings would go way down.

I believe it is illegal for cops to shoot someone without the intent to kill. If the cop shoots the criminal just to injure him, the criminal will be able to sue the cop for medical expense. 

That cant be right...



Aura7541 said:
VGPolyglot said:

They don't just shoot people running at them, they also shoot at people running away from them.

 http://www.dailymail.co.uk/video/news/video-1173602/GRAPHIC-Charleston-cop-fatally-shoots-man-runs-away.html

And even if most cops don't do it, many black people will still know that it does happen and will be scared and instinctively try to flee.

You provided a report showing one cop shooting a person running away. 'They' is plural. Why do I have to go over this again?

You also made the same mistake of making a generalization from a single incident. Prove to me that the cited incident is representative of what the police does in general.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/video/news/video-1153570/Cop-fatally-shoots-man-running-away.html

There, I gave you another example. So now it's plural. And did you read the end of my phrase? I mentioned most cops not doing it, but blacks know that there are some cops that do it, and blacks know that, so when they see police they might panic and generally act in a different way than they normally would, and of course that could cause the police officer to panic as well, and when they have a gun they're probably going to use that as it's the most lethal.



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Snoopy said:
The best way to combat this problem is by giving life sentences to anyone who tries willingly to kill someone. Also, make everyone in jail do manual labor to pay for their stay in jail so tax payers won't feel the burden.

Slavery is legal for prisoners, so I'm pretty sure that already happens.



Nogamez said:
Kerotan said:

Take the guns off them too.  From the very creation of the American state neither regular Street police or citizens should have been allowed guns.  

 

Works in ireland.  I pity what America has become. 

Works In  Ireland? u mm my what about like the IRA and shit?

The IRA is at war with Britain as it stakes a claim on 6 of the 32 irish counties.  If Britain was still occupying part of the USA, I can guarantee you'd have something like the IRA too.  

 

In the south of Ireland where Britain has no control cops don't carry guns and neither does your average civilian. And as a result we have very few gun related murders.  The vast majority of murders are drug gangs killing other drug gang members. 



VGPolyglot said:
Aura7541 said:

You provided a report showing one cop shooting a person running away. 'They' is plural. Why do I have to go over this again?

You also made the same mistake of making a generalization from a single incident. Prove to me that the cited incident is representative of what the police does in general.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/video/news/video-1153570/Cop-fatally-shoots-man-running-away.html

There, I gave you another example. So now it's plural. And did you read the end of my phrase? I mentioned most cops not doing it, but blacks know that there are some cops that do it, and blacks know that, so when they see police they might panic and generally act in a different way than they normally would, and of course that could cause the police officer to panic as well, and when they have a gun they're probably going to use that as it's the most lethal.

Again with the generalizations, this time referring to blacks. There are blacks who comply with the police and nothing happens. How do you quantify how many blacks actually feel the way you describe?

Secondly, if someone is running away, the officer is less likely going to panic because in this context, the one running away is not the aggressor. This is different in a scenario where a person charges at an officer with a knife, where the knife wielder is indeed the aggressor. There are also rules that prohibit officers from exercising excessive force and if excessive force does occur, then that officer will be put to court.



Seihaku said:

Chicago overall isn't really the issue either, it's just a part of Chicago.

If you look at only intentional murders, the US averages 3.9 murders per 100,000 people, Germany  averages about 0.9 per 100,000, roughly 12,250 in the US per year vs. 716 in Germany per year.  There were more murders in Chicago last year than in all of Germany for the same period. The "No Go" zones in Europe are overblown, roughly the equivalant of walking through a slum or ghetto in the US but generally with fewer muggings.

Chicago's murder rate is 15.65 per 100,000. My city is roughly 11.5, Los Angeles is currently at 6 per 100,000 down from 35.2 per 100,000 in 1980.

New Orleans had a murder rate of 57.6 per 100,000 recently. St. Louis and Detroit's murder rates are 50 per 100,000. Baltimore is at 49 per 100,000. 

People like to focus on Chicago since it's a "no gun zone" and the sheer overall numbers, but of course that's like living in a dry county and being able to drive 10 minutes to buy beer in the neighboring county. Kinda pointless.

First off, there are 3 main parts to Chicago (north, south, west).  But what you fail to point out (or know) is that its heavily segregated .  To try and illustrate, NYC has bouroughs, & Chicago has "sides".  Being a segregated city, crime is not sprinkled evenly throughout, the vast majority of crimes occur in 2/3 of the areas, the west & southsides (always been like that), which constitute about 40% population wise.  So the northside is faiirly safe and population makes up about 60%.  Then you have downtown where its relatively  safe as well).  

To the outsider,  crime RATE wont look as bad because it includes the northside to bring those numbers down.  But again, its a segregated city so its really bad in concentrated areas.  The southside of Chicago (750k population,) is pretty much comparable to Detroit, the west side comparable to New orleans (480k) so thats 1.2 mil out of 2.7 tot.  These are the danger zones.

http://www.chicagonow.com/chicago-muckrakers/2010/06/if-chicagos-west-and-south-sides-were-their-own-cities-theyd-be-the-deadliest-and-most-violent-in-america/



If civilians had to give up their guns, it only makes sense police would have to as well.