I love how you're just intentionally ignoring the reason as to why all of this is happening, even though you know exactly why that is lol.

When the situation in a market (in this case, the Japanese game market, and home consoles especially so) changes, so does the expectations and thus the bar for what's a "success". However I do sorta still agree with you in that beating the Wii U isn't Sony's bar for succes, but rather to not be too much down from the PS3. However seeing as it's likely gonna do both, we can call the PS4 a success. Not a massive success though, that would be more along the lines of reinvigorating the Japanese home console market, but we all know that ain't gonna happen.

Good reply.  And I like the sound of the predictions you described here.  Far more reasonable than the ultra negative gaf "experts". 

Sony have managed to get a ton of games in the pipeline along with titles like KH3 and DQ11. I definitely wouldn't say they ain't trying.  

I know they did a lot wrong with the ps3 but it was coming off the ps2 so I believe if they launched that like they did the ps4 it would have sold 13/14m instead of 4m. 

Each gen has different market standards and I definitely think selling 8-10m this gen is a success for a home console in the mobile dominated Japan.  

I agree with most of that but How can you say ps3 was at its upper limit and the Wii at its lower.

The Wii was a once off fad that people got bored of and moved on. they could be still releasing titles for it to this day but it wouldn't do much better.

The ps3 was horribly priced and could never reach lows anywhere near the ps2. If they developed the thing properly they could have gotten it much lower and sold a ton more.

I just can't accept that. Regarding catering for an older audience, it's hard. The tastes of a gamer is the same at 16, 26 or 36. The problem is a lot of teenagers just stop gaming in their 20's or 30's because they have more important things to be doing like working, raising kids, socialising, gym, sports etc. you can't reasonably expect them to remain gamers.

I just noticed that the ps4 & Wii U both sold more this week than the x1 has lifetime. the Wii U also did this last week.

It's really hard to fathom how bad the x1 is doing there. Especially when the 360 did alright.

From Okami over @gaf
Using Dengeki, on the 53 week long calendar year, there were 36.320.279 retail games sold in Japan, breaking it by platform.
3DS: 18.343.250
PSV: 5.211.540
PS4: 4.748.746
PS3: 4.211.542
WIU: 3.723.025
XB1: 82.176

PSP and Wii both moved more software than the Xbox One this year, in fact, that system has sold less than 200k units of software since it's release.

Everyone else is doing graphs, so.
https://i.imgur.com/NpOtiM6.png

Also, the biggest publishers of the year should be something like this.

Nintendo
Bandai Namco
Capcom
Level 5
Square Enix
SCE
Konami
Pokémon Co.
SEGA
Koei Tecmo
Nintendo is the largest publisher of the year by a pretty large margin, they sold over 3m units more than Bandai Namco, maybe even twice as much.

No, some of you want to see the wii like a console that sold only to soccer moms that played Wii sorts for a week and they forgot about it, but thats because some of you just dont want to recognise that Nintendo won. I may have to remember you that wii sold: 

-2007: 16.5m
-2008: 24 m
-2009: 21m
-2010: 17m
 

The console was selling like a beast 4 consecutive years, Ps3 and Xb360 never reached those highs in all their lifes, so much for being a "fad", and even when the console went down in 2011, it still sold more than WiiU in all its life, if the interest for the console was so short, then how the hell was selling more than Ps4 even on its 4th year? And how they sold +10 m of units on its lowest year before its succesor? Sounds just like excuses to me.

The Wii had a solid hardcore userbase but the majority of it was there for the 3/4 years of motion control fad.  That's gone and you see what's left with the Wii.  About 15m users.  

My point is that the Wii in Japan most certainly didn't sell to the minimum of its potential and the ps3 definitely did.  

Um are you serious right now? Please tell me you're not serious. I don't even know where to start with this messed up logic. Are you really counting the first 3-4 years as Motion control fad and saying that the 15M after were the ones who cared, in other words when the console was at its end is when the people who wanted it for the "hardcore" games picked it up? i'm sorry but this argument does not hold up and it never will.

Isn't it ironic how you claimed I was missing someone's point and now you're missing mine.

I'm not talking about the 15m Wii's that were sold after the mass market got bored of motion controls, I'm talking about the 15m Wii U's that will be sold this gen. I know a million or two likely still wanted the gimmicky motion games but most of the Wii U install base are core Nintendo gamers.  

So yeah once you eliminate everyone who jumped on the bandwagon for the motion thing you're not left with a huge core gamer install base. 

this argument is also flawed. Wii U selling poorly has nothing to do with Mass market getting bored of mtion controls. Nintendo and their terrible marketing, ton of gaming droughts among other things was why its selling at its current pace. This logic makes no sense dude.