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Forums - Gaming - Will the new Apple TV be the PS4's only real challenger this gen?

KBG29 on 12 September 2015
xl-klaudkil said:

...okej.

 

Consoles are doomed!!!!!

Sorry if it souded that way, but I am far from a doom say on consoles and handhelds. I am trying to wake up the people that care about gaming, and get them to fight. I think consoles and handhelds can be among the most popular devices on the market. The problem right now, is people have a stupidly narrow view of what a console should do. If people start taking advantage of everything the consoles offer, then SMN can start to court more devs to bring content to the platforms. That is why Microsoft had such a multimedia push with XBO, and Sony is rapidly expanding PlayStation Network with PlayStation Vue, PlayStation Music, PlayStation Video, PlayStation Now, Remote Play, Share Play, etc. If these consoles are going to survive they have to convience people to keep them on all the time like a PC, a TV Box, or a Smartphone.

 The reason Apple is a theat, is because they are entering the market from that angle. They are selling the Apple TV as a device that you do everything on your TV with, and Apple fans will go along with it. Once that train starts rolling, Google will come with its Android me too devices, and google fans are the same, they welcome more to their devices. For some reason gamers are the only demographic that is willing to kill their own products in an effort to limit their value and appeal.



Stop hate, let others live the life they were given. Everyone has their problems, and no one should have to feel ashamed for the way they were born. Be proud of who you are, encourage others to be proud of themselves. Learn, research, absorb everything around you. Nothing is meaningless, a purpose is placed on everything no matter how you perceive it. Discover how to love, and share that love with everything that you encounter. Help make existence a beautiful thing.

Kevyn B Grams
10/03/2010 

KBG29 on PSN&XBL

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Soundwave on 12 September 2015
KBG29 said:
Soundwave said:


What's wrong with getting a source for actual numbers? You guys are saying Apple TV is a niche device, yet it's already selling 6-7 million/year even before this new model, that's way ahead of the Wii U and on par with the XBox One already. That's just a fact. If you don't like it, get angry at uh ... the facts. 

Apple isn't rich anymore. They were rich 10 years ago. What they are now is so far beyond that, they are quite likely the most profitable business in the world outside of the major banks. They could start their own country and that country would be wealthier than like 3/4ths of the nation states on the planet. 

They have the best marketing of any company too. If Apple really wanted to make a console, I think you're kidding yourself too if you don't think every third party and their grandma wouldn't jump to support it. Look at how much support the iOS ecosystem is getting without Apple even lifting a finger to try. If they had a board meeting and said "gaming is now our big priority, do everything to win the gaming market", of course they could be competetive. 

Nintendo and MS right now are just shitting the bed as is in the console market and would be easy targets, Sony would be a little tougher, but Sony is like a pitbull with no teeth when you remove the third party advantage from them and outmarket them ... all bark, no bite. 

At least one person is looking at this for what it is. Yeah, this doesn't compete head on with consoles, but smartphones never competed with handhelds either, and look what happened. I am with you on this one Soundwave. Apple may not be not be going right at PlayStation, Xbox, and Nintendo, but they sure as hell are coming in at a 45' angle. 

If Sony, Microsoft, and Nintendo don't react, and gamers keep on insisting PS4/XBO/WiiU are just for games history will repeat itself. Apple will win over too big of a market, and the casual crowd will abandon the traditional game console and AAA market. Once they Score Call of Duty, Madden, Fifa, GTA, and the likes, the "I only game on my consoles/handhelds" crowd will have killed another gaming platform.  

If people honestly think that the very potential future where you can get everything available on iOS + traditional console/PC 3rd party games is not a threat to PS4 and XBO, I don't even know what planet they live on anymore. 

Gamers need to realise this. If you don't start taking your gaming devices serious, and using them to browse the web, buy and stream digital content, make phone calls, check e-mail, and all the other stuff everyone has flocked to phones for, then all of this is going to go away. 3rd parties are not going to support a PlayStation, Xbox, or Nintendo product if it can't sell 10M units. Look at what happened already, and choose wisely. Stick with iOS and Android for everything outside of gaming, and you are asking for a future of free to play, pay to win, and money sucking streamed games.

Mind you I'm not saying "consolez r doomed" either lol. 

I'm just responding to the idea that this is some niche device ... it's not. It already sells on par with the XBox One and way ahead of the Wii U. So if this is a niche product, then so are 2/3 of the home consoles. 

That and the idea that Apple some how fears Sony/MS/Nintendo ... that I seriously, seriously doubt. Apple just doesn't care about them. 

AppleTV is obviously not trying to compete head on with the Playstation/XBox. So people can lower their defence force shields a bit. That said, it's not terribly difficult to see where future revisions of this product could go. The A8 processor is alright, but an A9X or a future A10 processor would likely let an AppleTV run extremely high end games, and if they open up to more Bluetooth controller support then basically you'll be able to use any controller you feel like. 

 



Michelasso on 12 September 2015

As I wrote already Apple TV 4 isn't a "threat" (yet). But things may change with Apple TV 5. My feeling is that Apple is anticipating what will be the next video games consoles generation. That thing of allowing a maximum size of 200MB for the core of the applications in a device that must be always connected by its own nature, where everything else is cached is smart. With a minimum 32GB mass storage the Apple TV can't compete with the modern consoles. It simply doesn't have the space (nor the specs) to run some (most?) AAA games.

But sure it will have its space in many living rooms. Some people may buy it out of curiosity to finally own an iOS device without selling a kidney. Others to play their iTunes music and videos. Unlike the PS4 and XB1 it won't waste dozens/hundreds of kWh just to watch movies.

About games, what looks great on a 5" screen may look like crap on the larger televisions. But it has plenty of RPGs and RPGs have never been really about graphics. Plus it has all the small idiotic but addictive games for cheap, if not for free. But it won't have Bloodborne. Or FF XV. :D

To me Apple TV and consoles can peacefully coexist today. In a couple of years it will be another story, though.



Hynad on 12 September 2015
Soundwave said:
Hynad said:
Soundwave said:


Yet the AppleTV is already crushing Wii U sales since 2012 and selling about on par with the XBox One. And this is with the old model and Apple barely supporting it/throwing any marketing behind it. 

It's not a threat to Sony because it's clearly not going after the same audience, but saying it's a niche device is just stupid. It very easily could end up outselling the XBox One and it will certainly outsell the Wii U easily. 


http://appleinsider.com/articles/14/04/23/apple-announces-20m-apple-tvs-sold-since-debut

20M units sold since its debut in 2007, as of april 2014.

http://recode.net/2015/01/27/apple-tv-hasnt-changed-in-years-but-has-sold-25-million-units-anyway/

25M units as of January 2015.

25M units in 8 years. I call that a niche product. 

Again per NeoGaf:


Apple TV estimated shipments - ZhugeEX
2007- 0.3 million
2008- 0.3 million
2009- 0.7 million
2010- 1.6 million (REV2)
2011- 2.8 million
2012- 6.5 million (REV3)
2013- 7.0 million
2014- 6.0 million

 

From 2012 and the REV3 model introduction you can see a huge surge in Apple TV sales. It was a niche product early in its life span when Apple kinda just threw it out on the market, but it's definitely been gaining momentum in the last three years and this new model could certainly push its sales higher than the 6-7 million/range. 

In which case it would be well beyond the Wii U and on par/better than the XBox One. 

I suspect from now on Apple will be pushing this product more and marketing it more heavily too. It is key to their long term aspirations for an Apple subscription based TV service that's supposed to launch next year. 

This device could easily be selling 8-9 million/year going forward, which does certainly put in the discussion of being the 2nd best selling TV game platform whether people on this board like it or not. 

Thanks for the more civil reply. Now you understand a little better. I don' t comment often on here. But when I do, I don't take anything out of my ass.


Yeah, I noticed the surge in sales. And all the better to Apple, because even if they make closed environments, they are freaking smooth to use and hassle free (mostly). That being said, Apple TV gaining some momentum lately doesn't translate necessarily to long lasting longevity. Especially is the tech world we have the chance to live in.



Hynad on 12 September 2015
Michelasso said:

As I wrote already Apple TV 4 isn't a "threat" (yet). But things may change with Apple TV 5. My feeling is that Apple is anticipating what will be the next video games consoles generation. That thing of allowing a maximum size of 200MB for the core of the applications in a device that must be always connected by its own nature, where everything else is cached is smart. With a minimum 32GB mass storage the Apple TV can't compete with the modern consoles. It simply doesn't have the space (nor the specs) to run some (most?) AAA games.

But sure it will have its space in many living rooms. Some people may buy it out of curiosity to finally own an iOS device without selling a kidney. Others to play their iTunes music and videos. Unlike the PS4 and XB1 it won't waste dozens/hundreds of kWh just to watch movies.

About games, what looks great on a 5" screen may look like crap on the larger televisions. But it has plenty of RPGs and RPGs have never been really about graphics. Plus it has all the small idiotic but addictive games for cheap, if not for free. But it won't have Bloodborne. Or FF XV. :D

To me Apple TV and consoles can peacefully coexist today. In a couple of years it will be another story, though.


They will coexist. In that eventually we will buy All in One  (thank you Microsoft =P) products that will incorporate everything that goes through a wire to your home.

Before that time comes, no, Apple TV won't be a threat to anything. 

See you in what, ten year?



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gabzjmm23 on 12 September 2015

Not this version of Apple TV.



HoloDust on 12 September 2015
KBG29 said:

If Sony, Microsoft, and Nintendo don't react, and gamers keep on insisting PS4/XBO/WiiU are just for games history will repeat itself. Apple will win over too big of a market, and the casual crowd will abandon the traditional game console and AAA market. Once they Score Call of Duty, Madden, Fifa, GTA, and the likes, the "I only game on my consoles/handhelds" crowd will have killed another gaming platform.  

If people honestly think that the very potential future where you can get everything available on iOS + traditional console/PC 3rd party games is not a threat to PS4 and XBO, I don't even know what planet they live on anymore.


In order to do that they'll have to release product that has similar specs as MSony and has standard controller - which means they need to enter console market. AAA publishers will not bother putting their major IPs on new undepowered device with bad controls and finicky casual audience - they already have that in mobile.

As for future, streaming games home console generations, sure, Apple will probably enter the market in some way, but again I think they need some standard device that competes head to head with others and not some TV device with remote if they want to attract core audience. Otherwise, they're left with casuals, and that's really not the same market.



Nintyfan90 on 13 September 2015
Soundwave said:
Nintyfan90 said:

Thats the best you could come up with? Their rich? Who gives a damn? Apple wouldn't be a hurdle for any of them lol. But keep dreaming and I love that a message board is your source.


What's wrong with getting a source for actual numbers? You guys are saying Apple TV is a niche device, yet it's already selling 6-7 million/year even before this new model, that's way ahead of the Wii U and on par with the XBox One already. That's just a fact. If you don't like it, get angry at uh ... the facts. 

Apple isn't rich anymore. They were rich 10 years ago. What they are now is so far beyond that, they are quite likely the most profitable business in the world outside of the major banks. They could start their own country and that country would be wealthier than like 3/4ths of the nation states on the planet. 

They have the best marketing of any company too. If Apple really wanted to make a console, I think you're kidding yourself too if you don't think every third party and their grandma wouldn't jump to support it. Look at how much support the iOS ecosystem is getting without Apple even lifting a finger to try. If they had a board meeting and said "gaming is now our big priority, do everything to win the gaming market", of course they could be competetive. 

Nintendo and MS right now are just shitting the bed as is in the console market and would be easy targets, Sony would be a little tougher, but Sony is like a pitbull with no teeth when you remove the third party advantage from them and outmarket them ... all bark, no bite. 

Neogaf is your source lol and please end this Apple nonsense. You realize they don't sell the most phones and are getting destroyed by Google and Microsoft respectively lol. How many more people have Android for smartphones or Microsoft for Laptops/computers? Get real dude and get off the wagon. 3rd parties support more than just Apple. 



beeje13 on 13 September 2015

Why would you play a mobile game on a big screen?

And that's a TV remote with gesture control to replace swiping on a touchscreen. Many LG and Samsung premium TVs have similar smart remotes.

For Apple it's easy to make their games run on the box if it runs iOS, so why not enable it?



PS, PS2, Gameboy Advance, PS3, PSP, PS4, Xbox One

Soundwave on 13 September 2015
Nintyfan90 said:
Soundwave said:


What's wrong with getting a source for actual numbers? You guys are saying Apple TV is a niche device, yet it's already selling 6-7 million/year even before this new model, that's way ahead of the Wii U and on par with the XBox One already. That's just a fact. If you don't like it, get angry at uh ... the facts. 

Apple isn't rich anymore. They were rich 10 years ago. What they are now is so far beyond that, they are quite likely the most profitable business in the world outside of the major banks. They could start their own country and that country would be wealthier than like 3/4ths of the nation states on the planet. 

They have the best marketing of any company too. If Apple really wanted to make a console, I think you're kidding yourself too if you don't think every third party and their grandma wouldn't jump to support it. Look at how much support the iOS ecosystem is getting without Apple even lifting a finger to try. If they had a board meeting and said "gaming is now our big priority, do everything to win the gaming market", of course they could be competetive. 

Nintendo and MS right now are just shitting the bed as is in the console market and would be easy targets, Sony would be a little tougher, but Sony is like a pitbull with no teeth when you remove the third party advantage from them and outmarket them ... all bark, no bite. 

Neogaf is your source lol and please end this Apple nonsense. You realize they don't sell the most phones and are getting destroyed by Google and Microsoft respectively lol. How many more people have Android for smartphones or Microsoft for Laptops/computers? Get real dude and get off the wagon. 3rd parties support more than just Apple. 


The AppleTV numbers are accurate, sorry if you don't like them. 

Apple has larger cash reserves than Google and Microsoft combined, and they account for 90% of all profit from the smartphone market, so who is "destroying" who again? Android phones are made by 1000 different manufacturers, it should have high overall marketshare simply because there's like a hundred different models which are cheap and subsidized (read: free) in many developing countries. 

But even then the iPhone had its highest sales ever this past year.