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Forums - Gaming - Microsoft Mocks Sony With "Destiny Fragrance"

starcraft said:
binary solo said:

You're displaying an uncharacteristic ignorance. Destiny is a trademarked (or copyrighted) name for the FPS game that is Destiny. That means the only people who can use Destiny to promote the Destiny game are those to whom Acti gives permission. MS was not given permission, hence MS infringed on Acti/Bungie's trademark/copyright. You don't need to see an exclusive advertising contract to know this, you simply need to know what a dev/publisher typically copyrights and trademarks about the games they publish/make. Pretty basic stuff really. So MS didn't find an innovative way around the advertising arrangment because they actually broke the law in what they did. You should stop trying to claim they did, because that's perpetuation false information and as a mod you should not be doing that, especially by, at the same time, claiming people are being salty about something that MS actually did wrong. Mods have warned people in other threads about calling people salty, so I think it's pretty off for a mod to be using the term even if it's addressed to a general "@ others" rather than a specific person.

Only going to respond to one of you!

Of those who have responded to me, including yourself, I am the only one that appears not to have drawn a conclusion from zero information. I would think very little about that is ignorant. Multiple people in this thread have speculated ridiculously, including the absurd notion that Activision might attempt to sue Microsoft for this brief advertisement.

People always seem to assume rank stupidity in the actions of major games companies, as though they don't spend millions of dollars retaining highly intelligent people to orchestrate their campaigns. Let me be clear. I am fully aware that this advertisement could, conceivably, be considered a violation of an agreement between Sony and Activision - I am saying that in this instance, it would be irrelevant. There is zero certainty that a specific *written* agreement exists between Activision and Microsoft forbidding advertising of Destiny. But lets say, for a moment, that it does. What exactly do you think are the ramifications of this violation (which Microsoft would have known the ins and outs of far better than we do)? Activision has almost *no* incentive to enforce their rights, as Microsoft is advertising their game. Sony will know better than to take public action and appear petty. And Microsoft has, for the cost of perhaps 1 hour's graphic design work, and an hour's legal consultation, generated huge discussion online about the fact Destiny is on their platform. The argument one *might* make is that Microsoft risks damaging their relationship with Activision if Sony has a go at Activision over this privately. But thats something we have even less information on than the legal ramifcations of this action.
Technical written civil law is only as effective as it is enforceable, and only enforceable where there is an economic incentive to do so. As you said, pretty basic stuff really.
As for salty. The reason I used inflection marks is precisely because people have inanely used the word previously in this thread. We're in agreement on its uselessness - but reading back I didn't make that sufficiently clear, sorry.

What he's saying it that you can break the law without breaking any agreement. Activision owns the game, its copyright and commercial rights.

I also can't see a reason for Sony not to put a pressure on Activision to sue MS, so that's not a "if". They paid for the ad exclusivity, they didn't get it.



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starcraft said:
binary solo said:
starcraft said:
wary-wallaroo said:
Haha, wow. Stop trying to make this happen MS, it's not going to happen.

You realize it is happening right? The game is multiplatform.

@ others in this thread.

Microsoft has made a joke. Maybe you find it funny, maybe you don't. Irrespective it is indicative of a sense of humour, talent for marketing, and the ongoing attempt by all players to promote their wares.

Unless someone wants to present information on contracts between Activision and Microsoft or Sony and Microsoft that indicates this is in some way a violation, lets stop being 'salty' that Microsoft has found an innovative way around Sony's paid arrangement with Activision. I am sure that Microsoft consulted its team of very expensive lawyers in formulating this campaign.

You're displaying an uncharacteristic ignorance. Destiny is a trademarked (or copyrighted) name for the FPS game that is Destiny. That means the only people who can use Destiny to promote the Destiny game are those to whom Acti gives permission. MS was not given permission, hence MS infringed on Acti/Bungie's trademark/copyright. You don't need to see an exclusive advertising contract to know this, you simply need to know what a dev/publisher typically copyrights and trademarks about the games they publish/make. Pretty basic stuff really. So MS didn't find an innovative way around the advertising arrangment because they actually broke the law in what they did. You should stop trying to claim they did, because that's perpetuation false information and as a mod you should not be doing that, especially by, at the same time, claiming people are being salty about something that MS actually did wrong. Mods have warned people in other threads about calling people salty, so I think it's pretty off for a mod to be using the term even if it's addressed to a general "@ others" rather than a specific person.

Let me be clear. I am fully aware that this advertisement could, conceivably, be considered a violation of an agreement between Sony and Activision - I am saying that in this instance, it would be irrelevant. There is zero certainty that a specific *written* agreement exists between Activision and Microsoft forbidding advertising of Destiny. But lets say, for a moment, that it does. What exactly do you think are the ramifications of this violation (which Microsoft would have known the ins and outs of far better than we do)? Activision has almost *no* incentive to enforce their rights, as Microsoft is advertising their game. 

"Oh, they certainly care.  Not necessarily as it pertains to Destiny but rather to the nature of exclusive contracts.

Let's say that part of your business model is to sell exclusive advertising contracts to various vendors.  If a loophole is found that circumvents the very nature of those agreements, why would anyone pay for them in the future?  If nothing is done, the client being wronged would be angry and would undoubtedly turn to similar tactics in the future.  You would lose a revenue stream as well as the appearance that you are in control of your own intellectual property.  "

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=6650575

 

I couldn't have said it better.



LurkerJ said:
starcraft said:

Let me be clear. I am fully aware that this advertisement could, conceivably, be considered a violation of an agreement between Sony and Activision - I am saying that in this instance, it would be irrelevant. There is zero certainty that a specific *written* agreement exists between Activision and Microsoft forbidding advertising of Destiny. But lets say, for a moment, that it does. What exactly do you think are the ramifications of this violation (which Microsoft would have known the ins and outs of far better than we do)? Activision has almost *no* incentive to enforce their rights, as Microsoft is advertising their game. 

"Oh, they certainly care.  Not necessarily as it pertains to Destiny but rather to the nature of exclusive contracts.

Let's say that part of your business model is to sell exclusive advertising contracts to various vendors.  If a loophole is found that circumvents the very nature of those agreements, why would anyone pay for them in the future?  If nothing is done, the client being wronged would be angry and would undoubtedly turn to similar tactics in the future.  You would lose a revenue stream as well as the appearance that you are in control of your own intellectual property.  "

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=6650575

I couldn't have said it better.

I'll take your word on the bolded.

Which is unfortunate, as what you've quoted doesn't attempt to negate the vast majority of what I have said...



starcraft - Playing Games = FUN, Talking about Games = SERIOUS

starcraft said:

I'll take your word on the bolded.

Which is unfortunate, as what you've quoted doesn't attempt to negate the vast majority of what I have said...

Just because M$ is probably gonna get away with what they did, doesn't make what they did okay....

 



starcraft said:
LurkerJ said:
starcraft said:
 

Let me be clear. I am fully aware that this advertisement could, conceivably, be considered a violation of an agreement between Sony and Activision - I am saying that in this instance, it would be irrelevant. There is zero certainty that a specific *written* agreement exists between Activision and Microsoft forbidding advertising of Destiny. But lets say, for a moment, that it does. What exactly do you think are the ramifications of this violation (which Microsoft would have known the ins and outs of far better than we do)? Activision has almost *no* incentive to enforce their rights, as Microsoft is advertising their game. 

"Oh, they certainly care.  Not necessarily as it pertains to Destiny but rather to the nature of exclusive contracts.

Let's say that part of your business model is to sell exclusive advertising contracts to various vendors.  If a loophole is found that circumvents the very nature of those agreements, why would anyone pay for them in the future?  If nothing is done, the client being wronged would be angry and would undoubtedly turn to similar tactics in the future.  You would lose a revenue stream as well as the appearance that you are in control of your own intellectual property.  "

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=6650575

I couldn't have said it better.

I'll take your word on the bolded.

Which is unfortunate, as what you've quoted doesn't attempt to negate the vast majority of what I have said...

That's because the majority of what you said can be negated by common sense.



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DrDoomz said:
starcraft said:

I'll take your word on the bolded.

Which is unfortunate, as what you've quoted doesn't attempt to negate the vast majority of what I have said...

Just because M$ is probably gonna get away with what they did, doesn't make what they did okay....

Thats a different conversation entirely - and one on which I personally haven't quite made up my mind yet



starcraft - Playing Games = FUN, Talking about Games = SERIOUS

LurkerJ said:
starcraft said:
LurkerJ said:

"Oh, they certainly care.  Not necessarily as it pertains to Destiny but rather to the nature of exclusive contracts.

Let's say that part of your business model is to sell exclusive advertising contracts to various vendors.  If a loophole is found that circumvents the very nature of those agreements, why would anyone pay for them in the future?  If nothing is done, the client being wronged would be angry and would undoubtedly turn to similar tactics in the future.  You would lose a revenue stream as well as the appearance that you are in control of your own intellectual property.  "

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=6650575

I couldn't have said it better.

I'll take your word on the bolded.

Which is unfortunate, as what you've quoted doesn't attempt to negate the vast majority of what I have said...

That's because the majority of what you said can be negated by common sense.

That seems to be a way of saying you do not currently have a counter to what I am saying. Which is fine, not every point has to be argued down to minute details



starcraft - Playing Games = FUN, Talking about Games = SERIOUS

Honestly what they should do is just delay the xbox version one week to set a president on what can happen if you violate a publishers marketing deals in the future. This would appease Sony and stop crap like this from happening again. One week isn't much of a wait for gamers but Microsoft would feel it.



The only 'butthurt' I see is taking place in this thread.....



jnemesh said:

Advertising a brand that is trademarked by another company is acutally a violation of trademark LAW.  Since MS neither owns the trademark for the Destiny game NOR the fragrance, yes, they broke the law.  If you want to read up on the subject, I have a link below:

http://www.dmlp.org/legal-guide/using-name-or-likeness-another

Your point? Sony marketed Assassin's Creed, Nintendo marketd DQIX and Monster Hunter, and Microsoft markets other third party games.