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Forums - Gaming Discussion - Fire Emblem Mafia - Game Thread - Concluded

padib said:
theprof00 said:
Nicklesbe said:

Padib made it clear on the sign up page http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/thread.php?id=187811&page=3 and WoW also confirmed this on the following post and was very helpful with many answers explaining how the game works when I talked to them via PM. I'm still learning but I get the jist of it.

@sparks it's right here

Padib only says these two things in regards to the topic:
"Meanwhile, mafia players have their separate chat room (they are provided a link) in which they talk to each other to connive."
AND
"these players may be able to communicate in a separate room during game "day" and "night"."

Words instead says this:
" Scum automatically know that people not a part of their team are town ( usually )" keyword USUALLY

So, in response to my question of "How do you know mafia know each other"

He says Padib made it clear....but Padib never did. All Padib ever said was that mafia have their own chatroom, and that some kinds of players might be able to talk during the day.
And then says Words confirms it. Words is the only one that made a post specifically about how a mafia might know another mafia...yet doesn't actually confirm anything...just like a good mod should. ALl he says is that scum USUALLY know.

Then he says that BOTH padib and words were very helpful via PM.

Now, it's possible that he simply made a mistake and missed the keyword USUALLY, or maybe took the statement as a confirmation, justified by being a newb who isn't used to the intricasies of semantics in mafia....so I can't say it's a very good lead...but to me it was definitely suspicious. Especially that he was talking to someone in a pm. Not that it was talking outside the thread...but that we can't really confirm it less risking him breaking a rule and being modkilled.

I dunno what's worse, whether he didn't answer my question, or whether he's "really nervous about lynching innocent people"....he even said it twice.

But I digress. For now, I'm holding my FoS, not upgrading it. A possible explanation is that he's simply a noob. Like House says, everyone lies, everyone makes mistakes. Doesn't mean he's mafia. But, there are a lot of people who haven't contributed yet, and I'm interested in talking to them now instead of wasting my time overanalyzing this.

I agree with this. Nowhere in the sign-up thread was it mentioned that mafia can only talk at night.

Town tell from prof. Scum tell on you know who (if you're following).


It also never says whether or not they can talk during day and night, and it never clarifies whether or not communicaition with each other was considered a mafia action. Which is why I asked if that was the case.  



http://www.youtube.com/v/AoOOpLpcF28 http://www.youtube.com/v/CphFZGH5030

All Hail the Jester King. The King is back, and I am still a dirty girl prof ;)

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padib said:
Nicklesbe said:
Sparks said:

theprof00 said:
About the whole talking thing and nickels... you said he had a good response, but in actuality it was a bad one. He said it was confirmed by words in the signup, but the link actually shows words unconfirming what padib said

Lastly, and what I can't figure out yet, is that I asked him "how do you know mafia know each other". His response answered a different question. I never asked if they could talk, I asked if they knew each other.

Hmm, I just noticed how he mentioned that mafia could only talk to each other during the night here

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=6555691

even though it was never mentioned in the sign up thread like he alleged. (I just re-read the sign up thread. All padib and WoW say is that mafia have a separate chat room to connive).

 

Care to explain this, Nicklesbe? Big FOS in the meantime.

Wow said "You have no Night action unless you are Mafia / Scum or you have some sort of power role that allows action during the night." So I assumed that speaking at night was a mafia only action unless you had a power role. To me it would be unfair if they could do it during night or day but I wasn't sure which is why I asked if that was true or not becuase it never specifically said whether or not chatting at night qualified as a mafia action or not.

About this and the previous post, my only concern is that in your reply to prof after mentioning your PM to WoW, you said "Ah but wait nm just reread the sign up page and they can only talk at night right?"

So was that info in the PM or in the Sign up page? There are only two options:

1) You were scrambling to justify as townie and got lazy or

2) You were scrambling as mafia and got lazy.

haha XD

Also, about the post I'm quoting here, WoW's quote really doesn't refer to talking but to actions that can be performed either as scum or power role. So an action really doesn't refer to talking because a power role it's pretty clear that it doesn't (even just) talk. I gave examples of night actions in my post in the sign-up thread you refered to. An example was killing as vigiliante, another was "investigating" as cop.

But anyway, I think we've done zeroing in on you, let's let town talk freely.


You realize that is a question asking for clarification and understanding and not a statement of fact right? That question was based on the fact that WoW said "You have no Night action unless you are Mafia / Scum or you have some sort of power role that allows action during the night." It also never said anywhere that mafias ability to comminunicate in another chat which you said they had was considered a mafia action which I got the impression that only mafia actions could be done at night unless someone had a power role. So I asked for clarification.



http://www.youtube.com/v/AoOOpLpcF28 http://www.youtube.com/v/CphFZGH5030

All Hail the Jester King. The King is back, and I am still a dirty girl prof ;)

Also WoW never went over in PMs whether or not mafia being able to communicate with each other was an action or not or whether or not it could be done at night only or during the day. I had vague understanding of that subject based on Padib's apparent expertise on the subject. I see now tho I should have asked WoW instead of asking you guys because apparently being inexperienced and asking for more info, clarification, and understanding makes you an easy target.



http://www.youtube.com/v/AoOOpLpcF28 http://www.youtube.com/v/CphFZGH5030

All Hail the Jester King. The King is back, and I am still a dirty girl prof ;)

Nicklesbe said:

Actually I said WoW was very helpful and the only one I PM'd. Which I plainly said and you obviously misread.You were right tho I am new and I assumed from those two statements that they can work together. Especially since WoW said "Scum automatically know that people not a part of their team are town ( usually )" Which to me confirms that Mafia know each other and are on each others team aka can work together. I Also assume that "usually" has to do with WoW's statement that Mafia "usually" know who town are. Which could mean there is a third or fourth faction that's not town. I mean that's what it says in simple english.

Now you could either have incredibly poor reading comprehension since you misunderstood what that usually meant and completely misread my statement on who I pmed. Or you could be intententionally twisting the words of WoW and putting words in my mouth. Which to me makes you incredibly suspicious so consider this an official FOS. 

Actually, you MEANT, not said. be more careful about how you talk in mafia. Slight exaggerations like that lead to lynches pretty quickly when they're caught. I don't think it was your intent though.

I now see that you had some kind of thing about the word them. I'm sorry, but I'm 30, and since I was a kid, the correct usage has always been the twin usage "he or she".

If ANYONE calls, tell them...
If my new teacher calls, tell him or her...

Secondly, again, that statement doesn't tell us that mafia know each other NOW.

IF they can't talk to each other now, how do we know if they've even met? There are games wherein mafia don't know each other until night one starts. Some games start specifically with night zero in order to allow for this. Other games allow quick meeting beforehand despite no night 1. Some allow an experienced user to talk continuously as a "mentor" but do not allow other mafia to talk.

It's not my poor reading comprehension that's the problem here, it's that I'm overly anal about the specific use of words.



@nickels
I am really very interested to know about why you think talking during the night is an action.



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theprof00 said:
@nickels
I am really very interested to know about why you think talking during the night is an action.


I don't know if it's an action or not. It's not exactly been made clear. Why wouldn't it be an action? Speaking is an active movement and I assume you have to be around people in order to speak with them. I'm unsure if there are cell phones or walkie talkies in this world or not. If not then I think it would be difficult day or night to preform an action like investigating someone while they are busy talking with other people. So is it an action or isn't it? What I'm interested in knowing is why you and Padib keep treating my questions like they are statements of fact. Is it the tone? Are there not enough question marks? I get it you two obviously have a lot of experience.What I don't understand is if you guys were fellow townies why wouldn't you answer my questions and help me better understand why my understanding and assumptions have been wrong? Wouldn't that help the town? Instead ya both construe my inquiries treating them like factual statements and acting like apex predators going after a weak gazel. I find that incredibly suspicious.



http://www.youtube.com/v/AoOOpLpcF28 http://www.youtube.com/v/CphFZGH5030

All Hail the Jester King. The King is back, and I am still a dirty girl prof ;)

padib said:
Mr Khan said:
Anyone else have a dad in the military?

Speaking of military, why are bows so accurate?

Bows? Pfft. Who needs them? Too dangerous for my liking.



 

Here lies the dearly departed Nintendomination Thread.

Nicklesbe said:
theprof00 said:
@nickels
I am really very interested to know about why you think talking during the night is an action.


I don't know if it's an action or not. It's not exactly been made clear. Why wouldn't it be an action? Speaking is an active movement and I assume you have to be around people in order to speak with them. I'm unsure if there are cell phones or walkie talkies in this world or not. If not then I think it would be difficult day or night to preform an action like investigating someone while they are busy talking with other people. So is it an action or isn't it? What I'm interested in knowing is why you and Padib keep treating my questions like they are statements of fact. Is it the tone? Are there not enough question marks? I get it you two obviously have a lot of experience.What I don't understand is if you guys were fellow townies why wouldn't you answer my questions and help me better understand why my understanding and assumptions have been wrong? Wouldn't that help the town? Instead ya both construe my inquiries treating them like factual statements and acting like apex predators going after a weak gazel. I find that incredibly suspicious.

Just to explain a bit:

In line with my previous "comprehension fail", words and statements are important in mafia. Like...really important..because sometimes people hint about things, and sometimes they also make slips. A slip would be like if I ASSUMED that mafia could talk during the day. Now, SPECIFICALLY, this is important to look at with noobs, because a lot of the time noobs don't know that there are alternatives. A noob mafia who can talk during the day could assume that the ability to do so is simply an understood global rule. That would be a slip.

It's not conclusive, but it is worth investigating.

Similarly to the word them and that whole situation. For instance, I could perhaps interpret that when you said you pm'ed "them" you might have actually been saying that you were chatting in another thread, and instead using a pm for cover. There have been times myself when I have been in mafia and asked the mod a question in the mafia forum, and then in the game thread explained that I had PM'ed the mod. Now, the alternative is that you simply meant you ACTUALLY pm'd WoW, but since you included padib and used the word "them", it gave me an odd feeling like there was a group discussion going on, and you were simply covering the way a typical mafia would.

This is further complicated by padib now attacking you, which could be interpreted as distancing, ie, you're both mafia and padib is going after you because he feels you're a lynch candidate, knows you will turn up as mafia, and he wants people to think he's a good townie going after scum. It's just a possibility floating around there. There are maybe 3 possible reasons. Another possibility is that he's town going after what he thinks is a mafia. This may seem trivial and insignificant to you now, but later on in the game it will be important to remember who went after whom and for what and why. I'm personally glad he's coming forward, because he's establishing that connection. There are others who aren't posting at all. Those people concern me more.

Back to your questions.
1 I don't know if talking at night is an action. I don't know why you assumed it was. Do you think talking during the day is an action?
2 I'm treating your statements as fact because as described above, when someone asks a question about setup, then by deduction there is something that you know.
3 I'd prefer to find out what you know before I explain something to you. If you're feeling pressure, why would I alleviate that? Answering your questions doesn't help me find scum..cuz I don't actually know if you're town or not, and to be perfectly honest, if you're scum, then this whole post is only helping you hide yourself better.

Lastly, I understand your concern about padib and myself. I don't necessarily trust him either.



Lemme show you something

The red stands for accusations, the green stands for defending.

Can you guess who the mafia is here based on this picture? This is from a single day of posting during a game.



theprof00 said:
@nickels
I am really very interested to know about why you think talking during the night is an action.

It shouldn't be that hard to figure out. It's because he's a complete noob and is misunderstanding a lot of things. All this arguing is annoying. Nickles, town or mafia, has no idea what he's doing, even for a noob. That back and forth blathering on between you two is giving me a headache, but from what I could stand to read of it the boy has some honest questions and is clearly confused about a lot of things. The term "action" has a different context here that he doesn't seem to grasp. For the record, nickles, action isn't meant in it's literal everyday context in this game. In fact a lot of things can't just be taken at face value, that's why people like prof are being analytical about semantics. But seriously though, there's a lot of confusion here. I'm new to this too. What exactly is a "town tell"? I suppose he's suspicious though, so FOS for nicklesbe then.

 

But whatever, I'm sick of your semantics, I'm sick of your overanalysis, and I'm sick of your over eagerness to lynch someone. It's not only the first day, but it's barely been a day of real time and you've already accused enough people I'm losing track. You clearly have something to hide. Hand of suspicion to the prof00. Your behavior is simply too agressive. You're either a mafia trying to lead the lynch mob or you're a trigger happy fool with a silver tongue. Either way, I'm thinking the town might be better off without you.