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Forums - Gaming Discussion - really annoying thing that happens EVERY e3

spemanig said:
pokoko said:
"GAMERS WIN" is every bit as valid an opinion as anything else. It seems kind of silly to suggest that it is not. The only dispute would be with context and if it's relevant to the discussion at hand. If the question is, "who won E3," then it's fine. If the question is, "which company will see the most economic impact from their E3 presentation," then it is not.

Regardless, it seems an odd thing to get upset about, especially when so many people are over-exaggerating specific games simply because they're exclusive to their favorite platform. That's much more annoying than someone trying to be optimistic.


No it isn't. Gamers are not a candidate in the competition. Gamers don't win anything. They didn't compete. They didn't participate in the competition. They are not a factoring party, they are the judge. They are irrelevant to the question being asked. That's like asking "who won the dance off?" "The audience." No. The audience didn't compete. They're irrelevant to the question.

You seem to struggle with the concept of what is relative.  This really isn't hard.  If a question is open-ended, with no parameters set, then it can be answered different ways.  Still following?  As such, "who won the dance off" does not apply, as it that is a specific contest, while "E3" is not.  You understand?  E3 is an exposition intended for--that's right--consumers.  

Anyone asking "who won E3" without setting context is the one at fault if they don't get the answers they want.  Sony, From Software, Ubisoft, Nintendo, even Hello Games would all be valid responses.  That's because "who won E3" by itself is kind of stupid, as it's not an official contest.  As such, "won" could be considered anyone who came out in much better position than they were going in.



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pokoko said:

You seem to struggle with the concept of what is relative.  This really isn't hard.  If a question is open-ended, with no parameters set, then it can be answered different ways.  Still following?  As such, "who won the dance off" does not apply, as it that is a specific contest, while "E3" is not.  You understand?  E3 is an exposition intended for--that's right--consumers.  

Anyone asking "who won E3" without setting context is the one at fault if they don't get the answers they want.  Sony, From Software, Ubisoft, Nintendo, even Hello Games would all be valid responses.  That's because "who won E3" by itself is kind of stupid, as it's not an official contest.  As such, "won" could be considered anyone who came out in much better position than they were going in.


You seem to think that "who won E3?" is an open ended question. It's not. There are parameters set. They are implied. No one needs to say "out of Sony, Microsoft, and Nintendo" for people to understand the context of the question being asked. Anyone who answers "gamers" to the question "who won E3" is being a smart ass. They completely understand the real question being asked and completely understand that "gamers" is not an applicable answer.

E3, in the context of the question being asked, is a competition intended to grab the attention of the--that's right--consumers. They are the audience and the companies are the performers competing for the consumers' favor. It is a specific contest in the implied context of the question. Just like "who won the dance off" is.

Anyone hearing "who won E3" without understanding the context is a braindead idiot. Everyone knows the context. People just choose to use a smartass answer that doesn't apply because they don't agree with the premise behind the question.

But you know all that.



Dude, just don't overthink other people's opinion so much, there's always people who like and think different things; another annoying thing that happens every E3 is that fanboys will say that their console of choice won no matter how bad the conference was or how good the one from the competition was, some other people will tell you that consoles suck and PC is the way to go. Others like the one you mention just like a lot of stuff and are happy to have an event where there's a bunch of new stuff so to them "everyone wins", I guess it's annoying to see this every year, but I think you're just focusing on one of the many stances gamers usually take,there will always be people with different views.



spemanig said:


You seem to think that "who won E3?" is an open ended question. It's not. There are parameters set. They are implied. No one needs to say "out of Sony, Microsoft, and Nintendo" for people to understand the context of the question being asked. Anyone who answers "gamers" to the question "who won E3" is being a smart ass. They completely understand the real question being asked and completely understand that "gamers" is not an applicable answer.

E3, in the context of the question being asked, is a competition intended to grab the attention of the--that's right--consumers. They are the audience and the companies are the performers competing for the consumers' favor. It is a specific contest in the implied context of the question. Just like "who won the dance off" is.

Anyone hearing "who won E3" without understanding the context is a braindead idiot. Everyone knows the context. People just choose to use a smartass answer that doesn't apply because they don't agree with the premise behind the question.

But you know all that.

That's ridiculous.  It's child logic to think something is implied when it clearly is not.  "Who won E3" could easily mean "who had the best game" or "which company will make the most money (Activision)."  Simple logic would tell you to be specific with your question.  It's really, really not difficult, you know?  It's like that silly argument that breaks out when someone makes a thread about "exclusives" without bothering to specify that they mean "console exclusives".  The burden is on the person who asks the question.  Seriously, how hard is it define what you're looking for?  

We aren't children, this should be common sense.  Be specific and there will be no argument.



pokoko said:

That's ridiculous.  It's child logic to think something is implied when it clearly is not.  "Who won E3" could easily mean "who had the best game" or "which company will make the most money (Activision)."  Simple logic would tell you to be specific with your question.  It's really, really not difficult, you know?  It's like that silly argument that breaks out when someone makes a thread about "exclusives" without bothering to specify that they mean "console exclusives".  The burden is on the person who asks the question.  Seriously, how hard is it define what you're looking for?  

We aren't children, this should be common sense.  Be specific and there will be no argument.


It's not rediculus, because no one who hears that question thinks "who had the best game" or "which company will make the most money (Activision)." There is no "simple logic." There's just simple logic, and assholes. "Who won E3" is a question asked a thousand times, and everytime, the asker is asking the same question. If they aren't, they add to that question. "I'm including Ubisoft and EA." Activision didn't compete. There's no need to define what you're looking for. Everyone knows what you're looking for. It's implied. And everyone knows that you're not looking for "gamers."

Don't be a smartass when answering the question and there will be no agrument.



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spemanig said:


It's not rediculus, because no one who hears that question thinks "who had the best game" or "which company will make the most money (Activision)." There is no "simple logic." There's just simple logic, and assholes. "Who won E3" is a question asked a thousand times, and everytime, the asker is asking the same question. If they aren't, they add to that question. "I'm including Ubisoft and EA." Activision didn't compete. There's no need to define what you're looking for. Everyone knows what you're looking for. It's implied. And everyone knows that you're not looking for "gamers."

Don't be a smartass when answering the question and there will be no agrument.

You honestly do not understand what "implied" means, do you?  If you do not, stop using it.  "Who won E3" carries NO inherent implications that it's limited to Sony, Microsoft, and Nintendo.  Period.  That's something you infer.  

Look, let's just say that I think your idea of having the audience figure out what the question means rather than the asker being specific is idiotic and akin to the self-centeredness of children and we can leave it at that.



Fusioncode said:
Nadwki said:

Saying "Gamers Win" at an event like E3 that is about games is like saying "Fans of Football Win" at the World Cup, an event about Football. It's the type of answer that you get from a news reporter who remains neutral and just reports the overall theme of an event without actually offering an opinion of his own.

What do football fans get if their team wins? Pride? At least gamers get great games. 

I feel pride when I beat a game, does that count :) 

"Gamers get great games" just begs the question, which great games do gamers get, they can't all be great and what games are great is surely a matter of opinion. 

 



pokoko said:

You honestly do not understand what "implied" means, do you?  If you do not, stop using it.  "Who won E3" carries NO inherent implications that it's limited to Sony, Microsoft, and Nintendo.  Period.  That's something you infer.  

Look, let's just say that I think your idea of having the audience figure out what the question means rather than the asker being specific is idiotic and akin to the self-centeredness of children and we can leave it at that.


You honestly do not understand what "context" means, do you? If you do not, stop using it. "Who won E3" carries EVERY inherent implications that it's limited to Sony, Microsoft, and Nintendo because of the CONTEXT with which it is always asked. Period. That's not something anyone ever needs to infer.

It's not self-centered. If you don't understand the question, you shouldn't be in the conversation. Or be able to function properly.



spemanig said:


You honestly do not understand what "context" means, do you? If you do not, stop using it. "Who won E3" carries EVERY inherent implications that it's limited to Sony, Microsoft, and Nintendo because of the CONTEXT with which it is always asked. Period. That's not something anyone ever needs to infer.

It's not self-centered. If you don't understand the question, you shouldn't be in the conversation. Or be able to function properly.

Ah, now you're just being silly.  Obviously, the only context in "who won E3" is that someone won and that it's at E3.  There is no other context in that question.  If you're introducing other context outside that statement then I already covered that in my original post.  If that's what you're saying then all your arguments since have been a waste of time.



E3 is not about glitz and glamour whos d*** can do backflips, rainbows and other weird stuff. Sony Microsoft and Nintendo are competing for your money not your satisfaction. Those suits going on stage are not there for family hour, they want you to buy the games and products they show on stage, even if a game company has the crappiest presentation ever and sells manages to sell 20 million its regarded as a success. Sales decide who wins E3, June and July NPD should show a clear winner aswell as worldwide sales. Furthermore Gamescom is in August and Tokyo Game Show in September, their will be winners for these events aswell again based off sales. Consumers vote with their wallets, and so far Nintendo aint getting to much of that cash with the exception of smash bros, Microsoft is pimping the hell out of Master Chief Collection, Sunset Overdrive is getting momentum and Kinectless Xbox One has gotten a major E3 boost. Sony's exclusive lineup is making major headwaves. Destiny PS4 is making lots of rounds, WII U is sales are stagnant much development there. 

Edit: Just checked June Cumulative sales Amazon US.  Xbox One kinectless got a bump from 56 to 52  and Destiny PS4 is now 20, in just three days on the market. Master Chief collection is ranked rumber 8.  Amazon Canada has Master Chief Collection at 11, Kinectless at 70, Destiny PS4 bundle at 24.