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Forums - Sales Discussion - Which console do you see winning each territory?

This is something that has been on my mind. My thoughts are: Na: Wii definitely Japan: Wii no doubt Europe: Wii/ps3 this one has really got me puzzled! Europe is where Sony is loved and adored! But, the Wii is changing the sauce a little! I don't have a freakin idea! Also, what place do you think each console will end up in each territory at the end of the gen? my guess: N.a.: 1. Wii 2. Ps3 3. 360 Japan: 1. Wii 2. Ps3 (i won't include the box and you know why.) Europe: 1. Wii or Ps3 2. Wii or Ps3 3. 360 (obviously) your thoughts?



Damn things have changed since 2009 began. Here are my new visions for the end of the generation.

 

Wii: 135 mil

Ps3: 85 mil

360: 60 mil

True Genius
Around the Network

Wii. are we done with this thread now? 




It's the Wii, judging by current data.



I don't need your console war.
It feeds the rich while it buries the poor.
You're power hungry, spinnin' stories, and bein' graphics whores.
I don't need your console war.

NO NO, NO NO NO.

are you crazy? Europe isn't known to be Nintendo land! It's Sony land! (this is practically why I made the thread.)



Damn things have changed since 2009 began. Here are my new visions for the end of the generation.

 

Wii: 135 mil

Ps3: 85 mil

360: 60 mil

True Genius

It has me wondering weather Nintendo will do what was thought to be impossible and destroy Sony in their main territory!



Damn things have changed since 2009 began. Here are my new visions for the end of the generation.

 

Wii: 135 mil

Ps3: 85 mil

360: 60 mil

True Genius
Around the Network

I posted this on the gamespot forums. It's all made up, but I can get away with a lot more lies over there, then I can here. I can already tell you the Patcher thing is untrue and I knew it, lol. And Yes, I used Wii bingo for the second half:

 

There are several reasons I believe this(Wii will win the console war), but first let me say, I won't insult anyones intelligence by mentioned things as trivial as "individual games" in this topic. I won't be so foolish to say something like "The PS3 will win because of MGS 4" or something that infers I have a childish and incomplete understanding of how the market is shifted.

A. The PS3 and the 360 are stepping on each others toes. The PS3 and 360 are in direct competition worldwide. In NA, the 360 is the console of choice(January NPD notwithstanding) statically. In Europe and Japan, it's the PS3. People are choosing PS3 or 360. While I feel it is likely the PS3 will win that war, I do believe that if the 360(or PS3) didn't exist, it's competitive HD console would would be neck and neck with the Wii.

B. The Wii is a second console for many. Many HD console owners also buy a Wii, because it is cheap, has great exclusive games, and delivers great experiences for their families as well as themselves, so they can share gaming.

C. Blue Ocean strategy means the Wii's market segment includes the core gamers, while it also includes many casual gamers. This means the Wii is expanding the home console market. It's advertisement for this? Word of mouth and visualization of "friends" from the packaged game Wii sports. This means that 10 out of 100 people might consider buying a PS3 because it is marketed to them. 100 out of 100 might consider buying a Wii because it is marketed to them.

D. Price-point. Other consoles have had price cuts already. The Wii has not. It can have significant price cuts and still make significant profit. If the Wii was 150 bucks, it would win the console war, period.

E. Game selection. Hardcore Nintendo fans from generations past will certainly buy the Wii, but so will new gamers who have games like Carnivle Games to play on the Wii, where on the PS3 and 360, they have little choices with difficult controlling options.

F. Momentum. The Wii is already statically ahead of the Gamecube in sales. People consider buying the console when they hear about this. It's word of mouth marketing. Your brain thinks, "So many people got one, what do they know that I don't." It's the perception of the device, and finally that leads nicely into:

G. The Japanese market has chosen the Wii as its next gen console. That means, many Japanese developers will create games for the system. In Japan, the Wii is consistantly outselling the PS3 4 to 1, usually about 80,000 units, to 20,000 units, and often even more than that. This means that in Japan, the Wii userbase is already much larger. That means games that only appeal to Japanese gamers, like Monster Hunter 3, will, and have gone Wii exclusive. In the past, the Japanese have always stuck with the console they initially pick as their console of choice for that gen. Japan is a key battle for the PS3, and it is very unlikely the PS3 can ever outsell the Wii there, before the Wii saturation point is reached.

H. This is also due to the Blue Ocean's fondness of the DS, in Japan. New console gamers in Japan, will buy a Wii, because they are new, because of the DS, and are casual gamers, who have a high respect for the Nintendo brand there.

I. Also, the Wii is statically ahead by so much at this point, that even if the Wii sales dropped off by half(which is impossible nearly in a year timespan) it would still be selling more worldwide than both its competitors, and still be even further ahead by 09, at which point, it will be nearly impossible to catch up before the 720 or the Wii2 launches.

J. There is little to no evidence available the Wii will slack off, besides speculation. Demand remains higher than supply, and the Wii is still the top seller in every major region worldwide with no indications of a change, besides broad and hopeful speculations.

Now to debunk some reasons others give for the Wii to drop in sales:

1. Lack of 3rd party games - This reason is only presented by the core audiences. 15 of the top 20 selling games in December for the Wii, were 3rd party. You can confirm this from the recent Iwata interview. Just because you don't like the games in the top 10, doesn't mean Wii owners don't. Remember, this is a diverse userbase. They like Brawl, but they also like Wii-Fit. It is also to note, that the Wii has quite a slew of games available in 08 that are new support from 3rd party companies, due to sales, like Rock Band, Guitar Hero, Call of Duty, Final Fantasy, Alone in the Dark, Tales of Symphonia, Fragile, Facebreakers, Madden, Tiger Woods, and Monster Hunter. I have compiled a list recently and it contains over 61 non shovelware titles, and I can post it if requested.

2. When Game X is released the Wii is finished - Halo 3 nor DMC 4 finished the Wii, or even phased it. Single games have little affect on across platform industry sales that is visible in the short term.

3. When PS60 get price cut, Wii is through - Each system has already had price cuts or SKU changes to lower the price. The Wii has had none. Don't forget the Wii can also benefit from such tactics.

4. Nintendo is abandoning the hardcore, therefore sales of hardcore gamers will die - Nintendo fanboys are hardcore gamers and they will never abandon the Wii, however, Nintendo is putting out more first party core games now, than ever before, 4 to 6 a year for the Wii, plus the casual 1st party games.

5. Nintendo not serious about online, therefore that market will leave them - According to IGN, Japanes Brawl plays lag free. However, Nintendo does not live and die by its online community, particularly when it is a second console for many online gamers.

6. Wii is just a party machine. Sales will decline due to console sharing lowering the saturation point - Software sales say otherwise, when games like NMH, Resident Evil, Zelda, and Brawl perform better than expected. These games are single player, and not relyiant on the "party atmosphere."

7. Wii sells because it is cheap. If the other systems are cheaper, they will sell just as well - This was not the case with the Gamecube, which was cheaper from the start. The Wii sells because of perception.

8. Pachter says the PS3 will win - Patcher is biased, so is Jaffe, they have never predicted anything right that wasn't obvious in the past, nor do they base their guesses off current sales, but predicted trends.

9. Gamecube started out well at first too, therefore, the Wii will die just like it did - The Wii has already outsold the Gamecube worldwide, 6 times faster, outselling the Gamecube 6 to 1. Even if it does "die" historically it's trail off sales would be enough to sustain it for this generation and the next one.

10. Wii is a fad, and will die once people "realize" X about X other console - Not according to the numbers, by definition, the Wii cannot be considered a fad.

11. Lower quality minigames will jade casuals who buy them and give them a bad view of Nintendo - If bad PR ruined a company, Microsoft and Sony would have been out of business a long time ago.

12. PS3 is on a ten year plan - If so, the Playstation brand will be dead in 10 years, when it releases it's playstation 4 against the twilight years of the wildly popular Wii 2s and the Xbox 720s. The PS4 will release a year after Xbox, if it waits that long, it probably won't.

13. Only Nintendo games sell on Nintendo systems, therefore, 3rd parties will leave the system, and it will die - The Wii doesn't need 3rd party games to sell well, we've seen that, but atm, 3rd parties are clammoring to the Wii, not away from it. Particularly, EA, Activision, Atlus, Ubisoft, Namco, Square-Enix, and Capcom.

14. When HD adoption rate goes up, Wii is finished.- By then it will be far to late to make a comeback, but that said, Casuals don't know the Wii isn't in HD, and it supports 420P, which looks leaps and bounds better than SD. Casuals, and new HD-TV owners will buy a Wii as quicly as they will buy a 360. The PS3 will benefit from this due to Blu-Ray, but it won't make one bit of difference in Japan, where the PS3 vs Wii war is most vital, because graphics mean nothing to sales in Japan.

15. What happens when people get bored of Wii Sports? - A. Wii Sports 2 is in development. B. SSB: Brawl and Wii Fit are around the corner. C. See 2008 Wii game list. Sorry for being a snarky, but "points" like this one are silly.

 



I don't need your console war.
It feeds the rich while it buries the poor.
You're power hungry, spinnin' stories, and bein' graphics whores.
I don't need your console war.

NO NO, NO NO NO.

I also came up with this list of Wii games, which as far as I know, is the most complete nonshovelware list available, of course I couldn't be held responsible if some of these don't make 08, lol. How is this relevant? No idea, just thought I'd text crit ya!:

Bully: Scholarship edition
de Blob
Drawn To Life 2
Star Wars: The Force Unleashed
Ghostbusters: The Videogame
Red Steel 2
Rygar: The Battle of Argus
Disaster: Day of Crisis
Okami
King's Story
Harvest Moon Heroes
Prince of Persia
Tales of Symphonia: Dawn of the New World
Dragon Quest Swords: The Masked Queen and the Tower of Mirrors
Final Fantasy Crystal Chronicles: Crystal Bearers
Oboro Muramasa Youtouden
Shiren the Wanderer
Monster Hunter 3
Baroque
Opoona
Fragile
Matsuno
Blast Works: Build, Fuse & Destroy
Brothers in Arms: Road to Hill 30
House of the Dead 2 & 3
Castle Shikigami 3
Call of Duty 5
Winning Eleven: Pro Evolution Soccer 2008
We Love Golf!
SEGA Superstar Tennis
Major League Baseball 2K8
Don King Presents: Prizefighter
Top Spin Tennis
Mario Superstar Baseball
Facebreakers
Madden
Tiger Woods
NCAA
Wii Music
Rock Band
Guitar Hero IV
Samba De Amigo
Guitar Hero III: Aerosmith
Band Mashups
Wii Fit
Boom Blox
Endless Ocean
LEGO Indiana Jones
LEGO Batman
Ninja Reflex
Wii Chess
Alone in the Dark
Fatal Frame IV
Obscure: The Aftermath
Super Smash Bros. Brawl
Mario Kart Wii
Worms: A Space Oddity
Animal Crossing
Monster Lab
Project Witches
No More Heroes
Kirby Wii
Spore
Mushroom Men
Deadly Creatures
Death Jr.: Root of Evil
Dr. Mario
FFCC WiiWare



I don't need your console war.
It feeds the rich while it buries the poor.
You're power hungry, spinnin' stories, and bein' graphics whores.
I don't need your console war.

NO NO, NO NO NO.

ZenfoldorVGI said:

I posted this on the gamespot forums. It's all made up, but I can get away with a lot more lies over there, then I can here. I can already tell you the Patcher thing is untrue and I knew it, lol. And Yes, I used Wii bingo for the second half:

 

There are several reasons I believe this(Wii will win the console war), but first let me say, I won't insult anyones intelligence by mentioned things as trivial as "individual games" in this topic. I won't be so foolish to say something like "The PS3 will win because of MGS 4" or something that infers I have a childish and incomplete understanding of how the market is shifted.

A. The PS3 and the 360 are stepping on each others toes. The PS3 and 360 are in direct competition worldwide. In NA, the 360 is the console of choice(January NPD notwithstanding) statically. In Europe and Japan, it's the PS3. People are choosing PS3 or 360. While I feel it is likely the PS3 will win that war, I do believe that if the 360(or PS3) didn't exist, it's competitive HD console would would be neck and neck with the Wii.

B. The Wii is a second console for many. Many HD console owners also buy a Wii, because it is cheap, has great exclusive games, and delivers great experiences for their families as well as themselves, so they can share gaming.

C. Blue Ocean strategy means the Wii's market segment includes the core gamers, while it also includes many casual gamers. This means the Wii is expanding the home console market. It's advertisement for this? Word of mouth and visualization of "friends" from the packaged game Wii sports. This means that 10 out of 100 people might consider buying a PS3 because it is marketed to them. 100 out of 100 might consider buying a Wii because it is marketed to them.

D. Price-point. Other consoles have had price cuts already. The Wii has not. It can have significant price cuts and still make significant profit. If the Wii was 150 bucks, it would win the console war, period.

E. Game selection. Hardcore Nintendo fans from generations past will certainly buy the Wii, but so will new gamers who have games like Carnivle Games to play on the Wii, where on the PS3 and 360, they have little choices with difficult controlling options.

F. Momentum. The Wii is already statically ahead of the Gamecube in sales. People consider buying the console when they hear about this. It's word of mouth marketing. Your brain thinks, "So many people got one, what do they know that I don't." It's the perception of the device, and finally that leads nicely into:

G. The Japanese market has chosen the Wii as its next gen console. That means, many Japanese developers will create games for the system. In Japan, the Wii is consistantly outselling the PS3 4 to 1, usually about 80,000 units, to 20,000 units, and often even more than that. This means that in Japan, the Wii userbase is already much larger. That means games that only appeal to Japanese gamers, like Monster Hunter 3, will, and have gone Wii exclusive. In the past, the Japanese have always stuck with the console they initially pick as their console of choice for that gen. Japan is a key battle for the PS3, and it is very unlikely the PS3 can ever outsell the Wii there, before the Wii saturation point is reached.

H. This is also due to the Blue Ocean's fondness of the DS, in Japan. New console gamers in Japan, will buy a Wii, because they are new, because of the DS, and are casual gamers, who have a high respect for the Nintendo brand there.

I. Also, the Wii is statically ahead by so much at this point, that even if the Wii sales dropped off by half(which is impossible nearly in a year timespan) it would still be selling more worldwide than both its competitors, and still be even further ahead by 09, at which point, it will be nearly impossible to catch up before the 720 or the Wii2 launches.

J. There is little to no evidence available the Wii will slack off, besides speculation. Demand remains higher than supply, and the Wii is still the top seller in every major region worldwide with no indications of a change, besides broad and hopeful speculations.

Now to debunk some reasons others give for the Wii to drop in sales:

1. Lack of 3rd party games - This reason is only presented by the core audiences. 15 of the top 20 selling games in December for the Wii, were 3rd party. You can confirm this from the recent Iwata interview. Just because you don't like the games in the top 10, doesn't mean Wii owners don't. Remember, this is a diverse userbase. They like Brawl, but they also like Wii-Fit. It is also to note, that the Wii has quite a slew of games available in 08 that are new support from 3rd party companies, due to sales, like Rock Band, Guitar Hero, Call of Duty, Final Fantasy, Alone in the Dark, Tales of Symphonia, Fragile, Facebreakers, Madden, Tiger Woods, and Monster Hunter. I have compiled a list recently and it contains over 61 non shovelware titles, and I can post it if requested.

2. When Game X is released the Wii is finished - Halo 3 nor DMC 4 finished the Wii, or even phased it. Single games have little affect on across platform industry sales that is visible in the short term.

3. When PS60 get price cut, Wii is through - Each system has already had price cuts or SKU changes to lower the price. The Wii has had none. Don't forget the Wii can also benefit from such tactics.

4. Nintendo is abandoning the hardcore, therefore sales of hardcore gamers will die - Nintendo fanboys are hardcore gamers and they will never abandon the Wii, however, Nintendo is putting out more first party core games now, than ever before, 4 to 6 a year for the Wii, plus the casual 1st party games.

5. Nintendo not serious about online, therefore that market will leave them - According to IGN, Japanes Brawl plays lag free. However, Nintendo does not live and die by its online community, particularly when it is a second console for many online gamers.

6. Wii is just a party machine. Sales will decline due to console sharing lowering the saturation point - Software sales say otherwise, when games like NMH, Resident Evil, Zelda, and Brawl perform better than expected. These games are single player, and not relyiant on the "party atmosphere."

7. Wii sells because it is cheap. If the other systems are cheaper, they will sell just as well - This was not the case with the Gamecube, which was cheaper from the start. The Wii sells because of perception.

8. Pachter says the PS3 will win - Patcher is biased, so is Jaffe, they have never predicted anything right that wasn't obvious in the past, nor do they base their guesses off current sales, but predicted trends.

9. Gamecube started out well at first too, therefore, the Wii will die just like it did - The Wii has already outsold the Gamecube worldwide, 6 times faster, outselling the Gamecube 6 to 1. Even if it does "die" historically it's trail off sales would be enough to sustain it for this generation and the next one.

10. Wii is a fad, and will die once people "realize" X about X other console - Not according to the numbers, by definition, the Wii cannot be considered a fad.

11. Lower quality minigames will jade casuals who buy them and give them a bad view of Nintendo - If bad PR ruined a company, Microsoft and Sony would have been out of business a long time ago.

12. PS3 is on a ten year plan - If so, the Playstation brand will be dead in 10 years, when it releases it's playstation 4 against the twilight years of the wildly popular Wii 2s and the Xbox 720s. The PS4 will release a year after Xbox, if it waits that long, it probably won't.

13. Only Nintendo games sell on Nintendo systems, therefore, 3rd parties will leave the system, and it will die - The Wii doesn't need 3rd party games to sell well, we've seen that, but atm, 3rd parties are clammoring to the Wii, not away from it. Particularly, EA, Activision, Atlus, Ubisoft, Namco, Square-Enix, and Capcom.

14. When HD adoption rate goes up, Wii is finished.- By then it will be far to late to make a comeback, but that said, Casuals don't know the Wii isn't in HD, and it supports 420P, which looks leaps and bounds better than SD. Casuals, and new HD-TV owners will buy a Wii as quicly as they will buy a 360. The PS3 will benefit from this due to Blu-Ray, but it won't make one bit of difference in Japan, where the PS3 vs Wii war is most vital, because graphics mean nothing to sales in Japan.

15. What happens when people get bored of Wii Sports? - A. Wii Sports 2 is in development. B. SSB: Brawl and Wii Fit are around the corner. C. See 2008 Wii game list. Sorry for being a snarky, but "points" like this one are silly.

 

I agree totally with you

 



Europe is the only place in my opinion where it is possible that PS3 will outsell the Wii at the of this generation.






great list Zenfoldor!



Damn things have changed since 2009 began. Here are my new visions for the end of the generation.

 

Wii: 135 mil

Ps3: 85 mil

360: 60 mil

True Genius