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Forums - Nintendo - Bayonetta versus Bayonetta 2 comparison video

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SubiyaCryolite said:
curl-6 said:
SubiyaCryolite said:

Yes, but it would best the WiiU graphically thats for sure.

On topic, everything Bayonetta 2 does on Wii U (textures+scale) is largely due to the RAM. Its nice but from a purely technical standpoint its not so impressive given the age of the 360 and the enhancements facilitated only by ram if nothing else. As it stands no single game has shown the Wii Us gpu to be above of that of the 360 in terms of raw power, almost every enhancement seen so far is a result of extra ram or dev time. Why, because share the exact same geometry, exact same resolution and usually lower framrate. That doesnt scream power.

A Wii U with a 16 core CPU, 16GB of RAM, and a high end PC GPU would best the PS4. See how pointless such claims are?

Games like Trine 2 and Need for Speed showed GPU-relevant improvements on Wii U over 360; resolution, water shaders, and anti-aliasing in Trine, reflections and framerate in Need for Speed.


The framerate of Most Wanted U is exactly the same as the 360/PS3 and it sometimes drops to lower levels.

The world and car geometry is exactly the same.

It has the exact same resolution. 

The Textures are a result of RAM. 

The lighting was rewritten for the Wii U as well "Dev Time", theres no saying it couldnt be applied to the 360. Im basing this on Oblivion 360 vs Oblivion PS3 (a year later and significantly better looking on more or less identical hardware). 

Road reflections "could" have been left out on the consoles because of RAM as well, Im not sure how taxing that would be from a GPU standpoint, I cant confrim this obviously. 

Trine 2 operates at the same resolution, though the 360 & PS3 use dynamic scaling in parts. It has a locked 30fps framerate. Exact same geometry. The Anti Aliasing on the Wii U is more "refined", see Oblivion 360 vs PS3. 

"higher-resolution textures and more detailed foliage are used in many places throughout the game" == RAM.

"Other refinements to the PC game are more subtle - such as the use of higher-quality normal map compression, increased water complexity and splash effects - but these elements work well with the inclusion of higher-resolution textures to deliver more detailed imagery on screen in a way which emphasises the lush look of the environments" == RAM. Water & Splash == Physics == Dev time. Assuming these are CPU based theres no reason they shouldnt exist on 360. If GPU based then those DX11 Compute extentions came in handy.

"A look at the Wii U version of Trine 2 yields no unwanted surprises either - performance is a match for the 360 game with a straight line on our FPS graph showing a solid, sustained, consistent 30FPS update with no tearing in sight." == On par with 360s GPU, whuch has no tearing either.

"this partially explains the 1890MB file-size over the 1.1 GB on the 360 and 1144MB on the PS3, with higher-resolution assets also taking up additional space. " == RAM

If Bayonetta 2 is native 1080p I'll have to eat crow but every gameplay video released thus far has OBVIOUS jaggies even in 720p so I wont hold my breath. Smash will be 1080p but it lookes like Brawl with higher res textures so that isnt off the table. Same with DK.

Mario Kart 8 looks really impressive and if thats 1080p I'll eat crow too. Though the latest trailer also had obvious jaggies.

Taxing realisticish games like Pikmin 3 run at 720p30.

Nintendoland which is quite the looker also runs at 720p60.

Mario 3DLand looks great but uses artstyle to great effect to achieve 720p60.

NSMBU 720p60.

Project cars 720p30.

99.99% of 3D realistic or semi realistic Wii U games 720p30 or sub 30.

If Im wrong Ill gladly eat that humble pie but I dont believe I am. 

My point still stands. Its not like the PS4 version of Trine 2 that runs at 1080p60fps. Trine 2 could even hit 4K at 30fps. 4 bloody K at 30fps. Thats an OBVIOUS generational increase in raw GPU power not present on the Wii U.


Both Mario Kart 8 and Bayonetta 2 was confirmed to be 1080p 60fps :3.  Wii U has enough horse power and the right HDmi to support 4K as well as the Ps4. 

Pikmin 3 is 1080p it is only 720p on sub HD tvs

Mario 3D and is a 3DS game

Most if not all games on Wii U will be rendered in 1080p, 60fps it is native 1080p, Xbox 360 and Ps3 aren't that's why all of their games are upscaled



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vivster said:
A moment of silence for how great this game could've looked on PS4.


Also a moment of silence for the fanboys who are going to "kill themselves" because this game doesn't come out on a console they want. Lol. 



vivster said:
Samus Aran said:
vivster said:
A moment of silence for how great this game could've looked on PS4.

I haven't seen a game as beautifull as Pikmin 3 as the PS4. Maybe from a technical point of view(merky ground textures sometimes), but combined with the art style it's a winner.

It's all in the eye of the beholder. Haven't been impressed with the PS3 --> PS4 shift or the Xbox360 --> Xboxone shift. PS2 --> PS3 was much more impressive, even during the first year of the PS3(graphics wise).

I'll admit I was annoyed last gen by how weak the Wii was compared to PS3 and Xbox360, but with the Wii U I don't care at all. Pikmin 3 and Super Mario 3D World all look gorgeous. And Zelda: WW also looks very good despite being a remake. Art style is more important than how powerful a console is.

You're comparing different games. I'm talking about the same. That the PS4 could handle much more sophisticated effects and textures is not in the eye of the beholder but a fact. Bayonetta's art style relies on high detail and stunning visual effects. Things you need hardware power for.

Before the rest of you jumps at me for the wrong reasons I'd like to make a few things clear.

1. I know why it is on the WiiU. I have nothing against the exclusivity. I'm thankful that this game was made at all.

2. This game is half of the reason why I will buy a WiiU next year. So it's not sour grapes since I will be playing it.

3. I fucking hate when a game doesn't reach its full potential because of hardware limitations. I love Bayonetta so it hurts to see it botched down because fucking Sony or another 3rd party publisher didn't have the balls to fund it. Now it's stuck on the weakest of the 3 consoles and that sucks balls.


Point 3 is relative to your situation. I could say I fucking hate a game on PS4 because it has hardware limitations compared to a highend PC.

Someone at IBM could say fuck these tools who think they got highend PCs when we got super computers.



 

 

Fast Racing Neo would disagree with you on the Wii U's ability of running games with 4k textures.



SuperWatch111 said:
SubiyaCryolite said:
curl-6 said:
SubiyaCryolite said:

Yes, but it would best the WiiU graphically thats for sure.

On topic, everything Bayonetta 2 does on Wii U (textures+scale) is largely due to the RAM. Its nice but from a purely technical standpoint its not so impressive given the age of the 360 and the enhancements facilitated only by ram if nothing else. As it stands no single game has shown the Wii Us gpu to be above of that of the 360 in terms of raw power, almost every enhancement seen so far is a result of extra ram or dev time. Why, because share the exact same geometry, exact same resolution and usually lower framrate. That doesnt scream power.

A Wii U with a 16 core CPU, 16GB of RAM, and a high end PC GPU would best the PS4. See how pointless such claims are?

Games like Trine 2 and Need for Speed showed GPU-relevant improvements on Wii U over 360; resolution, water shaders, and anti-aliasing in Trine, reflections and framerate in Need for Speed.


The framerate of Most Wanted U is exactly the same as the 360/PS3 and it sometimes drops to lower levels.

The world and car geometry is exactly the same.

It has the exact same resolution. 

The Textures are a result of RAM. 

The lighting was rewritten for the Wii U as well "Dev Time", theres no saying it couldnt be applied to the 360. Im basing this on Oblivion 360 vs Oblivion PS3 (a year later and significantly better looking on more or less identical hardware). 

Road reflections "could" have been left out on the consoles because of RAM as well, Im not sure how taxing that would be from a GPU standpoint, I cant confrim this obviously. 

Trine 2 operates at the same resolution, though the 360 & PS3 use dynamic scaling in parts. It has a locked 30fps framerate. Exact same geometry. The Anti Aliasing on the Wii U is more "refined", see Oblivion 360 vs PS3. 

"higher-resolution textures and more detailed foliage are used in many places throughout the game" == RAM.

"Other refinements to the PC game are more subtle - such as the use of higher-quality normal map compression, increased water complexity and splash effects - but these elements work well with the inclusion of higher-resolution textures to deliver more detailed imagery on screen in a way which emphasises the lush look of the environments" == RAM. Water & Splash == Physics == Dev time. Assuming these are CPU based theres no reason they shouldnt exist on 360. If GPU based then those DX11 Compute extentions came in handy.

"A look at the Wii U version of Trine 2 yields no unwanted surprises either - performance is a match for the 360 game with a straight line on our FPS graph showing a solid, sustained, consistent 30FPS update with no tearing in sight." == On par with 360s GPU, whuch has no tearing either.

"this partially explains the 1890MB file-size over the 1.1 GB on the 360 and 1144MB on the PS3, with higher-resolution assets also taking up additional space. " == RAM

If Bayonetta 2 is native 1080p I'll have to eat crow but every gameplay video released thus far has OBVIOUS jaggies even in 720p so I wont hold my breath. Smash will be 1080p but it lookes like Brawl with higher res textures so that isnt off the table. Same with DK.

Mario Kart 8 looks really impressive and if thats 1080p I'll eat crow too. Though the latest trailer also had obvious jaggies.

Taxing realisticish games like Pikmin 3 run at 720p30.

Nintendoland which is quite the looker also runs at 720p60.

Mario 3DLand looks great but uses artstyle to great effect to achieve 720p60.

NSMBU 720p60.

Project cars 720p30.

99.99% of 3D realistic or semi realistic Wii U games 720p30 or sub 30.

If Im wrong Ill gladly eat that humble pie but I dont believe I am. 

My point still stands. Its not like the PS4 version of Trine 2 that runs at 1080p60fps. Trine 2 could even hit 4K at 30fps. 4 bloody K at 30fps. Thats an OBVIOUS generational increase in raw GPU power not present on the Wii U.


Both Mario Kart 8 and Bayonetta 2 was confirmed to be 1080p 60fps :3.  

Wii U has enough horse power and the right HDmi to support 4K as well as the Ps4. 

Pikmin 3 is 1080p it is only 720p on sub HD tvs

Mario 3D and is a 3DS game

Most if not all games on Wii U will be rendered in 1080p, 60fps it is native 1080p, Xbox 360 and Ps3 aren't that's why all of their games are upscaled


lol. No, no, no and no. This is why I go to Digital Foundry and not Nintendo fans.



I predict that the Wii U will sell a total of 18 million units in its lifetime. 

The NX will be a 900p machine

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bigtakilla said:

Fast Racing Neo would disagree with you on the Wii U's ability of running games with 4k textures.


4K resolution, not 4K textures. The PS4 does Trine 2 at 4096 x 2960 at 30fps, 1920 x 1080 at 60fps. Wii U does Trine 2 at 30fps and in 720p like the 8-9 year old 7th gen systems and Im suppossed to be impressed? Seriously?

The games the Wii U runs at 1080p right now can run at 1080p on the PS3 and 360 as well. Case in point, Rayman Legends is 1080p60 on all 3 systems. Though if were still exclusive Nintendo fans would use that as "proof" its more powerful.

And while were on the subject of 4K textures, thats possible because of the extra RAM. A 360 with 1GB of RAM would support 4K textures as well. The reason I keep saying 360 + 512MB RAM is to highlight the fairly insignificant "power jump" beytween the two systems. Hardware on the level of a 9 year old system with extra (and slower) RAM and Graphic API extentions thrown on top is not impressive from a technical standpoint, its not. Games and gameplay aside the hardware is WEAK can we stop pretending otherwise.



I predict that the Wii U will sell a total of 18 million units in its lifetime. 

The NX will be a 900p machine

vivster said:
Samus Aran said:
vivster said:
Samus Aran said:
vivster said:
Samus Aran said:
vivster said:
Samus Aran said:
vivster said:
A moment of silence for how great this game could've looked on PS4.

I haven't seen a game as beautifull as Pikmin 3 as the PS4. Maybe from a technical point of view(merky ground textures sometimes), but combined with the art style it's a winner.

It's all in the eye of the beholder. Haven't been impressed with the PS3 --> PS4 shift or the Xbox360 --> Xboxone shift. PS2 --> PS3 was much more impressive, even during the first year of the PS3(graphics wise).

I'll admit I was annoyed last gen by how weak the Wii was compared to PS3 and Xbox360, but with the Wii U I don't care at all. Pikmin 3 and Super Mario 3D World all look gorgeous. And Zelda: WW also looks very good despite being a remake. Art style is more important than how powerful a console is.

You're comparing different games. I'm talking about the same. That the PS4 could handle much more sophisticated effects and textures is not in the eye of the beholder but a fact. Bayonetta's art style relies on high detail and stunning visual effects. Things you need hardware power for.

Before the rest of you jumps at me for the wrong reasons I'd like to make a few things clear.

1. I know why it is on the WiiU. I have nothing against the exclusivity. I'm thankful that this game was made at all.

2. This game is half of the reason why I will buy a WiiU next year. So it's not sour grapes since I will be playing it.

3. I fucking hate when a game doesn't reach its full potential because of hardware limitations. I love Bayonetta so it hurts to see it botched down because fucking Sony or another 3rd party publisher didn't have the balls to fund it. Now it's stuck on the weakest of the 3 consoles and that sucks balls.


The best Zelda game I've played(and I haven't played them all mind you) was on the weakest gaming device on the market: the 3DS. Zelda Skyward Sword was mediocre compared to A Link Between Worlds(still a decent game though).

I would barely notice the difference while playing the game because I'm too busy playuing it(talking about Bayonetta). Graphics only do so much.

Comic Zelda doesn't need graphics. Though it still looks awful on the 3DS with all those fist-sized pixels. Still playable but could be better(on Vita for example).

I've played most of the second part of last generation on PC with a high end rig. When I came back to PS3 everything was hurting my eyes. TLOU may be the best game of the year but it looked atrocious with muddy textures and no AA. Same for the FFs. When FFXIII came out it was the most beautiful and graphically advanced game I had ever seen. Then I started gaming on PC and when I came back to play FFXIII-2 I couldn't believe my eyes. I already hate to come back to PS3 for FFXIII-3 because FF was always about grphic fidelity and pushing the limits of the system it was on. The PS3 is holding it back and I hate that.

 Graphics might not change the gameplay and maybe not even the fun but it never hurts to throw in some more pixels and AA. And then I think about the only reason why I can't have this is that it was just funded by the wrong publisher. That's a fucking stupid reason to have limited graphic fidelity.


Eh, ALBW looks very sharp with the 3D turned on. Mario 3D land looks jagged, but ALBW? Nope.

PS Vita version would look inferior in every way because there wouldn't be a 3D effect. And yes, it looks amazing on that game, never turned it off.

I could make a joke about the Vita being only good for "...", but let's be honest, Vita isn't good for anything. It really has no reason to exist.

Wow that went downhill fast. Now I can't take anything you will ever say serious again. Being fanboy is fun and all but at least make it obvious that you don't really mean what you are saying because otherwise you will look pretty close minded.

Does the PS Vita even have an exclusive that isn't called Persona 4 that is worth playing? And more people would've enjoyed that game if it was on the 3DS.

But stating a game looks very bad despite having never played it is what I call close minded(and you obviously have never played ALBW). Also from reading your posts you're way too focused on graphics to the point I feel sorry for you because you'll miss out on a lot of great games just because you don't like the way it looks.

From what little I've seen from the first Bayonetta it looks like a pretty ugly and uncreative game. I guess the maker of the video cherry picked boring brown coloured levels. I prefer looking at ALBW despite being on a much weaker console.

I read reviews and watch videos about games all the time. I don't fully judge until I have played them. All gameplay vids(even in the trailers where it is supposed to look good) it looked very pixelated. Should I buy a 3DS now so I can hope it looks different than what I saw in the videos?

You obviously don't know enough about the Vita and still judge it.

And you still don't get my point, or me for that matter. This is about a game that could look better if it were published on a more powerful console. No one ever said that games without blingy pixels are bad. ALBW is a great game and one of the first I would play if I had a 3DS. But to answer in your spirit - and I mean what I will say now.

ALBW looks utter shit compared to the original A Link to the Past, Which I played extensively and probably more often than you fiddled with your 3DS.

I'm not limiting my game choices due to petty things like graphics. You do because of your narrow minded fanboy brain that won't allow there to be good games on consoles like Vita. Which by the way has shitty graphics compared to a home console but still great games which I am able to play and you not.

I'm done here.


Just pointing out that there are a LOT more games on 3DS than Viita. Out of the 2 of you, the Vita owner is missing out on a lot more.



Samus Aran said:


That's ok, I still like you. :p

If Sony just made some exclusive games for the Vita I would have a reason to buy one. But that's my opinion of course. 


Sigh.....you obviously haven't looked into it whatsoever and yet you want to make judgement calls about the Vita not having any reason to exist.  Your opinion is an uninformed pile of crap that hurts to read.  If you want such things to be taken seriously at least make an attempt to research things before making such wild claims.  



...

SubiyaCryolite said:
bigtakilla said:

Fast Racing Neo would disagree with you on the Wii U's ability of running games with 4k textures.


4K resolution, not 4K textures. The PS4 does Trine 2 at 4096 x 2960 at 30fps, 1920 x 1080 at 60fps. Wii U does Trine 2 at 30fps and in 720p like the 8-9 year old 7th gen systems and Im suppossed to be impressed? Seriously?

The games the Wii U runs at 1080p right now can run at 1080p on the PS3 and 360 as well. Case in point, Rayman Legends is 1080p60 on all 3 systems. Though if were still exclusive Nintendo fans would use that as "proof" its more powerful.

And while were on the subject of 4K textures, thats possible because of the extra RAM. A 360 with 1GB of RAM would support 4K textures as well. The reason I keep saying 360 + 512MB RAM is to highlight the fairly insignificant "power jump" beytween the two systems. Hardware on the level of a 9 year old system with extra (and slower) RAM and Graphic API extentions thrown on top is not impressive from a technical standpoint, its not. Games and gameplay aside the hardware is WEAK can we stop pretending otherwise.

Lol, the if and could argument. 



bigtakilla said:
SubiyaCryolite said:
bigtakilla said:

Fast Racing Neo would disagree with you on the Wii U's ability of running games with 4k textures.


4K resolution, not 4K textures. The PS4 does Trine 2 at 4096 x 2960 at 30fps, 1920 x 1080 at 60fps. Wii U does Trine 2 at 30fps and in 720p like the 8-9 year old 7th gen systems and Im suppossed to be impressed? Seriously?

The games the Wii U runs at 1080p right now can run at 1080p on the PS3 and 360 as well. Case in point, Rayman Legends is 1080p60 on all 3 systems. Though if were still exclusive Nintendo fans would use that as "proof" its more powerful.

And while were on the subject of 4K textures, thats possible because of the extra RAM. A 360 with 1GB of RAM would support 4K textures as well. The reason I keep saying 360 + 512MB RAM is to highlight the fairly insignificant "power jump" beytween the two systems. Hardware on the level of a 9 year old system with extra (and slower) RAM and Graphic API extentions thrown on top is not impressive from a technical standpoint, its not. Games and gameplay aside the hardware is WEAK can we stop pretending otherwise.

Lol, the if and could argument. 

Id like to see you flatout deny that an XBox 360 with 1GB or RAM couldnt handle 4K textures.  Keep believing in a Wii U secret sauce all you want,the systems been out for about a year now and theres evidence about its real capabilities from both 1st and 3rd party games everywhere. Barely a month with the PS4 and One and we already see them doing things the 7th gen couldn't.



I predict that the Wii U will sell a total of 18 million units in its lifetime. 

The NX will be a 900p machine