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Forums - General - Evidence for the existence of God

I don't know why I have to prove to you the non-existence of god. Every time a person comes up with a new idea he changes the status quo. He then has to prove his idea to everyone so that his idea becomes part of the status quo. Everyone else doesn't have to prove him wrong, he has to prove himself right. Same thing with religion. God and religion, even though they have been around a lot, are NOT the status quo. Each god and religion has been introduced by different people (Jesus, Mohamed, Buddha, w/e) but they, or their followers, have yet to prove that god DOES exist. Atheists/Agnostics/etc. don't have to prove shit. The burden is on the religious people to prove the existence of a god. So far the evidence provided is weak and full of holes. Therefore, I am nowhere near being convinced god exists, nor should any person with enough intellectual capacity (there are smart people who believe in God, but I blame their parents not them).

Another thing that annoys me about religion and god is the way it spreads. I can go ahead and tell you about my friend Joe. He's a great guy, amazing personality, always nice, etc. I can also get 100 more people to tell you the same thing. I'm sure you'd believe this Joe person exists and is a great guy and really nice and all that. But just because i told you so doesn't make him any more real, the fact is Joe does not exist, even if I had 1 billion people tell you he was real. Religion works the same way, based on trust. Children get their minds corrupted by the people they trust the most, their parents, and are shown to their church leaders and get their mind corrupted even more.

I find this the lowliest possible way of spreading any idea and/or opinion, targetting the children who will believe anything a person tells them. Because of this I view religion as a cancer on our world, only causing great division and wars (crusades, 30 years war, jihads, etc.) and also hindering VERY beneficial technologies( Stem Cells, Cloning to some extend too). I bet you that if from this point on no one ever told anything about a god to their children and let's say this lasts 150 years. Then I bet that religion and god will be non-existent and the human race will STILL progress forward. Meanwhile if you do the same thing with science, I foresee billions of people will dying. But it would be fine because we would still have God, right?



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JustinUK said:
CrashMan said:

Interesting calculation I just did fo Noah's arc:

approx 10 billion species of animals.

At an average rate of collecting and loading of 1 species/second (VERY generous in my opinion) we have 10 billion seconds

10 billion seconds = 166666667 mins
= 2777778 hours
= 115741 days
= 317 years

Take the dimensions of the arc: 450 ft x 75 ft x 45 fx a volume of 1518750 cubic feet (if it was perfectly rectangular.)

EDIT : oops math error >_



I don't want to discuss religion much, but i believe that I don't gather all my experiences just so life could do a format C:\ in the end and archive me in a wooden casket.



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joora said:
I don't want to discuss religion much, but i believe that I don't gather all my experiences just so life could do a format C: in the end and archive me in a wooden casket.

Well no, you gather all those experiences and pass them on to your children, THEN it's format C:\ and "the hell is my Windows CD?" time.

I'd like to comment on the topic and remain above the bitter fray between the believers and non-believers.

I feel there is plenty of evidence of God. Even the evidence that many would like to believe disproves God, I believe confirms his existence, like Science. I can never understand why scientist feel that their knowledge means god doesn't exist. It's an illogical leap. Evolution is a good example. The theory is an idea extrapolated from basically 1 fact, natural selection. The ability for organisms to adapt, change, and survive in changing circumstances doesn't mean god doesn't exist, it means he's a genius.



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senseinobaka said:
I'd like to comment on the topic and remain above the bitter fray between the believers and non-believers.

I feel there is plenty of evidence of God. Even the evidence that many would like to believe disproves God, I believe confirms his existence, like Science. I can never understand why scientist feel that their knowledge means god doesn't exist. It's an illogical leap. Evolution is a good example. The theory is an idea extrapolated from basically 1 fact, natural selection. The ability for organisms to adapt, change, and survive in changing circumstances doesn't mean god doesn't exist, it means he's a genius.

Well, since you're not a stupid teacher I feel compelled to ask you two questions. Would you live your life any differently if you knew for certain there was a god? And conversely, would you live your life any differently if you knew for certain there wasn't a god? There's no trap that I'm trying to imply in these questions, i.e., the epistemological considerations implied are absolute. Just wondering where you're coming from.



All it would take for me to believe in God is concrete evidence. Seeing as there are plenty of you who are saying there is lots of evidence for God, can you please show me this evidence?



tombi123 said:
All it would take for me to believe in God is concrete evidence. Seeing as there are plenty of you who are saying there is lots of evidence for God, can you please show me this evidence?

The problem is, god is lazy.  If there was concrete evidence then everyone would KNOW god isn't doing crap for any one.  Then their bitching would be legitament and it would be nothing but work work work for god.  He'd rather just veg out and watch American Idol.



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senseinobaka said:
I'd like to comment on the topic and remain above the bitter fray between the believers and non-believers.

I feel there is plenty of evidence of God. Even the evidence that many would like to believe disproves God, I believe confirms his existence, like Science. I can never understand why scientist feel that their knowledge means god doesn't exist. It's an illogical leap. Evolution is a good example. The theory is an idea extrapolated from basically 1 fact, natural selection. The ability for organisms to adapt, change, and survive in changing circumstances doesn't mean god doesn't exist, it means he's a genius.
It's not scientists who say science is at odds with religion so much as it is the religious fundamentalists saying that.  That's because the fundamentalists are the only ones who feel threatened if some scientific discovery contradicts some passage of a holy book. 

Example:  Young-Earth Creationists vs. geologists, anthropologists, biologists (evolution), etc. etc. etc.

Tag (courtesy of fkusumot): "Please feel free -- nay, I encourage you -- to offer rebuttal."
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tombi123 said:
All it would take for me to believe in God is concrete evidence. Seeing as there are plenty of you who are saying there is lots of evidence for God, can you please show me this evidence?

I am not saying there is a lot of evidence for god. I am saying it is a belief that is based on faith.

Final fan is right it isn't scientists in general who are saying science is at odd with religion it isreligous leaders. Many scientists believe in god but don't let it bias there observations. Of course there are scientists that do and there are religous people who understand and accept the scientific process as well.