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Forums - Nintendo - I wonder what it felt like for Japanese to stab Nintendo in the back when the PS came out?

happydolphin said:
Anfebious said:

Nitendo and Sony made a contract. They where going to do a joint project and nintendo had a long time to analyze the contract. That is the contract i am talking about and that is the one I was referring to. And that is the one Pokoko was talking about. And that is what we where talking about all along... So everything that was said was related.

What wasn't related was the part where I talked about Nintendo contracts with third parties in the NES era.

@bold. I hope you realize that's not an argument in Sony's favor...

Nintendo would never give up the rights on their IPs. If it took them time to find the scam, you can bet that that's not a good thing to color Sony as the good guy.


you act like sony walks up to nintento says they want to do this that and the other that nintendo agrees with, then pulls out a cryptic prewritten agreement and says all you have to do is sign here.

Agreements take 2 companies. Companies try and get what is best for them, nintendo often go away with thing with other companies. Something in your narative doesn't add up.



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happydolphin said:
Hynad said:

Quoted just to make sure.

As for the event that took place back then between Sony And Nintendo, we all know what happened. You choose to take a side if you want. But that doesn't make the event go away. Nintendo didn't read the contract properly, or thought about the full depth of the implications of it. When they realised it, their reaction was unceremonious at best.

It's not like Sony didn't write those things on the paper that Nintendo signed, right? ¬_¬

@bold. You need to find better things to do.

As for the rest, I've already answered Pokoko. If Nintendo were unceremonious, it's because Sony deserved it and I would have done the same. Good on them.


and if sony's terms were strongly not in Nintendos favor "it's because Nintendo deserved it"



You cannot blame Japan for stabbing Nintendo in the back when Nintendo first turned their back on them.



Wonktonodi said:

you act like sony walks up to nintento says they want to do this that and the other that nintendo agrees with, then pulls out a cryptic prewritten agreement and says all you have to do is sign here.

Agreements take 2 companies. Companies try and get what is best for them, nintendo often go away with thing with other companies. Something in your narative doesn't add up.

@bold. You have no idea how likely you are there. Nintendo had been working with Sony for years. Sony was manufacturing the sound ships on Nintendo's consoles for two gens that far (NES and SNES). They had a somewhat close relationship and were in talks. When the formal papers (contract) were written, that's when Sony's slimy hands started to show their true colors.

Nintendo is known to never give up the rights to their IPs, it's part of their DNA (historically speaking). So look at my answer to pokoko here for my best answer so far -> http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=5585051



happydolphin said:
Hynad said:

Quoted just to make sure.

As for the event that took place back then between Sony And Nintendo, we all know what happened. You choose to take a side if you want. But that doesn't make the event go away. Nintendo didn't read the contract properly, or thought about the full depth of the implications of it. When they realised it, their reaction was unceremonious at best.

It's not like Sony didn't write those things on the paper that Nintendo signed, right? ¬_¬

@bold. You need to find better things to do.

As for the rest, I've already answered Pokoko. If Nintendo were unceremonious, it's because Sony deserved it and I would have done the same. Good on them.


And why did they deserve it? You're assuming that Sony tried to stealthily appropriate the IPs of Nintendo for themselves. But what the unbiased facts claim though, is that the clause in question was written in the contract that Nintendo agreed to sign. 



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Wonktonodi said:
happydolphin said:

@bold. You need to find better things to do.

As for the rest, I've already answered Pokoko. If Nintendo were unceremonious, it's because Sony deserved it and I would have done the same. Good on them.

and if sony's terms were strongly not in Nintendos favor "it's because Nintendo deserved it"

That's something I can't really disagree with. Yes, Nintendo had it coming too.



Hynad said:

And why did they deserve it? You're assuming that Sony tried to stealthily appropriate the IPs of Nintendo for themselves. But what the unbiased facts claim though, is that the clause in question was written in the contract that Nintendo agreed to sign. 

Again, the undisputable fact is that Nintendo doesn't deal with its IPs lightly, so it couldn't have been some obvious clause. It's much more likely that it was a hidden clause (like is known to happen in written contracts).



happydolphin said:
Hynad said:

And why did they deserve it? You're assuming that Sony tried to stealthily appropriate the IPs of Nintendo for themselves. But what the unbiased facts claim though, is that the clause in question was written in the contract that Nintendo agreed to sign. 

Again, the undisputable fact is that Nintendo doesn't deal with its IPs lightly, so it couldn't have been some obvious clause. It's much more likely that it was a hidden clause (like is known to happen in written contracts).


Yeah, and to make that clause appear in the contract, you had to input a code only known by select Sony employees... ¬_¬



Hynad said:
happydolphin said:
Hynad said:

And why did they deserve it? You're assuming that Sony tried to stealthily appropriate the IPs of Nintendo for themselves. But what the unbiased facts claim though, is that the clause in question was written in the contract that Nintendo agreed to sign. 

Again, the undisputable fact is that Nintendo doesn't deal with its IPs lightly, so it couldn't have been some obvious clause. It's much more likely that it was a hidden clause (like is known to happen in written contracts).


Yeah, and to make that clause appear in the contract, you had to input a code only known by select Sony employees... ¬_¬

http://lmgtfy.com/?q=hidden+clause



happydolphin said:
Anfebious said:
But wasn't Nintendo the one who "backstabbed" Sony by changing their plans at the last minute when they joined forces to make a console? Thanks to that we have te beautiful Philiphs CD-i and the Zelda CD-i games!

No, it's Sony who "backstabbed" Nintendo by trying to slease in complete rights control on all the games on their joint platform. Wikipedia:

The product, dubbed the "Play Station" was to be announced at the May 1991 Consumer Electronics Show (CES). However, when Nintendo's Hiroshi Yamauchi read the original 1988 contract between Sony and Nintendo, he realized that the earlier agreement essentially handed Sony complete control over any and all titles written on the SNES CD-ROM format. Yamauchi decided that the contract was totally unacceptable and he secretly canceled all plans for the joint Nintendo-Sony SNES CD attachment. Instead of announcing a partnership between Sony and Nintendo, at 9 am the day of the CES, Nintendo chairman Howard Lincoln stepped onto the stage and revealed that Nintendo was now allied with Philips, and Nintendo was planning on abandoning all the previous work Nintendo and Sony had accomplished. Lincoln and Minoru Arakawa had, unbeknownst to Sony, flown to Philips headquarters in Europe and formed an alliance of a decidedly different nature—one that would give Nintendo total control over its licenses on Philips machines.

And the funniest bit is that Nintendo would have had a CD-ROM enabled system had this not happened. It left such a sour taste in Yamauchi's mouth that he decided to reject the idea altogether. We know how that turned out... (oh cartriges )

Writing an unreasonable contract for all to see is not backstabbing, secrectly changing business partners under your current partners nose and making the announcement as a sort of public "f-u" is the  very definition of backstabbing. Why didn't Nintendo simply try to bargain for a better contract from the start? Again, all I'm seeing is that every decision and tactic (even the dirty ones) employed by Nintendo are defended to the last breath (usually, not always). Nintendo did not treat 3rd parties well at all during the NES and SNES era and in regards to the Sony/Nintendo venture, Sony were bitches for making such unreasonable claims, especially since they had no hold in that part of the entertainment industry but Nintendo were even bigger bitches going behind their back like that, like it or not.

For Nintendos backwards ways, betrayal and pride, one can't claim that they didn't deserve to be outsold in the 5th and 6th console generation, much like one cannot claim that it's unfair that the PS3 was outsold in the 7th gen.

Besides, there is great irony in the fact that Nintendo resented losing control over titles yet it is precisely their previous near monopoly on 3rd parties and treating them like crap that got them into all that trouble to begin with regarding publishing on their consoles from the N64 and onwards. This whole mess they're in since two decades back or more, is mostly on them, it's not simply everybody else's fault.