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Forums - Gaming Discussion - UNITY - Nintendo & Wii U Finish The REVOLUTION

Fusioncode on 06 January 2014

Alright it's 2014, when's this revolution thing supposed to start?



Sigs are dumb. And so are you!

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Zod95 on 06 January 2014

Mummelmann said:

 

[too many paragraphs]

My post had a single idea, built from few and short sentences, and you just took them seperately as several independent ideas (which was not the message I was passing) and gave them extensive replies. Your comments have juice and are well constructed, I'm not criticizing them, I'm just saying that's not what I asked and the issue I've raised became a bit lost in that ocean of text you've wrote.

However, there are some parts I would like to comment on:

Mummelmann said:

 

Look what happened when MS gained such massive market control with Windows, look at what happened when Apple gained massive control with the iPod and iPhone, look and Nintendo with the NES; there comes a point where the control and ambition supersedes market and industry interest.

...

And for that reason, it is equally silly to want Nintendo to go away from the market, just as it is silly to want MS and Sony to go away, the more players the more potential for variation and lack of consumer shackles.

Apple is as bad as Nintendo. Microsoft is definitely better, although they become dangerous as monopolists. Sony is even better than Microsoft. Valve is even better than Sony.

Apple and Nintendo present a shameful behaviour even when they aren't the leaders. It's very easy to fill an extensive infamous list about their practices.

Microsoft is far more difficult not only because they behave better than Apple/Nintendo but also because they never got the monopoly of the videogaming business. The DRM policies and the online checks they were about to implement on XOne show us already what we could expect from such disaster but that's far from being as bad as what Apple/Nintendo have done in past and are still doing.

Sony had the monopoly in the 5th and 6th generations and we can barely say bad things about such golden times. I think the Sony's infamous list of bad practices is very short and I have no fear about them dominating again.

Valve is just the immaculate example. They have no such infamous list and the way they've approached so far the market, the industry and even the work relations is brilliant like you said.

Having that said, why would it be a bad thing if Nintendo went away from the console market? Is the Sony vs Microsoft vs Valve a bad/poor scenario? Would you like a videogaming industry in which the exclusive games were splitted into 10 different consoles? That's what I understand from that last sentence of yours. I even think that a Sony vs Valve would be enough to avoid major greedy moves.

Mummelmann said:

 

With Sony and MS striving ever more for sameness in philosophy and market approach and Nintendo wasting their time refusing to wear the right shoes for the track; the whole console line-up is a lost opportunity.

Sameness how? Sony has created and developed new IPs and concepts on every generation they were in (being leaders or not) and this time around seems to be no exception. Microsoft is also attempting to bring many new games although I understand they're rather a Sony copy-cat in most of cases and that brilliant series like Project Gotham were ended and not replaced at all by similar concepts.

Mummelmann said:

 

This is also a problem for me; on the one hand I believe that gimmicks and short lived fireflies are not the way to go for sustained growth but I also resent the idea of the placid becoming the norm.

You seem to forget about software. That's the real field for improvements and innovation. The hardware doesn't need mandatory gimmicks that otherwise wouldn't be bought by the majority. The hardware needs to be simple and powerful, the rest is software's onus. Sony is playing it right with the PS4.

"Placid" doesn't need to be the norm. If a gimmick is really appealing it will be successful even if it's sold separately from the console. If it doesn't sell well is because it wasn't that appealing. Sony has been collecting the gamer's feedback on a daily basis (since they failed hard with Blu-ray and Cell) and they understood the camera shouldn't be included in the PS4's package. For now, the only thing consumers massively want with the console seems to be the conventional controller.

Mummelmann said:

 

Sony have always had an artificial price point on much of their hi-fi produce, for instance, which starting biting them in the ass when Samsung started one-up’ing them with equal or better hardware at a lower price point.

...

For some examples though, some MS blemishes to feast your eyes on

...

Sony have had immense influence and power in formats for a long time, not only due to being pioneers and co-engineering the formats themselves but also because they have stakes and ownership in sizeable music and movie industry venues, they provide the formats and the market segments to push them through consoles, audio releases and film.

I don't care about what they do outside of the videogaming business. That's not my focus. With all honesty, I can even say that I would be glad to see them profiting from the other industries as much as possible in order to spend it all in videogaming. I know I'm being selfish but that's my view.

Don't I want fairness in all businesses of the world? Sure, but then my focus would be on the oil companies, banks and major retailers that fill most of the fortune 500 with no real merit. Compared to them, even Apple and Nintendo are trully saints.

 

So, again, my question remains: are the "infamous lists" of Sony/Microsoft game divisions as large and devastating as Nintendo's?



Prediction made in 14/01/2014 for 31/12/2020:      PS4: 100M      XOne: 70M      WiiU: 25M

Prediction made in 01/04/2016 for 31/12/2020:      PS4: 100M      XOne: 50M      WiiU: 18M

Prediction made in 15/04/2017 for 31/12/2020:      PS4: 90M      XOne: 40M      WiiU: 15M      Switch: 20M

Prediction made in 24/03/2018 for 31/12/2020:      PS4: 110M      XOne: 50M      WiiU: 14M      Switch: 65M

Mummelmann on 06 January 2014

Zod95; I have work tomorrow and can't stay up late writing a proper response tonight and I promise to keep it short and on point. However, as to your question on whether or not the "infamous list" for Sony and Microsoft are as bad as Nintendo's, especially if you focus on the console divisions alone, the answer is a loud and resounding no. I went easy in my long post on Nintendo practices, there are enough people accusing me of being stupid with my insistence that Nintendo is not the saint of the industry that has all parties' best interest at heart.

Here's a taste of some of their despicable practices in the 80's, a lot of which ties into my personal angles in here on their questionable tactics and ethics at several points in time;

http://www.geekcomix.com/vgh/fourth/nesbad.shtml

Edit; also, the good Dr.Einsomethingorother is being silly: The Pokemon Company is a subsidiary of Nintendo, like Game Freak and Creatures Inc. Like Lexus - Toyota. Kind of funny that he picks one single point to "refute" and then ends up fumbling even that.



zorg1000 on 06 January 2014
Seece said:
zorg1000 said:
Seece said:
zorg1000 said:
Seece said:
Kaizar said:
3DS is still outselling every console in each & every country.

The Wii U still continues to outsell the PS Vita every single week.

What are your thoughts on this? (@ everybody)

Big deal??? Vita is lucky it's still alive.

My thoughts on 3DS? It's down YOY for total 2013 sales, with Pokemon and 2DS. That doesn't bode well for 2014 and suggests 3DS has already had its peak year.

Actually with week ending Dec 28, it says 3DS is up 1% for the entire year. in USA its up 11%, Europe up 8%. Japan is down 11% tho.

Shipments shipments shipments. Will take them over anything.

Gotcha thought u meant sell through

Sell through is rarely far from shipments, unless something is massively under/overstocked. Don't believe 3DS has had any of those issues since launch?

Actually they did kinda overship last holiday.

As of Sep 30 2012 Nintendo had shipped 22.2m 3DS. According to vgchartz the sell through as of Sep 28 was 20.73m so there were less than 1.5m 3DS on shelves. 

As of Dec 31 2012 Nintendo had shipped 29.85m. According to vgchartz the sell through at the end of 2012 was 27.7m so there were 2.15m 3DS on shelves.

The amount of 3DS on shelves increased by almost 700k over the holidays in 2012. That explains the low shipments in the early parts of 2013 and in July/August 2012 the XL+NSMB2 released so it also makes sense why that quarter is down YoY.

2DS+Pokemon should make the last quarter up YoY but it seems as tho Japan has peaked already so it might cause it to be down overall.



When the herd loses its way, the shepard must kill the bull that leads them astray.

Kaizar on 07 January 2014
Fusioncode said:
Alright it's 2014, when's this revolution thing supposed to start?


April to December 2K14, in the Home Console market share department anyway.

Don't hold your breath, but at least it should sell more each week then PS4 & ONE individually.

 

I think this is what Johnlucas means.

 

I personally don't find it worth discussing until I see it come true, OR Mario Kart 8 + Smash Bros. four Wii U are both out.



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Kaizar on 07 January 2014
Mummelmann said:

Zod95; I have work tomorrow and can't stay up late writing a proper response tonight and I promise to keep it short and on point. However, as to your question on whether or not the "infamous list" for Sony and Microsoft are as bad as Nintendo's, especially if you focus on the console divisions alone, the answer is a loud and resounding no. I went easy in my long post on Nintendo practices, there are enough people accusing me of being stupid with my insistence that Nintendo is not the saint of the industry that has all parties' best interest at heart.

Here's a taste of some of their despicable practices in the 80's, a lot of which ties into my personal angles in here on their questionable tactics and ethics at several points in time;

http://www.geekcomix.com/vgh/fourth/nesbad.shtml

Edit; also, the good Dr.Einsomethingorother is being silly: The Pokemon Company is a subsidiary of Nintendo, like Game Freak and Creatures Inc. Like Lexus - Toyota. Kind of funny that he picks one single point to "refute" and then ends up fumbling even that.


But the 3DS & PS1 & Wii U are the only systems that give 3rd Parties 100% freedom.

The PS4 is more restricting then the PS2/PS3/PSP/PS Vita. You will have less blood & gore & violence & etc., then previous PlayStation systems. Look at the PS4 objective.

And Game Freak (the Pokémon Company) wasn't always a part of Nintendo. They were a 3rd Party Developer that got absorb by Nintendo like Platinum Games, but in a different matter.



zorg1000 on 07 January 2014
Kaizar said:
Mummelmann said:

Zod95; I have work tomorrow and can't stay up late writing a proper response tonight and I promise to keep it short and on point. However, as to your question on whether or not the "infamous list" for Sony and Microsoft are as bad as Nintendo's, especially if you focus on the console divisions alone, the answer is a loud and resounding no. I went easy in my long post on Nintendo practices, there are enough people accusing me of being stupid with my insistence that Nintendo is not the saint of the industry that has all parties' best interest at heart.

Here's a taste of some of their despicable practices in the 80's, a lot of which ties into my personal angles in here on their questionable tactics and ethics at several points in time;

http://www.geekcomix.com/vgh/fourth/nesbad.shtml

Edit; also, the good Dr.Einsomethingorother is being silly: The Pokemon Company is a subsidiary of Nintendo, like Game Freak and Creatures Inc. Like Lexus - Toyota. Kind of funny that he picks one single point to "refute" and then ends up fumbling even that.


But the 3DS & PS1 & Wii U are the only systems that give 3rd Parties 100% freedom.

The PS4 is more restricting then the PS2/PS3/PSP/PS Vita. You will have less blood & gore & violence & etc., then previous PlayStation systems. Look at the PS4 objective.

And Game Freak (the Pokémon Company) wasn't always a part of Nintendo. They were a 3rd Party Developer that got absorb by Nintendo like Platinum Games, but in a different matter.

Platinum Games is in no way absorbed into Nintendo.

And what the fuck are you talking about? What are you basing "PS4 is more restrictive than other consoles" off of?



When the herd loses its way, the shepard must kill the bull that leads them astray.

Kaizar on 07 January 2014
zorg1000 said:
Kaizar said:
Mummelmann said:

Zod95; I have work tomorrow and can't stay up late writing a proper response tonight and I promise to keep it short and on point. However, as to your question on whether or not the "infamous list" for Sony and Microsoft are as bad as Nintendo's, especially if you focus on the console divisions alone, the answer is a loud and resounding no. I went easy in my long post on Nintendo practices, there are enough people accusing me of being stupid with my insistence that Nintendo is not the saint of the industry that has all parties' best interest at heart.

Here's a taste of some of their despicable practices in the 80's, a lot of which ties into my personal angles in here on their questionable tactics and ethics at several points in time;

http://www.geekcomix.com/vgh/fourth/nesbad.shtml

Edit; also, the good Dr.Einsomethingorother is being silly: The Pokemon Company is a subsidiary of Nintendo, like Game Freak and Creatures Inc. Like Lexus - Toyota. Kind of funny that he picks one single point to "refute" and then ends up fumbling even that.


But the 3DS & PS1 & Wii U are the only systems that give 3rd Parties 100% freedom.

The PS4 is more restricting then the PS2/PS3/PSP/PS Vita. You will have less blood & gore & violence & etc., then previous PlayStation systems. Look at the PS4 objective.

And Game Freak (the Pokémon Company) wasn't always a part of Nintendo. They were a 3rd Party Developer that got absorb by Nintendo like Platinum Games, but in a different matter.

Platinum Games is in no way absorbed into Nintendo.

And what the fuck are you talking about? What are you basing "PS4 is more restrictive than other consoles" off of?


Sorry about Platinum Games.

And someone posted the "PS4 Objective" in like a lot of pages back. (in this Unity Thread)



Seece on 07 January 2014

Two games announced today.

Aliens: Isolation and Evolve by Turtle Rock (guys who made L4D1. Neither on WiiU.

2 more notches on why people may choose PS4 and XB1 over WiiU in 2014. All the time third parties announce something big, it's only for XB1 and PS4, not WiiU.

What confirmed lineups do we have???

WiiU:

Donkey Kong Country: Tropical Freeze
Wii Fit U
Smash U
Mario Kart 8
Bayonetta 2
X
Hyrule Warriors
Yoshi's Yarn
Watchdogs
Project Cars
Mysterious third party port (not M rated)
Likely - Call of Duty, Just Dance, Skylanders, Assassins Creed.

Xbox One:

Halo 5
Sunset Overdrive
Fable Legends
Quantum Break
PVZ: Garden Warfare
Titanfall
Kinect Sports Rivals
Fantasia Musive Evolved
Project Spark
Minecraft
Call of Duty
NFS
Evolve
Aliens: Isolation
Thief
Destiny
MGS5: Ground Zeroes
Watch Dogs
The Evil Within
Dying Light
The Division
Assassins Creed
The Witcher 3
Elder Scrolls Online
The Crew
Dragon Age Inquistion
Final Fantasy XV
Rayman Legends
Tomb Raider
Wolfenstien: The New Order
Fifa
Madden
NBA
Project Cars
Just Dance
Skylanders

PS4:

Driveclub
Order 1886
Infamous: Second Son
Uncharted 4
Minecraft
Call of Duty
NFS
Evolve
Aliens: Isolation
Thief
Destiny
MGS5: Ground Zeroes
Watch Dogs
The Evil Within
Dying Light
The Division
Assassins Creed
The Witcher 3
Elder Scrolls Online
The Crew
Dragon Age Inquistion
Final Fantasy XV
Rayman Legends
Tomb Raider
Wolfenstien: The New Order
Fifa
Madden
NBA
Project Cars
Just Dance
Skylanders





 

Seece on 07 January 2014

4.2m PS4's sold to CONSUMER Dec 28th. There can be no doubt PS4 is gonna overtake the WiiU very very soon.

PS4 is less than 1m behind WiiU!!!