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Forums - Nintendo Discussion - Amazing Awesome Sonic Lost World Footage! Day 1, Must Buy!

forethought14 said:
curl-6 said:

Conduit didn't have hype? You weren't in touch with the Nintendo side of console gaming in 2008-2009 clearly. ;)

And Wii Sports Resort had no hype yet went on to sell 30 million plus, that's the point, hype doesn't always match sales.

Lost World is currently getting as much hype as 3D World, easily. Mario's a bigger brand so he'll still sell more, but that doesn't change the hype levels. After all, many of Mario's buyers are casuals who don't get "hyped".

Let's look at the definition of "hype", according to the dictionary:

"to stimulate, excite, or agitate" 

Think about it this way, if there's a lot of excitement for a game (across a large audience, not just the same people here and there posting a ton of topics, and not just from the internet, though the internet has expanded from the past), then that excitement should lead to a good amount of sales for the first few days of any product on the market. If the game sells poorly (like Conduit for example) then the hype wasn't real and a bunch of those apparent "hyped people" weren't really hyped enough (those fakers!!!). Sonic Lost World for example, several are very excited (high levels of hype) for the game, therefore, they will do what they can to get it at launch or at least near launch, correct? (assuming that it's not just the loyal Sonic fans) If there's a ton of excitement for the game as you say there is, then there should be a large amount of day 1 or week 1 buyers, also bunch of pre-orders. If not, then how could the hype level have been as high as one possibly believed it was previously? Where did these apparent "excited" people go? It's mainly the hyped people who pre-order games they want because they want them as soon as possible. Why? Because they're excited for them. 

I had the Wii since launch, and did have a look at many titles through its years and though Conduit was apparently highly anticipated by some, it sold terribly at launch. If the hype was there (if they truly were excited so much so, that they'll want to get it as soon as possible), then why didn't it sell well? Because that apparent "hype" wasn't as high as you or any others thought. A bunch of these apparent "hyped" people weren't really excited enough to buy it. Conduit had hype, but much of it wasn't real hype and was a bunch of hogwash.  

I asked about Wii Sports Resort because I didn't really follow what went on with anything about it before it released. I heard a saying here and there about it, but never payed much attention. To me, Wii Sports Resort is an anomally because it had something other games don't, brand name (the "Wii Sports" name) and longitivity. However, It sold very well in its first day and week on the market (several hundred thousands per region, plus factor in the fact that Wii has a huge install base). If it truly had no hype whatsoever, then what would stimulate a person to buy it in its first week, or even less, in its first day on the market? They bought it, because they were interested in it. Plus, the "casuals" realized this "extension" to Wii Sports (which was a game-changing phenomenon for many people who were never interested in games before); therefore, they had to go out and buy it themselves to try it out because they enjoyed the original. Plus, Wii Sports Resort has been bundled with Wii consoles for several years now to further add to its high numbers. And it includes a Wii-Motion Plus controller along with a game, sounds like a good deal. Bundled stuff like this looks very appealing and would further add to the high numbers

And Wii Sports Resort is besides the point, I did mention that hype is measured based on its first few days on the market, not the entire life-span. The "life-span" part would include those others who are like "ehh, I'll buy whenever I feel like it", hence, not hyped enough to buy it as quick as possible, and those who recognize brand names, and "Wii" is /was a big brand name known by many. There are anomallies to this hype-sales relationship, and Wii Sports Resort is an anomally. 

As for Lost World, well, we'll see how big this apparent hype is when it launches, won't we? If there is a bunch of excitement from a lot of people (not just the sonic fans posting a bunch of topics), then it should have no problem selling well when it launches. I have no doubt it will sell well at launch (or rather, launch week) because I'm sure Sonic Fans are dying to play this. I'm gonna get it, I'm anticipating it, but so far my hype level isn't high enough to warrent a day 1 buy. 

Don't get me wrong though, hype exists for almost anything, it's just the level of hype that is questionable sometimes. And this is how I view the hype-sales relationship, it's not like it's a written rule or anything (though, these two things do seem to fit hand in hand), and it mainly is sort of "measured" based on the launch week performance, not life-time sales.

I disagree; people can be excited for something only to change their mind if reviews or word of mouth aren't good. Hype doesn't "lock in" a sale.

And anomalies still count; they're what changes a definition into a general rule.



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curl-6 said:

I disagree; people can be excited for something only to change their mind if reviews or word of mouth aren't good. Hype doesn't "lock in" a sale.

And anomalies still count; they're what changes a definition into a general rule.

If a game has a lot of hype (like Conduit apparently did), and ends up selling bad, then much of the real hyped diminished because they were swayed right before launch. OK, and what's your point? That just proves that true hype levels can possibly be determined by the launch week, to see who really stood their ground with the amount of hype they originally had. Just a bit of hype alone doesn't lock a sale (like I said everything has hype, hype is just "excitement" it's the level of excitement that I'm talking about), a LOT of hype for the most part does. 

Anomallies only count if there's no explanation for why something happened (therefore breaking a definition because it cannot be explained), and yet, like I told you, there's a clear explanation to why Wii Sports Resort sold a lot and is excluded from this idea. Tell me of a time where there was a Wii Sports phenomenon where in some cases people bought the console just to play Wii Sports? The people loved Wii Sports, so they went out to get Wii Sports Resort when they heard of it, it's not hard to understand. There likely was some sort of hype among the casual gamers, those who don't go on forums and constantly post about games. And plus, I said that hype levels are determined from launch week performance, not overall sales. 



forethought14 said:
curl-6 said:

I disagree; people can be excited for something only to change their mind if reviews or word of mouth aren't good. Hype doesn't "lock in" a sale.

And anomalies still count; they're what changes a definition into a general rule.

If a game has a lot of hype (like Conduit apparently did), and ends up selling bad, then much of the real hyped diminished because they were swayed right before launch. OK, and what's your point? That just proves that true hype levels can possibly be determined by the launch week, to see who really stood their ground with the amount of hype they originally had. Just a bit of hype alone doesn't lock a sale (like I said everything has hype, hype is just "excitement" it's the level of excitement that I'm talking about), a LOT of hype for the most part does. 

Anomallies only count if there's no explanation for why something happened (therefore breaking a definition because it cannot be explained), and yet, like I told you, there's a clear explanation to why Wii Sports Resort sold a lot and is excluded from this idea. Tell me of a time where there was a Wii Sports phenomenon where in some cases people bought the console just to play Wii Sports? The people loved Wii Sports, so they went out to get Wii Sports Resort when they heard of it, it's not hard to understand. There likely was some sort of hype among the casual gamers, those who don't go on forums and constantly post about games. And plus, I said that hype levels are determined from launch week performance, not overall sales. 

Hype is "true" whether it leads to a sale or not. Just because it doesn't pay off, doesn't mean it magically didn't exist.

And explanations don't magically make something not exist either. 



curl-6 said:

Hype is "true" whether it leads to a sale or not. Just because it doesn't pay off, doesn't mean it magically didn't exist.

And explanations don't magically make something not exist either. 

Well, think about it this way, if someone's hype and excitement was true, then there's no reason for reviews to change their pre-orders. True, strong, real high levels of hype are not (at least should not be) affected by the opinions of others. People are hyped right now for Sonic Lost World, but how much of that is real and loyal hype? Will some just not bother with the game if they see low reviews? If they do, then that "hype" they apparently had was always fragile and capable of collapsing; therefore the hype wasn't ever 100% true. 

Really? Explanations and exceptions exist in the world all around us, that doesn't break ideas and make them all of the sudden false. So according to you, the laws of physics should be just forgotten about because the anomally of the black hole exists? The laws of physics pretty much break down when near the center of the black hole, and that anomally exists, but the Laws of Physics aren't just tossed aside. They are called explanations and exceptions, Wii Sports Resort is explained as an exception to this idea because it's under special conditions (again, the Wii Sports phenomenon). 



forethought14 said:
curl-6 said:

Hype is "true" whether it leads to a sale or not. Just because it doesn't pay off, doesn't mean it magically didn't exist.

And explanations don't magically make something not exist either. 

Well, think about it this way, if someone's hype and excitement was true, then there's no reason for reviews to change their pre-orders. True, strong, real high levels of hype are not (at least should not be) affected by the opinions of others. People are hyped right now for Sonic Lost World, but how much of that is real and loyal hype? Will some just not bother with the game if they see low reviews? If they do, then that "hype" they apparently had was always fragile and capable of collapsing; therefore the hype wasn't ever 100% true. 

Really? Explanations and exceptions exist in the world all around us, that doesn't break ideas and make them all of the sudden false. So according to you, the laws of physics should be just forgotten about because the anomally of the black hole exists? The laws of physics pretty much break down when near the center of the black hole, and that anomally exists, but the Laws of Physics aren't just tossed aside. They are called explanations and exceptions, Wii Sports Resort is explained as an exception to this idea because it's under special conditions (again, the Wii Sports phenomenon). 

Hype doesn't mean being closed minded to changing one's mind. Your definition of hype is too narrow.

And that's the opposite of what I'm saying; that an anomaly being explained doesn't make it somehow not exist any more.



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curl-6 said:

Hype doesn't mean being closed minded to changing one's mind. Your definition of hype is too narrow.

And that's the opposite of what I'm saying; that an anomaly being explained doesn't make it somehow not exist any more.

That's why I call it the "true" level of hype. Right now, all hype is questionable because people are always capable of changing their minds. How much of that hype remains by launch, is the "true" level of hype. It's about having so much excitement, to a point where opinions of others won't phase you. That is truly a high level of hype. It's not a narrow definition, it's the end result of the constant fluctuations of hype. If we didn't have any new footage of this game, would people still be talking about it like they're doing now? 

What's your point with that though? That because Wii Sports Resort happened, my idea breaks apart and no longer applies? Yes that's true, it's an exception like I said, so what? Again I ask, tell me of a time that a Wii Sports-like phenomenon happened?



forethought14 said:
curl-6 said:

Hype doesn't mean being closed minded to changing one's mind. Your definition of hype is too narrow.

And that's the opposite of what I'm saying; that an anomaly being explained doesn't make it somehow not exist any more.

That's why I call it the "true" level of hype. Right now, all hype is questionable because people are always capable of changing their minds. How much of that hype remains by launch, is the "true" level of hype. It's about having so much excitement, to a point where opinions of others won't phase you. That is truly a high level of hype. It's not a narrow definition, it's the end result of the constant fluctuations of hype. If we didn't have any new footage of this game, would people still be talking about it like they're doing now? 

What's your point with that though? That because Wii Sports Resort happened, my idea breaks apart and no longer applies? Yes that's true, it's an exception like I said, so what? Again I ask, tell me of a time that a Wii Sports-like phenomenon happened?

See, I'd say hype doesn't have to result in a sale to exist; it can exist, then not pay off. It can fail.

My point on WSR is simply that it shows sales and hype don't always correlate.



curl-6 said:
forethought14 said:
curl-6 said:

Hype doesn't mean being closed minded to changing one's mind. Your definition of hype is too narrow.

And that's the opposite of what I'm saying; that an anomaly being explained doesn't make it somehow not exist any more.

That's why I call it the "true" level of hype. Right now, all hype is questionable because people are always capable of changing their minds. How much of that hype remains by launch, is the "true" level of hype. It's about having so much excitement, to a point where opinions of others won't phase you. That is truly a high level of hype. It's not a narrow definition, it's the end result of the constant fluctuations of hype. If we didn't have any new footage of this game, would people still be talking about it like they're doing now? 

What's your point with that though? That because Wii Sports Resort happened, my idea breaks apart and no longer applies? Yes that's true, it's an exception like I said, so what? Again I ask, tell me of a time that a Wii Sports-like phenomenon happened?

See, I'd say hype doesn't have to result in a sale to exist; it can exist, then not pay off. It can fail.

My point on WSR is simply that it shows sales and hype don't always correlate.

Hype can exist and not result in a sale, that's what I call questionable hype because there's a chance of it reducing. True hype is the end result of constant fluctuations in hype.

OK, and what about that? But like I said, that happened because specific conditions occured, Wii Sports happened. If Wii Sports never existed, then I can guarantee that Wii Sports Resort (if released how it was released) would not have come close to 30million. It's the only time this has happened, which is why it's an anomally that doesn't destroy the idea that sales and hype have a relationship with eachother. (like how the Laws of Physics still apply everywhere except in the black hole, the ONE exception,). 



forethought14 said:

Hype can exist and not result in a sale, that's what I call questionable hype because there's a chance of it reducing. True hype is the end result of constant fluctuations in hype.

OK, and what about that? But like I said, that happened because specific conditions occured, Wii Sports happened. If Wii Sports never existed, then I can guarantee that Wii Sports Resort (if released how it was released) would not have come close to 30million. It's the only time this has happened, which is why it's an anomally that doesn't destroy the idea that sales and hype have a relationship with eachother. (like how the Laws of Physics still apply everywhere except in the black hole, the ONE exception,). 

You're talking about hype as if it's the act of buying, when it's really pre-release excitement.

I never said there wasn't a relationship in most cases, just that you can have one without the other.



curl-6 said:
forethought14 said:

Hype can exist and not result in a sale, that's what I call questionable hype because there's a chance of it reducing. True hype is the end result of constant fluctuations in hype.

OK, and what about that? But like I said, that happened because specific conditions occured, Wii Sports happened. If Wii Sports never existed, then I can guarantee that Wii Sports Resort (if released how it was released) would not have come close to 30million. It's the only time this has happened, which is why it's an anomally that doesn't destroy the idea that sales and hype have a relationship with eachother. (like how the Laws of Physics still apply everywhere except in the black hole, the ONE exception,). 

You're talking about hype as if it's the act of buying, when it's really pre-release excitement.

I never said there wasn't a relationship in most cases, just that you can have one without the other.

Excitement = "hype" though, the definition itself.

OK, but you're making it seem like it has happened elsewhere though, or that this particular condition will occur again in the near future.