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Forums - Microsoft - Microsoft details how Xbox One cloud servers will tackle processor-intensive gaming chores

SvennoJ on 25 May 2013
Darth Tigris said:
SvennoJ said:

Different thing. It's far more complicated to integrate lighting maps or cloth dynamics coming from the cloud (at slightly variable timing) into the existing rendering pipeline then to decode a (slightly buffered) 720p30 compressed video stream.

Plus nobody claims streaming full PS3 games will be better then playing them on a PS3. I have zero doubt that GT5 or Wipeout HD will be a disaster streamed from the cloud as opposed to running on a PS3.

This is PR bullshit, promoting always online (and thus gold) for single player games. Programming parallel streams for physics and graphics rendering is complicated enough without having to integrate data that may or may not be there in time. Plus the time to receive, decode, and the memory required to store that data, and simultaneously have a backup method ready and available is only taking resources away that could be utilized better locally.

It can do a lot for persistant world multiplayer games, mmo's with dynamic worlds. Send all the data around you from the server while doing the rendering locally, second life style. (You can do that for singleplayer too ofcourse, unique huge dynamic worlds. Except it's not economically viable to have a whole world running for each player)

Btw the cynic in me says it will mostly be used for targeted in game adds.

Sounds more like you don't want it to be true than it can't be true.  I really can't understand that kind of thinking ...

I think your confusing cloud computing with global warming. That's the one I don't want to be true.

I've been a programmer for over 20 years and no I don't believe in magic. Servers can do a lot of things, but not help render a frame consistently in 16 ms. They can provide needed data ahead of time, streaming from a server is certainly do-able. That's not the same as helping with real time lighting and cloth dynamics. Bad examples.

It would be cool for things like Motorstorm with real mud physics deformable terrain. The server constantly updating the geometry of the track and sending it to you. Or in Forza 5 rain simulation, puddle forming, hydro planing, water displacement from other racers. The console will be working with a world state that's at least 20 ms old, with Forza's 2.7 ms per physics update that's pretty old, yet not a big problem since you still have the fastest response from controller input to screen. The world state lagging behind a bit doesn't matter that much although it would be noticeable. At 300 kph, you will see the splash from your tires lagging 1.6 meters behind you.

Anyway bad examples. Streaming world state data from the cloud fine, off-loading render pipeline calculations bullshit.



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Imaginedvl on 25 May 2013

I agree that using the cloud for rendering any rendering stuff is not as easy as it seem and I'm not really sure if devs will be able to use the cloud for that.

But, one very good use I can see to the cloud (and this is how we are using it our in game); is to keep a persistent world alive. By persistent I mean even for a single player experience; let say Skyrim; all inhabitants have their own agenda and things are supposedly still going on while you are somewhere else on the map.

Now, Skyrim is not really computing everything in the back but simply queue up all action and execute them while loading or moving... Or any other method they can use.

Having 2 or 3 VCPU on Azure computing all of this for the console may actually be very cool and free up the CPU of the console for something else.

This is one example but I think there are plenty of other things that can be done in the cloud to free up the CPU even for a single player game.

For a multiplayer game, obviously the cloud is just replacing a dedicated server



walsufnir on 25 May 2013
SvennoJ said:
Darth Tigris said:
SvennoJ said:

Different thing. It's far more complicated to integrate lighting maps or cloth dynamics coming from the cloud (at slightly variable timing) into the existing rendering pipeline then to decode a (slightly buffered) 720p30 compressed video stream.

Plus nobody claims streaming full PS3 games will be better then playing them on a PS3. I have zero doubt that GT5 or Wipeout HD will be a disaster streamed from the cloud as opposed to running on a PS3.

This is PR bullshit, promoting always online (and thus gold) for single player games. Programming parallel streams for physics and graphics rendering is complicated enough without having to integrate data that may or may not be there in time. Plus the time to receive, decode, and the memory required to store that data, and simultaneously have a backup method ready and available is only taking resources away that could be utilized better locally.

It can do a lot for persistant world multiplayer games, mmo's with dynamic worlds. Send all the data around you from the server while doing the rendering locally, second life style. (You can do that for singleplayer too ofcourse, unique huge dynamic worlds. Except it's not economically viable to have a whole world running for each player)

Btw the cynic in me says it will mostly be used for targeted in game adds.

Sounds more like you don't want it to be true than it can't be true.  I really can't understand that kind of thinking ...

I think your confusing cloud computing with global warming. That's the one I don't want to be true.

I've been a programmer for over 20 years and no I don't believe in magic. Servers can do a lot of things, but not help render a frame consistently in 16 ms. They can provide needed data ahead of time, streaming from a server is certainly do-able. That's not the same as helping with real time lighting and cloth dynamics. Bad examples.

It would be cool for things like Motorstorm with real mud physics deformable terrain. The server constantly updating the geometry of the track and sending it to you. Or in Forza 5 rain simulation, puddle forming, hydro planing, water displacement from other racers. The console will be working with a world state that's at least 20 ms old, with Forza's 2.7 ms per physics update that's pretty old, yet not a big problem since you still have the fastest response from controller input to screen. The world state lagging behind a bit doesn't matter that much although it would be noticeable. At 300 kph, you will see the splash from your tires lagging 1.6 meters behind you.

Anyway bad examples. Streaming world state data from the cloud fine, off-loading render pipeline calculations bullshit.

 

I totally agree with anything you sad.



ironmanDX on 25 May 2013
Imaginedvl said:

Having 2 or 3 VCPU on Azure computing all of this for the console may actually be very cool and free up the CPU of the console for something else.

This is one example but I think there are plenty of other things that can be done in the cloud to free up the CPU even for a single player game.


Hmm... I wouldn't mind that at all...