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Forums - Microsoft - I want to see Gamestop, Redbox, Gamefly and other rental and used services responses to Xbox One.

thranx said:
S.T.A.G.E. said:

The backlash is going to be felt. What Microsoft has done will not just be felt by the used game market but also to the rental market who pay licensing fees to the companies they buy from. Whatever hurts Gamestop hurts rental brands double. Red Box and Gamefly will be hurt in a major way by this. its not in anyones best interest to buy a used game because thats like buying double if you own an Xbox One. What do you think about the issue?

here is what Gamestop has to say about it:

"“Both Sony and Microsoft have said games can be resold and that’s exactly what we anticipated,” said Bartel, who added that GameStop puts $1 billion in trade into the market and 70% of that money goes back into new game sales. “It’s a recognized way to make these games more affordable. All three new platforms understand that.”"

"Bartel was able to watch a livestream of the Xbox Reveal. He loves the power of the Xbox One and how Microsoft is enhancing the entertainment system, but making the console gaming-centric. He believes the simplicity of the Xbox One, which offers Instant Switching between gaming and other entertainment and Web surfing, will be a key selling point for next gen consoles this fall."

http://www.forbes.com/sites/johngaudiosi/2013/05/21/gamestop-president-tony-bartel-talks-xbox-one-playstation-4-used-games-and-pre-orders/

Seems like he is fine with news. With out knowing how they will do the used games, rentals, or sharing of games its hard to say how things will go down. But MS has a good partnership with redbox (redbox on demand is a partnership between MS, Verizon, and Redbox), MS has also always been in good standing with Gamestop. I doubt they would burn their relationships by making used games not an option. I hope they do things right. I will wait for final judgment until we know how they will do everything.

Because they only care about, that a gamer can sell his game to them, and then they can sell it to another.    The big problem they are not seeing or do not comprehend, is that yeah the disk can be sold, but it is a worthless piece of plastic if it is arelady registered with someone's account.     When the mainstream "naive" costumer realizes this, they wont buy used XBOne games (nor xBone consoles), and so Gamestop will be screwed.



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S.T.A.G.E. said:
thranx said:
S.T.A.G.E. said:
thranx said:
S.T.A.G.E. said:
thranx said:
spurgeonryan said:
Just saw an Nsanity thread in the latest topics that said used games will be allowed. So are they or aren't they?


Used games are allowed. they have yet to mention how it works yet though. All they have said is that they have a system in place for used games, and trading games, and that there will be some fee. They have not said how it will work or how much the fee is or how often you need to be connected to the interent.

 

You can play your games at a friends house, with no fee, as long as you are logged into your xbox live account.

 

So we still need more info until we know how it works.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y508_rXPogQ

Microsoft interview with Adam Sessler.


There is a lot of conflictiing info out right now. Phil Harrison has said some stuff, Neilson has said some stuff, I guess Matt Bootly has too. Since not all the info matches up and they all work for MS its hard to say what is accurate and what is not. All we know is that as a company MS has not announced how the used games works and until they do its hard to make a decision on it.


They are all backpeddling. Larry Hyrb even tried to do damage control. 

I wouldn't call back pedaling. they simply have not anounced how used games will work. It could be as bad as some people say, it may not be. I did watch your video, and even the MS guy seems unsure on what he is allowed to say and what he isn't. Didnt really see any new info there. I hope they do it smart and right and with in reason. They may not, but MS is a smart company so I will wait until they officailly anounce how used games will work until I decide if its bad or not. If gamestop is not worried, I am not worried.

They have stated how it will work but when they started back peddling they changed their wording a bit.  They just havent stated specifically how much you will pay and how many payments might be demanded. If you watched the video I showed Adam Sessler got a one on one with Matt Booty. They are playing with words, but if you listen to them all at once, essentially once you buy a game Xbox Live authenticates it and locks it to your account and goes through a manditory screening process for the game after a manditory install. If it just so happens that you bought the game used another pay wall comes up before you can play the game. This is done in somehow in connection with the fact that the Xbox has to be online once every 24 hours. 

they have not stated how the used games will work. the info given does not state how used games will work. they do say that the game is tied to your xbox live account. thats about it. they have not given specifics on the pricing of how it works.  As far as i know the once every 24 hours was said by Phil, and is not confirmed. I agree they are playing with words. with out having anounced the used games officialy, the ms reps seem unsure on what they are allowed to say. So until its announced it useless to try and guess how it works or how much it will cost. they should have been more clear, but it seems as though they are waiting on anoucning the used games later.



thranx said:
aikohualda said:
thranx said:
aikohualda said:
maximrace said:
How I see it: Game is tied to your account. You can untie it so you can bring it back. Gamestore uses new system to put another code on it and that system will give some money to devs depending how old the game is. In the end used games will rise like 5 euros or so in price. This isn't really so bad

so whats the purpose if you can untie them?

might as well remove the whole program about the licensing since it is almost identical as just removing the disc and selling it..... less hassle


so you can play your games with out a disc in your sytem. some sort of licsening is needed. if not one person would buy a game install it, and share it. With some sort of regristraion it allows you to install a game, and no longer need a disc. its convienence. Until they anounce the fees, and how used games work, we are all operating on speculation.

so it install in my system?

then you can sell your disc? then the activation would be close to retail price then... because if not.. that would kill their digital sale... which i think would be big next gen....

i mean why buy digital if you can buy a used copy and pay the cheap activation...


We dont know what the activatoin price will be. we really do not know enough right now. Its specultion by forum goers. Nothing concerning used games has been confirmed or anounced except that it will play used games.

i dont think it is mostly speculation... i think it is logical.....

they would not charge cheap on activation fee.... since they are trying to increase the "profit" by cutting one of the head of the "used game" business.  and if you are right, that it install the whole game in your system, then that would kill their digital sales if they charge cheap activation.... hence the premise that it would not be cheap......



 

Heavenly_King said:
thranx said:
S.T.A.G.E. said:

The backlash is going to be felt. What Microsoft has done will not just be felt by the used game market but also to the rental market who pay licensing fees to the companies they buy from. Whatever hurts Gamestop hurts rental brands double. Red Box and Gamefly will be hurt in a major way by this. its not in anyones best interest to buy a used game because thats like buying double if you own an Xbox One. What do you think about the issue?

here is what Gamestop has to say about it:

"“Both Sony and Microsoft have said games can be resold and that’s exactly what we anticipated,” said Bartel, who added that GameStop puts $1 billion in trade into the market and 70% of that money goes back into new game sales. “It’s a recognized way to make these games more affordable. All three new platforms understand that.”"

"Bartel was able to watch a livestream of the Xbox Reveal. He loves the power of the Xbox One and how Microsoft is enhancing the entertainment system, but making the console gaming-centric. He believes the simplicity of the Xbox One, which offers Instant Switching between gaming and other entertainment and Web surfing, will be a key selling point for next gen consoles this fall."

http://www.forbes.com/sites/johngaudiosi/2013/05/21/gamestop-president-tony-bartel-talks-xbox-one-playstation-4-used-games-and-pre-orders/

Seems like he is fine with news. With out knowing how they will do the used games, rentals, or sharing of games its hard to say how things will go down. But MS has a good partnership with redbox (redbox on demand is a partnership between MS, Verizon, and Redbox), MS has also always been in good standing with Gamestop. I doubt they would burn their relationships by making used games not an option. I hope they do things right. I will wait for final judgment until we know how they will do everything.

Because they only care about, that a gamer can sell his game to them, and then they can sell it to another.    The big problem they are not seeing or do not comprehend, is that yeah the disk can be sold, but it is a worthless piece of plastic if it is arelady registered with someone's account.     When the mainstream "naive" costumer realizes this, they wont buy used XBOne games (nor xBone consoles), and so Gamestop will be screwed.


Yes Gamestop is to silly to forsee that, is one option, the other is that they may have more info on this and how it works so they are not worried. Until its announced we dont know what option is true, or if there are other options that we cant even concieve. So again, its best to wait for an anoucnment from MS detailing how it will work. Instead of jumping to conclusions. I know I won't decide on ps4/xbone until they both anounce how used games will work, if they charge for online, and the actual price of the console. I will get the Wii U for sure when i see a good deal on ebay.



aikohualda said:
thranx said:
aikohualda said:
thranx said:
aikohualda said:
maximrace said:
How I see it: Game is tied to your account. You can untie it so you can bring it back. Gamestore uses new system to put another code on it and that system will give some money to devs depending how old the game is. In the end used games will rise like 5 euros or so in price. This isn't really so bad

so whats the purpose if you can untie them?

might as well remove the whole program about the licensing since it is almost identical as just removing the disc and selling it..... less hassle


so you can play your games with out a disc in your sytem. some sort of licsening is needed. if not one person would buy a game install it, and share it. With some sort of regristraion it allows you to install a game, and no longer need a disc. its convienence. Until they anounce the fees, and how used games work, we are all operating on speculation.

so it install in my system?

then you can sell your disc? then the activation would be close to retail price then... because if not.. that would kill their digital sale... which i think would be big next gen....

i mean why buy digital if you can buy a used copy and pay the cheap activation...


We dont know what the activatoin price will be. we really do not know enough right now. Its specultion by forum goers. Nothing concerning used games has been confirmed or anounced except that it will play used games.

i dont think it is mostly speculation... i think it is logical.....

they would not charge cheap on activation fee.... since they are trying to increase the "profit" by cutting one of the head of the "used game" business.  and if you are right, that it install the whole game in your system, then that would kill their digital sales if they charge cheap activation.... hence the premise that it would not be cheap......


its also logical that they wouldn't want to kill off a part of their customer base that buys used games (or the biggest game retailer in the best market, gamestop). So until they anounce it, its just us forum goers each using our own logic. which is usually each poerson seeing what they want. so again its best to wait for atual facts and info.

 

Edit: I would add that if its so logical that MS is killing off used games, than Gamestop would be shaking in their boots right now. Seeing as the ceo is excited for the next gen one may draw the conclusion that used games will not be killed off.

 

Its easy to make arguments for either side right now. More info is needed



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Heavenly_King said:
S.T.A.G.E. said:
thranx said:
S.T.A.G.E. said:
thranx said:
spurgeonryan said:
Just saw an Nsanity thread in the latest topics that said used games will be allowed. So are they or aren't they?


Used games are allowed. they have yet to mention how it works yet though. All they have said is that they have a system in place for used games, and trading games, and that there will be some fee. They have not said how it will work or how much the fee is or how often you need to be connected to the interent.

 

You can play your games at a friends house, with no fee, as long as you are logged into your xbox live account.

 

So we still need more info until we know how it works.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y508_rXPogQ

Microsoft interview with Adam Sessler.


There is a lot of conflictiing info out right now. Phil Harrison has said some stuff, Neilson has said some stuff, I guess Matt Bootly has too. Since not all the info matches up and they all work for MS its hard to say what is accurate and what is not. All we know is that as a company MS has not announced how the used games works and until they do its hard to make a decision on it.


They are all backpeddling. Larry Hyrb even tried to do damage control. 

Phill, Nelson, and Matt are saying the same thing.  the game is attached to your ID, so if someone else wants to play that game in his/her account they will need to buy the game again.  So basically the one who buys a used game disk, is an idiot, because he will also need to pay full price of the game through the XBL.


Exactly. This has been made abundantly clear.



thranx said:
aikohualda said:
thranx said:
aikohualda said:
thranx said:
aikohualda said:
maximrace said:
How I see it: Game is tied to your account. You can untie it so you can bring it back. Gamestore uses new system to put another code on it and that system will give some money to devs depending how old the game is. In the end used games will rise like 5 euros or so in price. This isn't really so bad

so whats the purpose if you can untie them?

might as well remove the whole program about the licensing since it is almost identical as just removing the disc and selling it..... less hassle


so you can play your games with out a disc in your sytem. some sort of licsening is needed. if not one person would buy a game install it, and share it. With some sort of regristraion it allows you to install a game, and no longer need a disc. its convienence. Until they anounce the fees, and how used games work, we are all operating on speculation.

so it install in my system?

then you can sell your disc? then the activation would be close to retail price then... because if not.. that would kill their digital sale... which i think would be big next gen....

i mean why buy digital if you can buy a used copy and pay the cheap activation...


We dont know what the activatoin price will be. we really do not know enough right now. Its specultion by forum goers. Nothing concerning used games has been confirmed or anounced except that it will play used games.

i dont think it is mostly speculation... i think it is logical.....

they would not charge cheap on activation fee.... since they are trying to increase the "profit" by cutting one of the head of the "used game" business.  and if you are right, that it install the whole game in your system, then that would kill their digital sales if they charge cheap activation.... hence the premise that it would not be cheap......


its also logical that they wouldn't want to kill off a part of their customer base that buys used games (or the biggest game retailer in the best market, gamestop). So until they anounce it, its just us forum goers each using our own logic. which is usually each poerson seeing what they want. so again its best to wait for atual facts and info.


The steps MS and EA have taken....are essentially to kill off the used game base whether Gamestop foresees it or not. If your use of your game is stuck to your one account they are shackling you down to an iron clad license. There is no longer any ownership without used games or the ability to have to freedom to lend out your games to friends. As booty said...if you your friend wants to use your game they must use your account or incur the paywall.



S.T.A.G.E. said:
thranx said:
aikohualda said:
thranx said:
aikohualda said:
thranx said:
aikohualda said:
maximrace said:
How I see it: Game is tied to your account. You can untie it so you can bring it back. Gamestore uses new system to put another code on it and that system will give some money to devs depending how old the game is. In the end used games will rise like 5 euros or so in price. This isn't really so bad

so whats the purpose if you can untie them?

might as well remove the whole program about the licensing since it is almost identical as just removing the disc and selling it..... less hassle


so you can play your games with out a disc in your sytem. some sort of licsening is needed. if not one person would buy a game install it, and share it. With some sort of regristraion it allows you to install a game, and no longer need a disc. its convienence. Until they anounce the fees, and how used games work, we are all operating on speculation.

so it install in my system?

then you can sell your disc? then the activation would be close to retail price then... because if not.. that would kill their digital sale... which i think would be big next gen....

i mean why buy digital if you can buy a used copy and pay the cheap activation...


We dont know what the activatoin price will be. we really do not know enough right now. Its specultion by forum goers. Nothing concerning used games has been confirmed or anounced except that it will play used games.

i dont think it is mostly speculation... i think it is logical.....

they would not charge cheap on activation fee.... since they are trying to increase the "profit" by cutting one of the head of the "used game" business.  and if you are right, that it install the whole game in your system, then that would kill their digital sales if they charge cheap activation.... hence the premise that it would not be cheap......


its also logical that they wouldn't want to kill off a part of their customer base that buys used games (or the biggest game retailer in the best market, gamestop). So until they anounce it, its just us forum goers each using our own logic. which is usually each poerson seeing what they want. so again its best to wait for atual facts and info.


The steps MS and EA have taken....are essentially to kill off the used game base whether Gamestop foresees it or not. If your use of your game is stuck to your one account they are shackling you down to an iron clad license. There is no longer any ownership without used games or the ability to have to freedom to lend out your games to friends. As booty said...if you your friend wants to use your game they must use your account or incur the paywall.

I agree with the letting the friends borrow games. that is stupid and anti gamer. on the used games though, they have clearly stated that they have a method for trading and selling used games, they just have not anounced how it will work, or the fees involved. The steps Valve has taken have killed off used gaming too, but with it they brought cheap games, so it worked for consumers. This may work too. I will reserve my judgment until I know more. I personaly dont buy used games, but I want my sytem to support it as I know it's needed to keep others gaming and too keep more money in the gaming economy.  I game almost exclusivly on steam, and now with amazon on demand pc games, so for me the xbone is going to be perfect, if it has cheap games like amazon and steam. if not I may not get it.



thranx said:
S.T.A.G.E. said:
thranx said:
aikohualda said:
thranx said:
aikohualda said:
thranx said:
aikohualda said:
maximrace said:
How I see it: Game is tied to your account. You can untie it so you can bring it back. Gamestore uses new system to put another code on it and that system will give some money to devs depending how old the game is. In the end used games will rise like 5 euros or so in price. This isn't really so bad

so whats the purpose if you can untie them?

might as well remove the whole program about the licensing since it is almost identical as just removing the disc and selling it..... less hassle


so you can play your games with out a disc in your sytem. some sort of licsening is needed. if not one person would buy a game install it, and share it. With some sort of regristraion it allows you to install a game, and no longer need a disc. its convienence. Until they anounce the fees, and how used games work, we are all operating on speculation.

so it install in my system?

then you can sell your disc? then the activation would be close to retail price then... because if not.. that would kill their digital sale... which i think would be big next gen....

i mean why buy digital if you can buy a used copy and pay the cheap activation...


We dont know what the activatoin price will be. we really do not know enough right now. Its specultion by forum goers. Nothing concerning used games has been confirmed or anounced except that it will play used games.

i dont think it is mostly speculation... i think it is logical.....

they would not charge cheap on activation fee.... since they are trying to increase the "profit" by cutting one of the head of the "used game" business.  and if you are right, that it install the whole game in your system, then that would kill their digital sales if they charge cheap activation.... hence the premise that it would not be cheap......


its also logical that they wouldn't want to kill off a part of their customer base that buys used games (or the biggest game retailer in the best market, gamestop). So until they anounce it, its just us forum goers each using our own logic. which is usually each poerson seeing what they want. so again its best to wait for atual facts and info.


The steps MS and EA have taken....are essentially to kill off the used game base whether Gamestop foresees it or not. If your use of your game is stuck to your one account they are shackling you down to an iron clad license. There is no longer any ownership without used games or the ability to have to freedom to lend out your games to friends. As booty said...if you your friend wants to use your game they must use your account or incur the paywall.

I agree with the letting the friends borrow games. that is stupid and anti gamer. on the used games though, they have clearly stated that they have a method for trading and selling used games, they just have not anounced how it will work, or the fees involved. The steps Valve has taken have killed off used gaming too, but with it they brought cheap games, so it worked for consumers. This may work too. I will reserve my judgment until I know more. I personaly dont buy used games, but I want my sytem to support it as I know it's needed to keep others gaming and too keep more money in the gaming economy.  I game almost exclusivly on steam, and now with amazon on demand pc games, so for me the xbone is going to be perfect, if it has cheap games like amazon and steam. if not I may not get it.


In Valves case PC gamers had been forced into digital distribution with licensed games a long time ago. Valve just made it worth their while for lack of ownership. Consoles are the last place of true game ownership. I feel bad everyday I see a PC gamer walk into Best Buy or Gamestop and ask for the game. The physical selection is extremely slim and its only really the major titles that have that type of support.



S.T.A.G.E. said:
thranx said:
S.T.A.G.E. said:
thranx said:
aikohualda said:
thranx said:
aikohualda said:
thranx said:
aikohualda said:
maximrace said:
How I see it: Game is tied to your account. You can untie it so you can bring it back. Gamestore uses new system to put another code on it and that system will give some money to devs depending how old the game is. In the end used games will rise like 5 euros or so in price. This isn't really so bad

so whats the purpose if you can untie them?

might as well remove the whole program about the licensing since it is almost identical as just removing the disc and selling it..... less hassle


so you can play your games with out a disc in your sytem. some sort of licsening is needed. if not one person would buy a game install it, and share it. With some sort of regristraion it allows you to install a game, and no longer need a disc. its convienence. Until they anounce the fees, and how used games work, we are all operating on speculation.

so it install in my system?

then you can sell your disc? then the activation would be close to retail price then... because if not.. that would kill their digital sale... which i think would be big next gen....

i mean why buy digital if you can buy a used copy and pay the cheap activation...


We dont know what the activatoin price will be. we really do not know enough right now. Its specultion by forum goers. Nothing concerning used games has been confirmed or anounced except that it will play used games.

i dont think it is mostly speculation... i think it is logical.....

they would not charge cheap on activation fee.... since they are trying to increase the "profit" by cutting one of the head of the "used game" business.  and if you are right, that it install the whole game in your system, then that would kill their digital sales if they charge cheap activation.... hence the premise that it would not be cheap......


its also logical that they wouldn't want to kill off a part of their customer base that buys used games (or the biggest game retailer in the best market, gamestop). So until they anounce it, its just us forum goers each using our own logic. which is usually each poerson seeing what they want. so again its best to wait for atual facts and info.


The steps MS and EA have taken....are essentially to kill off the used game base whether Gamestop foresees it or not. If your use of your game is stuck to your one account they are shackling you down to an iron clad license. There is no longer any ownership without used games or the ability to have to freedom to lend out your games to friends. As booty said...if you your friend wants to use your game they must use your account or incur the paywall.

I agree with the letting the friends borrow games. that is stupid and anti gamer. on the used games though, they have clearly stated that they have a method for trading and selling used games, they just have not anounced how it will work, or the fees involved. The steps Valve has taken have killed off used gaming too, but with it they brought cheap games, so it worked for consumers. This may work too. I will reserve my judgment until I know more. I personaly dont buy used games, but I want my sytem to support it as I know it's needed to keep others gaming and too keep more money in the gaming economy.  I game almost exclusivly on steam, and now with amazon on demand pc games, so for me the xbone is going to be perfect, if it has cheap games like amazon and steam. if not I may not get it.


In Valves case PC gamers had been forced into digital distribution with licensed games a long time ago. Valve just made it worth their while for lack of ownership. Consoles are the last place of true game ownership. I feel bad everyday I see a PC gamer walk into Best Buy or Gamestop and ask for the game. The physical selection is extremely slim and its only really the major titles that have that type of support.


Yes, but look at what has become of abanding reatil for pc. pc now has more indie games than ever, more selection of games, and its easier to get old games. Basically its made it possible to always get a game. No out of print. No out of stock. Now games can be released for some the smallest niche markets. they each have their pluses and minuses. I think thats why ms still has retail game this gen and didn't go entirely digital. this is realy a transition gen, and the next gen may not have physical discs at all. I really do hope MS is smart about this and does not try to kill off used games. I just cant wait until we know all the info (mainly price) for bothps4 and xbone