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Forums - Politics Discussion - Junk Food Ban/Regulation

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Ban/Regulate Junk Food?

YES, DO everything you can 15 18.07%
 
YES, but just tax it 6 7.23%
 
YES ban HFCS/Corn Fillers 4 4.82%
 
YES regulate HFCS/Corn Fillers 1 1.20%
 
YES remove the Corn Subsidy 5 6.02%
 
YES regulate salt content of food 2 2.41%
 
YES other reasons/combination of above 4 4.82%
 
Maybe, Unsure 2 2.41%
 
NO WAY!!!!! 39 46.99%
 
See Results 5 6.02%
 
Total:83

People already know how I feel about the food and supplement industry -_- But with that said bans is simply not plausible. It is a complicated situation and really it isnt the food industry that is at blame. I mean yeah they make horrible things for people and they often even lie, but when all is said and done it is people who are making choices to eat unhealthy who is at fault.




       

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No ban on junk food. What needs to be done is to make junk food a more expensive option in comparison to healthy food. A junk food tax would be a good policy decision. If taxes are applied to make cigarettes and alcohol to make them more expensive, the same can be done with junk food.



Michael-5 said:
JoeTheBro said:

Can you actually supply us with a valid source stating salt is added to pop to make consumers drink more pop? That's a pretty absurd claim...

Other then what my doctor and co-workers tell me (I work at a medical clinic), no, I don't. However there is no need to add salt to pop, there are other substances which are just as effective at making it fix without the harmful health effects.

Also, I'm reading a lot of Americans talk about their freedoms. If the government subsidizes corn, so that you eat more corn based products, how is that not the same less against your freedom? Remove the subsidy you you truely can eat/drink what you want. This would naturally inflate the cost of chips and other junk food, but if healthier alternatives are cheaper without subsidies, and you eat healthier things as a result, then isn't this truely freedom and not some world where junk food is subsidized?

Also when I made this thread, the intention is that you still get to eat what you like, only it's healthier now. Yes junk food will likely go up in price a bit, but the gain in health from producers putting less salt/fat/sugar in their foods would be worth the stricter regulations. It's no different then speed limits on highways, they are there to keep you alive (in the case of food alive longer).

You need better doctors. The concentration of salt in 12 oz can of coke is .13 PSS or .013%. For comparison the ocean averages around 32 PSS or 3.2% by weight. Obviously drinking from the ocean makes you thirsty. That's because the human body averages only 3 PSS or .3% salt by weight. The concentration of salt is 10 times greater in the ocean than in the body. Meanwhile a can of coke is only 4.3% of the concentration of salt in your body.

Conclusion: The salt in coke doesn't make you thirsty.

Sources for data:

http://antoine.frostburg.edu/chem/senese/101/solutions/faq/salinity-and-molarity.shtml

http://www.madsci.org/posts/archives/2001-03/985293756.Me.r.html

http://i5.minus.com/jn9DSAt37dsGN.jpg

(I really hope I didn't screw up with my calculations. That would be embaressing ;0)



I don't know what HFCS is but it sounds like filth. There is a basic dishonesty to filling out meat with other products.

I love eating fast food but I want the beef to be 100 percent beef and the drink to be sweetened with pure sugar not some synthesized carcinogenic dirt like aspartame.

I don't care about fat content but the artificial shit should be banned. I would happily spend more to get better quality.



Too much planning, and you'll never get anything done.

Karl Pilkington.

OMG You know what? Ignore this thread, I'm tired. I'm asking if we should ban Junk food when I should be asking that we tax/regulate it. Banning junk food is extreme, and in comparison to cigarettes, we never banned then, we just tax an heavily regulate them.

I've even been arguing about regulating the amount of salt/fat in our food.

Sorry, I'll make another thread.



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JoeTheBro said:

You need better doctors. The concentration of salt in 12 oz can of coke is .13 PSS or .013%. For comparison the ocean averages around 32 PSS or 3.2% by weight. Obviously drinking from the ocean makes you thirsty. That's because the human body averages only 3 PSS or .3% salt by weight. The concentration of salt is 10 times greater in the ocean than in the body. Meanwhile a can of coke is only 4.3% of the concentration of salt in your body.

Conclusion: The salt in coke doesn't make you thirsty.

Sources for data:

http://antoine.frostburg.edu/chem/senese/101/solutions/faq/salinity-and-molarity.shtml

http://www.madsci.org/posts/archives/2001-03/985293756.Me.r.html

http://i5.minus.com/jn9DSAt37dsGN.jpg

(I really hope I didn't screw up with my calculations. That would be embaressing ;0)

What the heck is a PSS?

I know pop has anywhere between 40-90mg of Na per 335ml (12 oz) can. You need 1,500mg of salt a day, so a pop can ranges from 2-4.5% of your salt intake. Salt-Water is 3.5% salt. Pop has anywhere from half to nearly one and a half times the salt of saltwater.

Can you live on saltwater? No.

Random google searches tell me that the Human salinity is 0.9%, meaning any liquid with more then 0.9% salt will make you thirstier.



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Michael-5 said:
JoeTheBro said:
Michael-5 said

As for McDonalds 20% beef, it's not a myth. Look into 100% Beef and watch "End of Suburbia." Heck, meat grading is based on the quality of the meat, fat/water content, and beef content. Grade F Beef I believe (I could be wrong on this) is any meat with 49% or less Beef.

Also I have a friend who's father is a butcher. When you salt beef it absorbs a lot of water. Most meats in North America are less then 90% meat because of this trick.

Did you not bother to check the link? Also I'll watch that video on youtube if I can find it.

I just read it now, and I don't agree. The Source is not a credible source, it's a newspaper article from 2007.


First of all, no beef is 100% beef (lots of water content), there used to be a meat supplier for McDonalds called "100% Beef" (Even mentions it in the article).

Maybe it changed, I beleive the "100% Beef" issue was older then 1997, and that article only says that McDonalds meat is made from 100% USDA inspected meat with no salt added. The article doesn't mention the Beef Grade. It could still be grade F (or 1 now on a scale of 1-5 on the USDA website) meat.

You have a reading comprehension problem.  The only meat suppliers mentioned in the article are OSI Foods and Australian Food Corporation.  All the other names are clearly stated as fictitious, imaginary companies.

Snopes is the authoritative website for all popular urban legends, and you have been suckered by TWO of them.  I'm sure you heard it from a "reliable source", but that's just how urban legends propagate.  If Snopes says it's false (as opposed to true or mixed), it means there isn't a single shred of evidence to support this outlandish claim.  The second myth is the existence of Grade F meat: there's no such thing.

http://www.snopes.com/food/prepare/badmeat.asp



ebw said:
Michael-5 said:
JoeTheBro said:
Michael-5 said

As for McDonalds 20% beef, it's not a myth. Look into 100% Beef and watch "End of Suburbia." Heck, meat grading is based on the quality of the meat, fat/water content, and beef content. Grade F Beef I believe (I could be wrong on this) is any meat with 49% or less Beef.

Also I have a friend who's father is a butcher. When you salt beef it absorbs a lot of water. Most meats in North America are less then 90% meat because of this trick.

Did you not bother to check the link? Also I'll watch that video on youtube if I can find it.

I just read it now, and I don't agree. The Source is not a credible source, it's a newspaper article from 2007.


First of all, no beef is 100% beef (lots of water content), there used to be a meat supplier for McDonalds called "100% Beef" (Even mentions it in the article).

Maybe it changed, I beleive the "100% Beef" issue was older then 1997, and that article only says that McDonalds meat is made from 100% USDA inspected meat with no salt added. The article doesn't mention the Beef Grade. It could still be grade F (or 1 now on a scale of 1-5 on the USDA website) meat.

You have a reading comprehension problem.  The only meat suppliers mentioned in the article are OSI Foods and Australian Food Corporation.  All the other names are clearly stated as fictitious, imaginary companies.

Snopes is the authoritative website for all popular urban legends, and you have been suckered by TWO of them.  I'm sure you heard it from a "reliable source", but that's just how urban legends propagate.  If Snopes says it's false (as opposed to true or mixed), it means there isn't a single shred of evidence to support this outlandish claim.  The second myth is the existence of Grade F meat: there's no such thing.

http://www.snopes.com/food/prepare/badmeat.asp

There is also a 100% Canadian Beef company too. I know it's not mentioned in the article, that's why I mention it. Don't be insulting.

That Snopes areticle has 1 reference.

Also I checked out USDA, what is often refered to as Grade F beef is Grade 1 (on a grading of 1 - 5). Anything below 1 is not fit for humans (probably used in dog food). I did mention this if you read the last bracket.



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Ail said:
Kasz216 said:

As for what i think about actual regulations and bans and such....

If the majority of society isn't responsible and is becoming obese....

People want to be obese.

That's just it. To pass laws to protect people from what they want is stupid... since what government is for is to make sure that people can pursue their goals without having to worry about others.

 

Force companies to list accurate health and calorie information sure... anything past that?  No.

 

Oh... as for salt...  Most modern studies actually tend to show salt isn't bad for you.  Just the stuff it's on is bad for you.  Or large increases of salt.  If you have an otherwise healthy hight salt diet... you should be fine.

I'm fine with that but then charge obese people in relation to their weight..

Why should I pay the same price as someone weighing 100 pounds more than I for a plane ticket where clearly it costs more to fly them than me ? ( if my luggage is two pounds over the limit I get charged more but that 300 pounds dude pays the same price ?)

 

Anyway the real issue is healthcare and the fact that it costs more to keep an obese population healthy ( there's a reason the US has some of the highest healthcare costs on earth) and if nothing gets done at some point in the future private health insurances will charge you based on your diet..


I'm fine with that.



Michael-5 said:
Kasz216 said:

Nationmaster is a horrible site for government statistics.

The number one killer in Mexico?   Diabetes.

http://www.voxxi.com/mexico-diabetes-obesity-epidemic/

The reason Europe uses Beat Sugar... (And mexico uses sugar by the way, hence the popularity of "Mexican Coke") is because they don't have crazy corn subsidies like the US does.  Well that and a double whammy tax on sugar imports.


In the US it's cheaper to use HFC then it is Sugar.   Everywhere else in the world it's cheaper to use real sugar.  (Beat or Sugar Cane.)


HFC isn't banned in europe.  There is a production quota... but this was done for economic... not health reasons.

It's also why we use inferior Corn based ethanol when Sugar Cane Ethanol is cheaper and cleaner burning.

Yea, I realize that, I googled that real quick for verification. In the OP I used The World Factbook, it's a lot more accurate and stil Mexico is 7% below USA.

Yes you're right about HFC in Europe, it's not a band, a production quota, but it still forces people not to use it.

Anyway I agree with you, life the corn subsidy. I don't think we have one in Canada, so here we'd have to make regulations for HFC, but for USA I would do a bit of both.

Kasz216 said:

As for what i think about actual regulations and bans and such....

If the majority of society isn't responsible and is becoming obese....

People want to be obese.

That's just it. To pass laws to protect people from what they want is stupid... since what government is for is to make sure that people can pursue their goals without having to worry about others.

Force companies to list accurate health and calorie information sure... anything past that?  No.

Oh... as for salt...  Most modern studies actually tend to show salt isn't bad for you.  Just the stuff it's on is bad for you.  Or large increases of salt.  If you have an otherwise healthy hight salt diet... you should be fine.

I don't think people want to be obese. They might not want to be twigs, but some people like having a little meat on the bone. However obesity is defined as having a BMI of 30+, I think even larger people want a BMI between 25-30 (which is still overweight).

The point of passing laws to tax junk food isn't to prevent people from becoming obese when they don't have to. It's so that people can keep eating the foods they love without physical consequence. Maybe I'm being idealistic, but I bet most chips would taste roughly the same with 2/3rds as much fat, and less salt.

Putting salt in pop for example is something there should be a law against, you shouldn't be more thirsty after drinking.

As for salt...where the heck did you hear that? I have a few doctors in the family and I work at a Medical office, and everyone I work with actually suggests having a lower salt diet then the recommended 2g. There's actually a push from the Medical Association for those Nutritional stickers to indicate a lower salt value.

High salt in your diet means you need a lot of potassium to balance it (look up the sodium potassium pump, it's in your red blood cells). Without Potassium, your body flushes out the salt by making you drink and pee more. Tell me, if your body is trying to flush out the salt, then why is a high salt diet good for you?

All salt does is help increase your odds of heart attack and stroke at an older age because your arteries become more rigid, and unable to expand for the extra water needed to dilute your blood, and then you don't get enough oxygen/red blood cells to your brain/heart.

You need to read up on the consequences of salt in your diet.


If they didn't want to be obese... they wouldn't be... most people have the choice.  People do know what's healthy and what isn't.  All the nutrition facts are right on the food.  (or i suppose it's better to say, people would rather be obese then give up tasty junk food.)

As for Salt.... I have read up the effects of salt in your diet.

According to modern medical research... It has no sceintifically discernable effect.

http://www.scientificamerican.com/article.cfm?id=its-time-to-end-the-war-on-salt

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/jacob-teitelbaum-md/salt-health_b_903673.html

It's not the first time most doctors end up behind the times because they stick to outdated preconcieved notions.

 

Also, World Factbook is a terrible source.  Something like OCED works better but still isn't perfect.