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Forums - Gaming Discussion - NVIDIA: PS4 GPU 3x less powerful than Titan, but more powerful than Xbox 720

fillet on 30 March 2013
ironmanDX said:
fillet said:
ironmanDX said:
NobleTeam360 said:
As long as games looks good on the next xbox I could care less how much more powerful the PS4 GPU.

It didn't really matter this passed gen. Digital Foundry puts Halo 4 up with the ps3's best looking games. It will only add to price, but that's another thread entirely.

Not sure how nVidia would know these figures considering they're not involved with making either consoles. They've actually been bashing the ps4 if I remember. Not sure why anyone is taking them seriously now.


Given what they know, it's easy enough to make an estimate +/- 10% on it's potential. Like with the decapping of the Wii-U, a near enough perfect assessment can be made by adding up the numbers on what can be seen.

Magic sauce doesn't exist anymore because all manufacturers use the same basic technology so actually it is possible to come up with a basically perfect assessment of what the PS4 will be capable of simply by adding up the information that has been released so far.

Then there's the development kits which will have a target clost to the actual product.

Agreed, though nVidia having a devkit is less likely than me having one at this point. I'm just wondering if they're putting it lower on the scale to bash it again.


I don't think their making it look bad here at all. Geforce TiTAN is an £800 graphics card, there's nothing to be ashamed with 3x less powerful than that, also the graph is very misleading. Look at the vertical/Y axis, the actual gap showing the 3x difference should be much wider but because of the non linear scale it makes the gap look very narrow.

Have to remember the Geforce TiTAN (regardless of those further graphs) is approximately 50% faster at 2560x1600 (which is where it would be used most) than the fastest flagship AMD card. It's a 100% premium product, the proper consumer flagship cards are 2x more powerful than the GPU in the PS4 (more or less) which again is not a bad thing. This is taking into account base numbers, the PS4 will use custom technology which should improve things by a small margin from the base 2x rough figure, obviously no heavy OS to run, shared RAM on a fast bus and so forth all count in it's favour.

I mean, imagine if nvidia released a Geforce MEGA TITAN next week lol, and it's 10x more powerful than the PS4 GPU...Does it matter? Not really, the PS4 GPU power is absolute and has been confirmed already to be "good enough".

We're certainly not going to end up with anything like the Wii-U in terms of power, that would be a disaster moving forward. The way it is now, it's powerful enough to make porting PC games easy and that's a big deal.



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ocean-1984 on 30 March 2013

Why is Nvidia bitching about PS4 all the time? They are jealous that Sony picked AMD?



fillet on 30 March 2013
ocean-1984 said:
Why is Nvidia bitching about PS4 all the time? They are jealous that Sony picked AMD?


They're defending their business, they do operate in the same market as AMD, what would anyone expect?



Lawlight on 30 March 2013

Wow, nvidia is really obsessed with the PS4, aren't they?



walsufnir on 30 March 2013
fillet said:

hang on there your vertical axis isn't showing a 1:1 increase as it goes up.

Nothing wrong with being excited about things or whatever but you're misleading people here.

(can't believe people didn't notice the graph going 1 - 10 - 1000 and so on!!!!!!!!!!?

The graph is very strange though, by using that scale nvidia are playing it against themselves! not sure WTF that's all about, very weird. You'd expect AMD to be using a scale like that if anything.


perhaps ppl don't know of other scalings (depends on your education, of course): http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Logarithmic_scale



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walsufnir on 30 March 2013
Lawlight said:

Wow, nvidia is really obsessed with the PS4, aren't they?

mmh, doubtful. they deliver a lot of chips to smartphones and they are trying to expand this business. i think there is a lot more money to make with tegra than amd does with ps4 (and nextbox, of course).



haxxiy on 30 March 2013

The thing is, Titan is another of Nvidia's fake upgrades - it's basically a bigger, hotter, more expensive and more power hungry of the GPUs who already exist in the market for over a year and a half. There was no change on the manufacturing process.

In fact PCs have been rewarded with those for years now in order to make GPUs seem like they follow a steady line of progress. To compare it with the much smaller 7800 and the incredibly tiny Geforce 3 series, who looks like a children's toy next to the Titan, to show how they are pulling ahead of consoles, is kinda shady and paints a false picture of what's going on.



 

 

 

 

 

twilight_link on 30 March 2013
BlueFalcon said:
twilight_link said:

mid-end gaming PC now (months before its launch), low-end gaming PC in few years, platform flushed with horrible looking ports of PC games mostly with bad frame rate and or low resolution.

The PS4 buzz stinks with Vita type fiasco, platform hyped by many bought by few.

Steam Box if done properly can wipe the floor with PS4

Considering the early rumors of PS4/720 called for a GPU of HD6670 or 7670 level of performance, PS4's GPU is actually very respectable. In this economy and financial state of Sony, consumers wouldn't be interested in a $700-1000 PS4, while Sony couldn't afford a $300 loss per each console sold. Since GTX680/7970 use 180W of power in games, those GPUs couldn't be viable, and neither could the  Titan. That leaves us with still expensive HD7950/670 or something reasonable alongside 680M/7970M/HD7870/660. NV charges stupid money for 680M while it's only 5% faster than HD7970M. HD7850/7870 deliver better price/performance than anything NV has had up until 650Ti Boost. An 1152 shader GCN part with 176GB/sec memory bandwidth is actually the best you could have gotten without the price of the console or its power consumption ballooning way above reasonable levels. The bigger dissapointment is the CPU not the GPU.

Steam box won't wipe the floor with PS4 unless it costs substantially more. Since developers will code directly to the metal on PS4, Steam Box would need a way more powerful GPU to even come close to PS4's level of graphics. There is absolutely no way that $450 GTX680 would be able to play 2017-2018 PS4 games at the same level of graphics quality/performance. 

It sounds like you hate consoles in general but don't understand how the console business works. Additionally, if consoles didn't exist, blockbuster games wouldn't be viable since PC platform alone cannot sustain development budgets of games like Bioshock Infinite, BF4, Crysis 3, etc. 


it's xbox360 scenario all over again, with some bang at the beginning and fast moral aging in few years, this time with mid-end and slightly modified off-shelf parts (the aging will be much faster this time), and no Cell for some neat tricks, so what is your point.

The console gaming no longer exist (except for Nintendo) the consoles became nothing but PC for those who are unable to properly configure gaming PC, in fact it brings nothing what makes the PC great eg true RTS and Simulators, just PC like machines for mob.

 

in case of SteamBox if this system brings easy usage and ability to upgrade your box, well then it can became success in the end.

The possibility are endless, in case of Playstation their 1st party output is good on paper but not so much in sales, and with hardly any other exclusive games(most are multiplatform), i think the days of PS brand are over.

Vita is great example how weak their brand actually is.

Additionally, if consoles didn't exist, blockbuster games wouldn't be viable since PC platform alone cannot sustain development budgets of games like Bioshock Infinite, BF4, Crysis 3, etc.

The part in bold is pure speculation, the PC market can support multimilion sellers as HalfLife, The Sims, Myst and others shows, the FPS genre originanted on PC and i think the consoles were responsible for simplification of this genre.



fillet on 30 March 2013
twilight_link said:
BlueFalcon said:
twilight_link said:

mid-end gaming PC now (months before its launch), low-end gaming PC in few years, platform flushed with horrible looking ports of PC games mostly with bad frame rate and or low resolution.

The PS4 buzz stinks with Vita type fiasco, platform hyped by many bought by few.

Steam Box if done properly can wipe the floor with PS4

Considering the early rumors of PS4/720 called for a GPU of HD6670 or 7670 level of performance, PS4's GPU is actually very respectable. In this economy and financial state of Sony, consumers wouldn't be interested in a $700-1000 PS4, while Sony couldn't afford a $300 loss per each console sold. Since GTX680/7970 use 180W of power in games, those GPUs couldn't be viable, and neither could the  Titan. That leaves us with still expensive HD7950/670 or something reasonable alongside 680M/7970M/HD7870/660. NV charges stupid money for 680M while it's only 5% faster than HD7970M. HD7850/7870 deliver better price/performance than anything NV has had up until 650Ti Boost. An 1152 shader GCN part with 176GB/sec memory bandwidth is actually the best you could have gotten without the price of the console or its power consumption ballooning way above reasonable levels. The bigger dissapointment is the CPU not the GPU.

Steam box won't wipe the floor with PS4 unless it costs substantially more. Since developers will code directly to the metal on PS4, Steam Box would need a way more powerful GPU to even come close to PS4's level of graphics. There is absolutely no way that $450 GTX680 would be able to play 2017-2018 PS4 games at the same level of graphics quality/performance. 

It sounds like you hate consoles in general but don't understand how the console business works. Additionally, if consoles didn't exist, blockbuster games wouldn't be viable since PC platform alone cannot sustain development budgets of games like Bioshock Infinite, BF4, Crysis 3, etc. 


it's xbox360 scenario all over again, with some bang at the beginning and fast moral aging in few years, this time with mid-end and slightly modified off-shelf parts (the aging will be much faster this time), and no Cell for some neat tricks, so what is your point.

The console gaming no longer exist (except for Nintendo) the consoles became nothing but PC for those who are unable to properly configure gaming PC, in fact it brings nothing what makes the PC great eg true RTS and Simulators, just PC like machines for mob.

 

in case of SteamBox if this system brings easy usage and ability to upgrade your box, well then it can became success in the end.

The possibility are endless, in case of Playstation their 1st party output is good on paper but not so much in sales, and with hardly any other exclusive games(most are multiplatform), i think the days of PS brand are over.

Vita is great example how weak their brand actually is.


Not sure what you're on about here. You mention PS 1st party exclusives....what about PC exclusives?

Sure there's been SimCity and maybe 1 or 2 other decent high end big bugget games...

 

...In the last 5 YEARS.



Lafiel on 30 March 2013
fillet said:

hang on there your vertical axis isn't showing a 1:1 increase as it goes up.

Nothing wrong with being excited about things or whatever but you're misleading people here.

(can't believe people didn't notice the graph going 1 - 10 - 1000 and so on!!!!!!!!!!?

The graph is very strange though, by using that scale nvidia are playing it against themselves! not sure WTF that's all about, very weird. You'd expect AMD to be using a scale like that if anything.

it's a standard logarithmic scale you'd use to linearize quadratic functions