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Forums - Gaming - Dishonored's lead level designer labels PS4's 8GB RAM "a joy"

avais1993 on 09 March 2013
pokoko said:
"As a level designer we are struggling against memory every day. We cut things, we remove things, we strip things, we split the levels, we remove NPCs from levels because there's not enough memory."

Hogwash. Absolute hogwash. As several people on this site have pointed out, increasing the relative "power" of a console ONLY benefits the "graphics". It has been said enough times that it has solidified into fact. Who are these lowly game developers to dispute that?

Improving RAM can only make games worse, not better. Bigger, richer levels filled with more NPCs and things to experience? Who the hell needs that?


"Bigger, richer levels filled with more NPCs and things to experience? Who the hell needs that?" - not sure if your being sarcastic here :L, but how would that make the games worse?



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Mazty on 09 March 2013
Soleron said:
I'm not against the power increase exactly, but I don't think more freedom = better games. Some of the most memorable game music, images, concepts, levels and so on were born out of the limitations of NES -> N64 consoles. Deciding what to cut can make everything in the final product mean something, be that music channels or NPCs.

Look at Dishonoured. Despite what he said, is there anything outstandingly missing from the game that the extra power will add? Were they really stopped from adding that level they wanted?


More freedom to design, not necessarily to make everything open world, as I agree a well scripted world can be much better than one that emphasises freedom. 



pokoko on 09 March 2013
avais1993 said:
pokoko said:
"As a level designer we are struggling against memory every day. We cut things, we remove things, we strip things, we split the levels, we remove NPCs from levels because there's not enough memory."

Hogwash. Absolute hogwash. As several people on this site have pointed out, increasing the relative "power" of a console ONLY benefits the "graphics". It has been said enough times that it has solidified into fact. Who are these lowly game developers to dispute that?

Improving RAM can only make games worse, not better. Bigger, richer levels filled with more NPCs and things to experience? Who the hell needs that?


"Bigger, richer levels filled with more NPCs and things to experience? Who the hell needs that?" - not sure if your being sarcastic here :L, but how would that make the games worse?

That's just me making fun of the "more power equals worse games" crowd.  We have a number of people who've been preaching that improved hardware is just for "graphics whores" and has no other impact on games other than to magically make them inferior.  I mock them often.



Mazty on 09 March 2013
pokoko said:
avais1993 said:
pokoko said:
"As a level designer we are struggling against memory every day. We cut things, we remove things, we strip things, we split the levels, we remove NPCs from levels because there's not enough memory."

Hogwash. Absolute hogwash. As several people on this site have pointed out, increasing the relative "power" of a console ONLY benefits the "graphics". It has been said enough times that it has solidified into fact. Who are these lowly game developers to dispute that?

Improving RAM can only make games worse, not better. Bigger, richer levels filled with more NPCs and things to experience? Who the hell needs that?


"Bigger, richer levels filled with more NPCs and things to experience? Who the hell needs that?" - not sure if your being sarcastic here :L, but how would that make the games worse?

That's just me making fun of the "more power equals worse games" crowd.  We have a number of people who've been preaching that improved hardware is just for "graphics whores" and has no other impact on games other than to magically make them inferior.  I mock them often.

Good man. It was great to hear the speech by Quantic Dreams that pretty much killed all the "GRAFIX R 4 LOOZERZ!!!" arguments out there. 



Scisca on 09 March 2013
cbarroso09 said:
Why devs are praising 8GB of RAM? if the system will do all those stuff mentioned at the PS4 conference. how in the world devs can use the 8GB? Even computers get slow while gaming and running several apps at the same time. Take into account that recording and streaming video on the background is heavily emphasize on the PS4.

That's something that's bothering me as well. Wii U has 2GB of RAM, but 1 GB goes for the OS. PS4 may have 8 GB, but all this stupid "share" stuff together with the OS will probably take 4 GB, leaving the devs with what they were supposed to get in the first place.

The worst thing for me is that I will never use any of those "social" functions. I will never share anything, stream anything, invite anyone to watch me play or watch others play (lol). I don't care about it and I'm pissed that I'm going to have to pay more for the console for such pointless features and that my console won't be fully benefiting from what is put inside of it. It would be perfect if I could choose an option in game either to play with "share" stuff or disabling it and using the whole power of the console to get better graphics (kinda like on X360 when you get better graphics if you install the game). One can dream...

I guess that since there will be no BC anyway, I'm just going to compare PS4 and X720, see which console has more of this "fat" on it and go with the more core and pure console.



Wii U is a GCN 2 - I called it months before the release!

My Vita to-buy list: The Walking Dead, Persona 4 Golden, Need for Speed: Most Wanted, TearAway, Ys: Memories of Celceta, Muramasa: The Demon Blade, History: Legends of War, FIFA 13, Final Fantasy HD X, X-2, Worms Revolution Extreme, The Amazing Spiderman, Batman: Arkham Origins Blackgate - too many no-gaemz :/

My consoles: PS2 Slim, PS3 Slim 320 GB, PSV 32 GB, Wii, DSi.

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RazorDragon on 09 March 2013

Developers are lazy. Start using compression algorithms, guys!



OdinHades on 09 March 2013

Those 8 GB RAM are really a gift for developers. Not only will loading times be significantly faster, levels will be bigger, more NPS and so on. Besides that, Development will also be faster, because you don't have to optimize every little inch of the engine just to fit it into some minimalistic RAM setup. Thus, development will also get cheaper. It is an absolutely great decision from Sony to go all out with the RAM. That with x86 architecture really brings an new era of gaming.



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Lafiel on 09 March 2013
Scisca said:
cbarroso09 said:
Why devs are praising 8GB of RAM? if the system will do all those stuff mentioned at the PS4 conference. how in the world devs can use the 8GB? Even computers get slow while gaming and running several apps at the same time. Take into account that recording and streaming video on the background is heavily emphasize on the PS4.

That's something that's bothering me as well. Wii U has 2GB of RAM, but 1 GB goes for the OS. PS4 may have 8 GB, but all this stupid "share" stuff together with the OS will probably take 4 GB, leaving the devs with what they were supposed to get in the first place.

The worst thing for me is that I will never use any of those "social" functions. I will never share anything, stream anything, invite anyone to watch me play or watch others play (lol). I don't care about it and I'm pissed that I'm going to have to pay more for the console for such pointless features and that my console won't be fully benefiting from what is put inside of it. It would be perfect if I could choose an option in game either to play with "share" stuff or disabling it and using the whole power of the console to get better graphics (kinda like on X360 when you get better graphics if you install the game). One can dream...

I guess that since there will be no BC anyway, I'm just going to compare PS4 and X720, see which console has more of this "fat" on it and go with the more core and pure console.

will you use remote play with your PSV? the same hardware that enables the sharing functions enables the streaming of any PS4 game to PSV

and no, all that stuff won't use 4GB of Ram, I'm pretty sure 2GB will be reserved for OS and the other functions at most



Scisca on 09 March 2013
Lafiel said:
Scisca said:
cbarroso09 said:
Why devs are praising 8GB of RAM? if the system will do all those stuff mentioned at the PS4 conference. how in the world devs can use the 8GB? Even computers get slow while gaming and running several apps at the same time. Take into account that recording and streaming video on the background is heavily emphasize on the PS4.

That's something that's bothering me as well. Wii U has 2GB of RAM, but 1 GB goes for the OS. PS4 may have 8 GB, but all this stupid "share" stuff together with the OS will probably take 4 GB, leaving the devs with what they were supposed to get in the first place.

The worst thing for me is that I will never use any of those "social" functions. I will never share anything, stream anything, invite anyone to watch me play or watch others play (lol). I don't care about it and I'm pissed that I'm going to have to pay more for the console for such pointless features and that my console won't be fully benefiting from what is put inside of it. It would be perfect if I could choose an option in game either to play with "share" stuff or disabling it and using the whole power of the console to get better graphics (kinda like on X360 when you get better graphics if you install the game). One can dream...

I guess that since there will be no BC anyway, I'm just going to compare PS4 and X720, see which console has more of this "fat" on it and go with the more core and pure console.

will you use remote play with your PSV? the same hardware that enables the sharing functions enables the streaming of any PS4 game to PSV

and no, all that stuff won't use 4GB of Ram, I'm pretty sure 2GB will be reserved for OS and the other functions at most

I may use it, but if you read my posts after the Sony conference, you'd know I'm a huge (the biggest in the forum) hater of the Remote Play feature. I think this will kill multiplats on the Vita and hurt the console big time (devs won't care to port games and just tell us to stream them from the PS4. It's something that's already happening, as I got such a reply from a dev on the PS Blog when I complained about the lack of a Vita version of the game). I want Cross Controls, not Remote Play.

We'll see how much it uses. If the Wii U OS uses 1 GB, this stuff on PS4 can easily eat up to 3-4 GB.



Wii U is a GCN 2 - I called it months before the release!

My Vita to-buy list: The Walking Dead, Persona 4 Golden, Need for Speed: Most Wanted, TearAway, Ys: Memories of Celceta, Muramasa: The Demon Blade, History: Legends of War, FIFA 13, Final Fantasy HD X, X-2, Worms Revolution Extreme, The Amazing Spiderman, Batman: Arkham Origins Blackgate - too many no-gaemz :/

My consoles: PS2 Slim, PS3 Slim 320 GB, PSV 32 GB, Wii, DSi.

TheFallen on 09 March 2013

The argument that a game is made better on constrained hardware is stupid. Going by that "logic", game's will deteriorate in quality every generation. The Zeldas' , Metal Gears, and Halos would be every bit as good and likely better if hardware constraints weren't an issue.