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Forums - Gaming - "Story-driven market has untapped potenital" - David Cage

KeptoKnight said:
CGI-Quality said:
KeptoKnight said:
CGI-Quality said:

Didn't realize I missed the edit. I don't recall ever specifying who I thought had the greatest industry ideas. I just said they aren't exclusive to Nintendo; a rational way to look at it.

Also, way I see it, end sales don't prove who has more / less talent. Looking at Team ICO, for example (Ueda himself, in fact), many would agree that they're some of the great minds of the medium, but those game's tallies pale in comparison to many franchises of lesser critical reception.

'many would agree that they're some of the great minds of the medium." ...and many others dont.

Never argued against objection, though.

w.e

Opinion alert. We need innovators not experts in storytelling but w.e floats ur boat.

the indusrty has alot of innovators, yet few expert storytellers



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bananaking21 said:
KeptoKnight said:
CGI-Quality said:
KeptoKnight said:
CGI-Quality said:

Didn't realize I missed the edit. I don't recall ever specifying who I thought had the greatest industry ideas. I just said they aren't exclusive to Nintendo; a rational way to look at it.

Also, way I see it, end sales don't prove who has more / less talent. Looking at Team ICO, for example (Ueda himself, in fact), many would agree that they're some of the great minds of the medium, but those game's tallies pale in comparison to many franchises of lesser critical reception.

'many would agree that they're some of the great minds of the medium." ...and many others dont.

Never argued against objection, though.

w.e

Opinion alert. We need innovators not experts in storytelling but w.e floats ur boat.

the indusrty has alot of innovators, yet few expert storytellers

heh.  



KeptoKnight said:
bananaking21 said:
KeptoKnight said:
CGI-Quality said:
KeptoKnight said:
CGI-Quality said:

Didn't realize I missed the edit. I don't recall ever specifying who I thought had the greatest industry ideas. I just said they aren't exclusive to Nintendo; a rational way to look at it.

Also, way I see it, end sales don't prove who has more / less talent. Looking at Team ICO, for example (Ueda himself, in fact), many would agree that they're some of the great minds of the medium, but those game's tallies pale in comparison to many franchises of lesser critical reception.

'many would agree that they're some of the great minds of the medium." ...and many others dont.

Never argued against objection, though.

w.e

Opinion alert. We need innovators not experts in storytelling but w.e floats ur boat.

the indusrty has alot of innovators, yet few expert storytellers

heh.  


well atleast back your statement up, you praised mario galaxy, so tell me how that has more innovation in level desgin than uncharted. back it up then ill agree with u. if u cant and i prove that uncharted is more innovative in level desgin then you stop posting your bais all over this thread, agreed?



KeptoKnight said:
CGI-Quality said:
KeptoKnight said:
CGI-Quality said:
KeptoKnight said:


as if that gets any better. Can't go wrong with Nintendo artistic genius like in galaxy 2. They also provide uniqueness in their software.

So do many of Sony and Microsoft's games. I've seen genius from plenty, not just Nintendo.

thanks for the laugh. 

Glad I could entertain educate you with truth. I don't live in a narrow-minded world

not at all. esepcially for someone who has been there since the coleco days. i have it all and fortunate enough with deep pockets. Your statements hold no grounds.

*point in case is that there a big gap between the ones that i call genius and the ones that you consider. i dont give two shits regardless because in the end sales speaks for themselves.

What point were you even originally trying to argue?



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theprof00 said:
okr said:
theprof00 said:
Bad movie director? Look, it's as I said earlier in the adventure game thread. It's hard for you to understand how this is a game because you don't realize it's an adventure game from the same vein as full throttle, samnmax, myst. Granted it's a little more story driven, but all the themes are there. It's an adventure game, and one that sold 2m copies. Adventure games don't sell like that anymore, so he's right. There is untapped potential.

David Cage disagreed already more than 3 years before you posted this.  http://www.gameinformer.com/b/news/archive/2009/12/04/david-cage-interview.aspx

He was obviously trying to disassociate his game from what is considered to be a dead genre. He doesn't even know what genre heavy rain is. He says so in the interview.

It's different. Definitely. It's a modern take on adventure gaming. His qualifications on adventure game tropes are 10 years dated. Recent point and clicks don't have inventories or cutscenes either, but focus very heavily on the characters. There are tons of games like this.

He doesn't like the point&click genre or the adventure genre in general, but he doesn't want to openly admit it. At least that's what I think when I read his statements about the genre. It's okay, but I'd prefer that he'd just admit it and that he wouldn't pretend he liked a genre he obviously doesn't want to be associated with. I'm not sure he knows or even cares about the history of the genre, but Heavy Rain actually is an adventure game. It belongs to the still small subgenre of interactive movies (or interactive drama, which is the term Cage prefers afaik to differentiate his games). The Walking Dead's development process was most probably influenced by Heavy Rain's success imo (and it clearly payed off, but Telltale denied this influence either. Lots of insecure people among adventure developers these days.)

If Cage for once realized that there's often some unintentional irony in his simple statements, e.g. "The games industry offers many games based on violence and adrenaline" => this is true for many games incl. a game called Heavy Rain which starts with kidnapping, which is all about violent acts, about killing or getting killed, about being chased despite being innocent (or not?), about false trails, about building up suspense and adrenaline. If at least the people who interview him would recognize this unintentional irony in his statements, they could have a more interesting discussion with him, but they never do. They are game "journalists", after all.

If Cage wouldn't always blame "the industry" for something he thinks is going wrong, if he'd instead claimed that - say - he brought interactive storytelling in gaming (which was invented decades ago) to a new technical level, I could for once agree with him. If he (or one of those brilliant gaming jounalists who claim that HR and/or TWD revived the "dead" adventure genre) claimed that he single-handedly brought interactive movies back to the table, that the commercial and critical success of Heavy Rain proved that this once ridiculed subgenre has the potential to be more successful today than ever, I'd agree even more.



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riderz13371 said:

 

There's more to games than "heroes with big muscles fighting hordes of monsters", says Quantic Dream's David Cage.

Say what you like about David Cage, there's no faulting his passion for pushing the games industry forward.


In an interview with gamesTM Magazine, David Cage chastised the games industry's reliance on violence and shooters.

"The games industry offers many games based on violence and adrenaline, which works for a certain audience but there is a huge untapped market of people who are not interested in shooting but would be willing to interact in a meaningful emotional experience.

"This medium is truly amazing because of how it can resonate emotionally with the audience. We are just discovering this potential and I am convinced that we will see more and more exciting titles based on totally new paradigms in the coming years."

Though Farenheit and The Nomad's Soul both set early design styles for David Cage, it wasn't until Heavy Rain that he really realised the potential of video games.

"Heavy Rain has been a major turning point for me," says Cage, "it was the game that made me realise that it was possible to use this medium to tell personal things rather than talking about heroes with big muscles fighting hordes of monsters.

"It sounds obvious to any novel or film writer, but for most videogame writers it is still a territory that we hardly explore."

Cage then goes on to explain that most gamers think of story-driven games as being "cerebral or boring" when compared to action games, and that it is his team's duty to "convince this audience that although story-driven games provide a different type of entertainment."

David Cage cited the popularity of Journey and The Walking Dead as proof that there's a "growing interest" in games that dare to be different.

"I believe that this is a very positive thing for the industry," adds Cage. And we do too.

To read the rest of the interview or gamesTM's coverage on Beyond: Two Souls, check out issue 135 out on 14 February.

Link

 

OK, CGI, now I'll try to list the things that disturbs me about this article.

"The games industry offers many games based on violence and adrenaline, which works for a certain audience but there is a huge untapped market of people who are not interested in shooting but would be willing to interact in a meaningful emotional experience."

Here it seems David Cage is equating all games that are not focused on a "meaningful emotional experience" to be about violence and adrenaline, and it is just not true. There are lots of games that aren't about action and aren't about story either. Just look at Brain Age or Animal Crossing or Tetris, or Sodouku.

"Heavy Rain has been a major turning point for me," says Cage, "it was the game that made me realise that it was possible to use this medium to tell personal things rather than talking about heroes with big muscles fighting hordes of monsters.

First off, games have been used to tell personal stories almost since the invention of Video games. David Cage seems to be implying that Heavy Rain brought this to gaming, and it's ignorant and condecending to the games that did it before HR. Also, again, he says that games that doesn't do storytelling are focused on heroes slaying monsters. I know he uses it as a rethorical example, but it still feels so condecending to evey game that doesn't do what he does.

Cage then goes on to explain that most gamers think of story-driven games as being "cerebral or boring" when compared to action games, and that it is his team's duty to "convince this audience that although story-driven games provide a different type of entertainment."

Again, he sounds so condecending, almost like he is implying that people who don't like storiy focused games are stupid. that his games are too "cerebral" for them. What about games like Civilization, Hearts of Iron or Sodouku, are these games "non-cerebral" and about "Heroes with big muscles slaying monsters"

I always get mad reading David Cage interviews because he seems so full of himslef, and ignores the history and diversity of gaming.



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