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Forums - Nintendo Discussion - The Official Legend of Zelda Thread: EoW Trailer Shows Off Still World, Swordfighter Form

 

Best Zelda news from the June Nintendo Direct?

The Legend of Zelda: Echoes of Wisdom 6 75.00%
 
Four Swords on NSO 0 0%
 
Hyrule Edition Switch Lite 2 25.00%
 
Total:8

I actually don't remember much about the Wind Waker reveal. I was very young (9 years old I believe) and I didn't use the internet all that much back then, or at least I didn't use it for gaming. I do remember seeing it on the Club Nintendo Latin America magazine and I was excited, I think how the game looked didn't bothered me at all. 



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There's a conversation about Majora's Mask and Ocarina of Time. I'll just say that the reason I personally didn't buy Majora's Mask at the time was because I'd moved on from the N64. Also, while I owned an N64 Ram Pak (or Jump Pak or whatever the hell it was called), many gamers didn't. Majora's Mask required it.

I still think Cyber is wrong but that's my take on why Majora's Mask didn't sell. From where I sat, most of the Zelda haters that cringed when they saw Wind Waker revealed (myself included) eventually came around by the time the game launched. Hell, I got a free copy of Ocarina of Time just for pre-ordering!

There's details being overlooked by both sides of the discussion. And with my two cents added, I'm off!

*touches nose*
*disappears*



cyberninja45 said:

Majora's Mask is considered a follow up to OOT as much as people consider Other M a follow to corruption, not saying that MM is the same quality as Other M though. Yes SMS gets placed in the same bracket as  WW in every way.

NO I don't think MGS 2 was as anticipated as Zelda probably a final fantasy if I remember correctly.

@ bolded this goes strongly against the common theory that software influences hardware sales are you sure that is your stance on it.

I'm not sure what you're saying in the first paragraph. Can you explain that a little further?

I definitely think Metal Gear Solid was more anticipated than The Legend of Zelda: A Wink Waker. Over six million people bought Metal Gear Solid, and over 100 million would go on to buy PS1. Less than four million bought Majora's Mask, and less than 33 million went on to buy N64. 

As for your last point: I'm not saying hardware sells software; I'm saying that in the specific case of Wind Waker, its sales were limited by the number of people who bought Gamecube, not the other way around. A single game doesn't make a console, at least not in today's market. Even games like Super Mario 64 and Halo, two of the most important launch games in the history of the industry, didn't make winners out of N64 and Xbox, respectively. How could Wind Waker, even with a different art style and mechanics, hope to "save" the Gamecube?



attaboy said:
There's a conversation about Majora's Mask and Ocarina of Time. I'll just say that the reason I personally didn't buy Majora's Mask at the time was because I'd moved on from the N64. Also, while I owned an N64 Ram Pak (or Jump Pak or whatever the hell it was called), many gamers didn't. Majora's Mask required it.

I still think Cyber is wrong but that's my take on why Majora's Mask didn't sell. From where I sat, most of the Zelda haters that cringed when they saw Wind Waker revealed (myself included) eventually came around by the time the game launched. Hell, I got a free copy of Ocarina of Time just for pre-ordering!

There's details being overlooked by both sides of the discussion. And with my two cents added, I'm off!

*touches nose*
*disappears*

This is a good point, and something I overlooked in my posts. The expansion pak was required for Majora's Mask and it came out later in the life cycle of N64, two things that explain its lower sales. It's actually quite similar to Skyward Sword in that regard.

I still stand by my opinion, though.

Did you ever have a chance to go back and play Majora's Mask, attaboy? It's an amazing game. I highly recommend it.



attaboy said:
There's a conversation about Majora's Mask and Ocarina of Time. I'll just say that the reason I personally didn't buy Majora's Mask at the time was because I'd moved on from the N64. Also, while I owned an N64 Ram Pak (or Jump Pak or whatever the hell it was called), many gamers didn't. Majora's Mask required it.

I still think Cyber is wrong but that's my take on why Majora's Mask didn't sell. From where I sat, most of the Zelda haters that cringed when they saw Wind Waker revealed (myself included) eventually came around by the time the game launched. Hell, I got a free copy of Ocarina of Time just for pre-ordering!

There's details being overlooked by both sides of the discussion. And with my two cents added, I'm off!

*touches nose*
*disappears*

Did majora's mask come with the jump pak?  I know donkey kong did.

But i have no idea why it sold that significantly less than Ocarina.  I can guarantee it was not because of how "DIFFERENT" it was.  The average consumer would not have any idea until they bought and played it.  Only a few internet goers would know, and that % was VERY VERY SMALL back then.  remember that was 2000.  How big was internet back then?

I know Ocarina had big advertising, I recall commercials all the time.  Did majora's?  



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Veknoid_Outcast said:
attaboy said:
There's a conversation about Majora's Mask and Ocarina of Time. I'll just say that the reason I personally didn't buy Majora's Mask at the time was because I'd moved on from the N64. Also, while I owned an N64 Ram Pak (or Jump Pak or whatever the hell it was called), many gamers didn't. Majora's Mask required it.

I still think Cyber is wrong but that's my take on why Majora's Mask didn't sell. From where I sat, most of the Zelda haters that cringed when they saw Wind Waker revealed (myself included) eventually came around by the time the game launched. Hell, I got a free copy of Ocarina of Time just for pre-ordering!

There's details being overlooked by both sides of the discussion. And with my two cents added, I'm off!

*touches nose*
*disappears*

This is a good point, and something I overlooked in my posts. The expansion pak was required for Majora's Mask and it came out later in the life cycle of N64, two things that explain its lower sales. It's actually quite similar to Skyward Sword in that regard.

I still stand by my opinion, though.

Did you ever have a chance to go back and play Majora's Mask, attaboy? It's an amazing game. I highly recommend it.


I got it last year as a Platinum reward from Club Nintendo.....and I haven't even pressed start on the title screen yet.  I plan to play it, though!  I swear!!



Veknoid_Outcast said:
cyberninja45 said:
Veknoid_Outcast said:
cyberninja45 said:
Veknoid_Outcast said:

I think you're really missing the big picture. I don't think a single game, especially a game that sold 4.6 million units and is adored by critics and fans, can doom a system. Gamecube did poorly mostly because of its competition: the PS2. It built on the huge install base from PS1, featured an avalanche of must-have titles, and featured DVD playback. 

You're placing the blame unfairly on Wind Waker.


@ bolded

That's exactly my point right there you just said it, Zelda for GC should have been by all means the most anticipated next gen title at the time, and up to the the point of WW reveal it probably was, afterall it was coming off one of the most well known game amongst gamers at the time called Ocarina of Time.

Now I might have just exaggerated a bit on WW impact on GC sales, but it did play a major role in not helping the GC.

But Ocarina came out five years earlier. The most recent console Zelda was Majora's Mask, a game that sold LESS than Wind Waker.

I don't think Wind Waker was the most anticipated sixth-gen title at the time, either. Games like Metal Gear Solid 2, Final Fantasy X, and Super Mario Sunshine were probably higher on that list.

In any event, I believe strongly that the sales of Gamecube influenced the sales of Wind Waker much more than the sales for Wind Waker influenced the sales of Gamecube. I just don't think a realistic-looking Zelda based off the mechanics of Ocarina would have convinced PS2 owners to abandon ship, anymore than Wind Waker did.

Majora's Mask is considered a follow up to OOT as much as people consider Other M a follow to corruption, not saying that MM is the same quality as Other M though. Yes SMS gets placed in the same bracket as  WW in every way.

NO I don't think MGS 2 was as anticipated as Zelda probably a final fantasy if I remember correctly.

@ bolded this goes strongly against the common theory that software influences hardware sales are you sure that is your stance on it.

I'm not sure what you're saying in the first paragraph. Can you explain that a little further?

I definitely think Metal Gear Solid was more anticipated than The Legend of Zelda: A Wink Waker. Over six million people bought Metal Gear Solid, and over 100 million would go on to buy PS1. Less than four million bought Majora's Mask, and less than 33 million went on to buy N64. 

As for your last point: I'm not saying hardware sells software; I'm saying that in the specific case of Wind Waker, its sales were limited by the number of people who bought Gamecube, not the other way around. A single game doesn't make a console, at least not in today's market. Even games like Super Mario 64 and Halo, two of the most important launch games in the history of the industry, didn't make winners out of N64 and Xbox, respectively. How could Wind Waker, even with a different art style and mechanics, hope to "save" the Gamecube?

I will try to repond to you and irstupid in this post since you both seem to have the same idea.

Yes attaboy also brings some very valid reasons why MM did not sell well again. But I think you and irstupid are trying to downplay OOT popularity at the time to bolster WW image.

If as you say OOT was not much of a system seller at the time or not an anticipated game. Well I have a guiness world record book 2000's edition that list OOT as having the record for the most advanced orders at the time. Think about it, at a time when gaming was not as "mainstream" at the time without the popularity of the internet and what not OOT broke pre order records. If you were to put OOT into a Modern day perspective, comapring  the amount of gamers back then to the amount now, OOT would be at the level of GTA V or a  COD or whatever.

I will explain why this is significant . Gaming was for most intent and purposes a "niche" hobby back then once you was a "gamer" you would have followed gaming news no matter where it came from, so by extension you followed all your favourite gaming franchises with a lot more passion back then (I knew that Super Mario World 2 was not the same as SMW and was probably less than 10 years at the time). And as I just showed with OOT holding the largest pre order record at the time it was one of the most anticipated game with a very loyal following, because as I said in an earlier post it also built a reputation over nes and snes as a solid game.

Now all that is to say that yes people knew what MM was and they knew it was not in the same vain as OOT. And also that a next gen zelda was one of the most anticipated titles at the time up until WW reveal



My 3ds friendcode: 5413-0232-9676 (G-cyber)



irstupid said:
attaboy said:
There's a conversation about Majora's Mask and Ocarina of Time. I'll just say that the reason I personally didn't buy Majora's Mask at the time was because I'd moved on from the N64. Also, while I owned an N64 Ram Pak (or Jump Pak or whatever the hell it was called), many gamers didn't. Majora's Mask required it.

I still think Cyber is wrong but that's my take on why Majora's Mask didn't sell. From where I sat, most of the Zelda haters that cringed when they saw Wind Waker revealed (myself included) eventually came around by the time the game launched. Hell, I got a free copy of Ocarina of Time just for pre-ordering!

There's details being overlooked by both sides of the discussion. And with my two cents added, I'm off!

*touches nose*
*disappears*

Did majora's mask come with the jump pak?  I know donkey kong did.

But i have no idea why it sold that significantly less than Ocarina.  I can guarantee it was not because of how "DIFFERENT" it was.  The average consumer would not have any idea until they bought and played it.  Only a few internet goers would know, and that % was VERY VERY SMALL back then.  remember that was 2000.  How big was internet back then?

I know Ocarina had big advertising, I recall commercials all the time.  Did majora's?  


Yes gamers did know how different it was see my response to Veknoid_Outcast



My 3ds friendcode: 5413-0232-9676 (G-cyber)



irstupid said:
attaboy said:
There's a conversation about Majora's Mask and Ocarina of Time. I'll just say that the reason I personally didn't buy Majora's Mask at the time was because I'd moved on from the N64. Also, while I owned an N64 Ram Pak (or Jump Pak or whatever the hell it was called), many gamers didn't. Majora's Mask required it.

I still think Cyber is wrong but that's my take on why Majora's Mask didn't sell. From where I sat, most of the Zelda haters that cringed when they saw Wind Waker revealed (myself included) eventually came around by the time the game launched. Hell, I got a free copy of Ocarina of Time just for pre-ordering!

There's details being overlooked by both sides of the discussion. And with my two cents added, I'm off!

*touches nose*
*disappears*

Did majora's mask come with the jump pak?  I know donkey kong did.

But i have no idea why it sold that significantly less than Ocarina.  I can guarantee it was not because of how "DIFFERENT" it was.  The average consumer would not have any idea until they bought and played it.  Only a few internet goers would know, and that % was VERY VERY SMALL back then.  remember that was 2000.  How big was internet back then?

I know Ocarina had big advertising, I recall commercials all the time.  Did majora's?  

Quick Google search:

Sold seperately. 



cyberninja45 said:
irstupid said:

Did majora's mask come with the jump pak?  I know donkey kong did.

But i have no idea why it sold that significantly less than Ocarina.  I can guarantee it was not because of how "DIFFERENT" it was.  The average consumer would not have any idea until they bought and played it.  Only a few internet goers would know, and that % was VERY VERY SMALL back then.  remember that was 2000.  How big was internet back then?

I know Ocarina had big advertising, I recall commercials all the time.  Did majora's?  


Yes gamers did know how different it was see my response to Veknoid_Outcast

I had absolutely no idea they were different.  I was expecting the same game as ocarina of time when i bought majoras mask.

And I consider myself a very big gamer.