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Forums - Nintendo Discussion - System Faults Didn't Stop THQ From Bringing Metro: Last Light To Wii U

Viper1 said:
S.Peelman said:

200 MHz .

It was 128-bit though, I don't think WiiU boasts that!

Actually, the CPU is just 32 bit.  It was the GPU that was 128 bit.  No console has had a 128 bit CPU.  And it's very unlikely any console ever will.

pezus said:

It's called widening your horizon and informing yourself.

I'd almost agree with that if half of them posted just as often in the actual PS3 boards (which as I said, half don't) and all they post is negativety.  That's not widening your horizon, that's trolling to feel surprior and get a rise out of people.

pezus said:
snowdog said:
It has nothing to do with the hardware and everything to do with the state of THQ's finances. It was pretty clear right from the beginning tbh.

Wasn't porting to Wii U supposed to be dirt cheap and easy? I saw someone throwing around 2 weeks of dev time for the Darksiders II port...

It was 2 weeks to get the engine code working.  Not 2 weeks to port the entirety of content.   And yes, it is cheap to port..relative to normal port costs.  Ubisoft stated it costs $1.2 or $1.3 million ( I forget the exact figure) to port to Wii U.

But if you don't have $1.2 million to allocate, or even people sitting idle to work on it, or enough development kits to port the game, or the engine will take a lot of tweaks...in those cases, it still takes more planning and it's not just a "hey, let's magically put our game on Wii U".   It's cheaper and easier than before but that doesn't make it a simple whim either.

WindyCityHeat said:
It doesn't matter what their reason was. The fact that wiiu is missing yet another multiplat is the point. There's nothing to defend, nintendo messed up again lol.

#bigsurprise

More than 20 posts in the last month.  All but 2 were in the Nintendo board.  All were berating Nintendo.   Is that all you plan to do here?  Because it's already gotten old.

yep it is not widening horizons it is trolling my friend.



34 years playing games.

 

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VGKing said:
It's THQ they don't have the money to develop on so many platforms, especially on a game that probably won't sell millions.

Vgking for the first time in history i agree with you!!.

+1



34 years playing games.

 

Mazty said:
While wii U owners may be happy to buy more games in a care-free mindset, the fact is a developer would probably still sell more on the 360 with a more scrutinising market simply due to the sheer volume of 360's out there.

Actually this descision is simple economics. To try and claim it's a bad one is just a failing to do the math on your part, sorry. The fact that they aren't alone in this decision should speak volumes.

That's quite a claim to make of a guy with a PhD in mathematics, I must say.

There's a funny thing about "simple economics" - it's almost always bad economics. Economics is not a simple field, it is a highly complex area in which things are so non-linear, it's almost absurd. Decisions made right now, when the Wii U has a small install base, can make massive differences to the situation if and when the Wii U has an install base in the high double digits of millions.

This is why, for instance, so-called casual games did so well on the Wii - developers of these games put them on the Wii early, and established a strong install base for these games. And so, you now have, for example, Just Dance 4 on the Wii being the top-selling game of the week after 10 weeks on the market, despite the Wii's successor having been released already.

Consider the Rabbids franchise. Ubisoft released a strong version of the game on the Wii at launch. Now, they've had repeated million-sellers in the franchise on the system, while other versions, on other platforms, struggle. Why? Because they established a fanbase on the system from launch.

This is also why you always hear Ubisoft talking about the importance of launching new IPs at the beginning of a console's life - because that is how you create a strong and stable fanbase.

It's not a simple concept, I know. But your reductionist approach to economics has been disproven time and again, in the videogame industry and in other industries.



Nem said:

Despite that beeing a faulty comparison, we can agree that the 1.5Ghz and the 3Ghz are equally as powerful in that analysis. That also proves the point.

Clock speed does not equal power.

Also lets link a proper benchmark:

http://www.anandtech.com/bench/Product/47?vs=677

Not only whats convenient for your argument, and the i7 is clearly more powerful.

 

But yeah i should've used a clearer example. I guess logic and common sense just isnt enough sometimes.


As I said the overhead assosiated with multiple cores will mean that the i3 would still win in most benchmarks, tho roughly equal in synthetic tests. And the i7 in the benchmark is much closer in clock rate than in your example, in fact the gap is only half the  difference and you won't find any benchmarks which are more than double the performance. So given your example the i3 would win in most benchmarks.

I never had a problem with the premise just your bad example. And clock rate does equal power using the same architecture and core count, I guess logic is a problem for some people.



@TheVoxelman on twitter

Check out my hype threads: Cyberpunk, and The Witcher 3!

Aielyn said:
Mazty said:
While wii U owners may be happy to buy more games in a care-free mindset, the fact is a developer would probably still sell more on the 360 with a more scrutinising market simply due to the sheer volume of 360's out there.

Actually this descision is simple economics. To try and claim it's a bad one is just a failing to do the math on your part, sorry. The fact that they aren't alone in this decision should speak volumes.

That's quite a claim to make of a guy with a PhD in mathematics, I must say.

There's a funny thing about "simple economics" - it's almost always bad economics. Economics is not a simple field, it is a highly complex area in which things are so non-linear, it's almost absurd. Decisions made right now, when the Wii U has a small install base, can make massive differences to the situation if and when the Wii U has an install base in the high double digits of millions.

This is why, for instance, so-called casual games did so well on the Wii - developers of these games put them on the Wii early, and established a strong install base for these games. And so, you now have, for example, Just Dance 4 on the Wii being the top-selling game of the week after 10 weeks on the market, despite the Wii's successor having been released already.

Consider the Rabbids franchise. Ubisoft released a strong version of the game on the Wii at launch. Now, they've had repeated million-sellers in the franchise on the system, while other versions, on other platforms, struggle. Why? Because they established a fanbase on the system from launch.

This is also why you always hear Ubisoft talking about the importance of launching new IPs at the beginning of a console's life - because that is how you create a strong and stable fanbase.

It's not a simple concept, I know. But your reductionist approach to economics has been disproven time and again, in the videogame industry and in other industries.

Considering that 1/3rd of all Wii U's have been sold in Japan, what exact estimate do you think of Wii U owners will buy Metro for the Wii U? You also have to consider the extra costs for developing for a new platform, and specifically programming for the pad. 

In short, it's really not worth it when you consider the much wider and lucrative markets of the PC, 360 and PS3. Comparing the Wii to the Wii U is flawed as the Wii did not offer the same games as the PS3 and 360 and was being offered when all the consoles were relatively young. The Wii U is trying to directly compete against a market of over 140 million console sales, and that's ignoring the PC.

State me the math to show otherwise plx. 



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WindyCityHeat said:
It doesn't matter what their reason was. The fact that wiiu is missing yet another multiplat is the point. There's nothing to defend, nintendo messed up again lol.

#bigsurprise

You really need to change your posting tone and habits.



Monster Hunter: pissing me off since 2010.

Mazty said:
Considering that 1/3rd of all Wii U's have been sold in Japan, what exact estimate do you think of Wii U owners will buy Metro for the Wii U? You also have to consider the extra costs for developing for a new platform, and specifically programming for the pad.

In short, it's really not worth it when you consider the much wider and lucrative markets of the PC, 360 and PS3. Comparing the Wii to the Wii U is flawed as the Wii did not offer the same games as the PS3 and 360 and was being offered when all the consoles were relatively young. The Wii U is trying to directly compete against a market of over 140 million console sales, and that's ignoring the PC.

State me the math to show otherwise plx.

You are again completely ignoring the whole point of my post, which is to say that it's not about the current market. It's about where the market will be in 2-3 years.

Besides which, the game isn't slated to release until March. By then, it is expected to have an install base of 5.5 million or so, and even with Japan assumed to have 2 million of that, and that nobody in Japan will want Metro, that's still 3.5 million people to sell to.

Now consider that the extra costs for developing for a new platform will reduce costs for future titles developed for that platform, and is thus an investment. Experience with the pad will also help them to improve their future Wii U titles.

That you then referred to "lucrative markets of the PC, 360 and PS3" shows me that you really don't know what you're talking about. Why do you think that THQ is in a hole in the first place? Why are the tipped to be the next publisher to collapse? Well, let's look at their support for the Wii... other than a few select titles, their Wii games consist of low quality licensed games (like Ratatouille). Of those few exceptions, there were a couple of weak WWE games, Big Beach Sports (and similar), a forgettable racing title that was launched late (compared to other platform versions), de Blob, Deadly Creatures, Drawn to Life... and that's it. Oh, except for their uDraw thing. For the entire generation. And yet, they still saw a better net performance on Wii than on PS3, and comparable to 360.

Note that their best-rated game of all time on the Wii was "You Don't Know Jack", with de Blob at second place with 81.12% according to GameRankings.

The fact of the matter is, THQ didn't put in the effort with the Wii, and they're not really putting in the effort with the Wii U. And it'll only hurt them further.



thq still butthurt over deadly creatures and the wii u controller making their utablet obselete.



Aielyn said:
Mazty said:
Considering that 1/3rd of all Wii U's have been sold in Japan, what exact estimate do you think of Wii U owners will buy Metro for the Wii U? You also have to consider the extra costs for developing for a new platform, and specifically programming for the pad.

In short, it's really not worth it when you consider the much wider and lucrative markets of the PC, 360 and PS3. Comparing the Wii to the Wii U is flawed as the Wii did not offer the same games as the PS3 and 360 and was being offered when all the consoles were relatively young. The Wii U is trying to directly compete against a market of over 140 million console sales, and that's ignoring the PC.

State me the math to show otherwise plx.

You are again completely ignoring the whole point of my post, which is to say that it's not about the current market. It's about where the market will be in 2-3 years.

Besides which, the game isn't slated to release until March. By then, it is expected to have an install base of 5.5 million or so, and even with Japan assumed to have 2 million of that, and that nobody in Japan will want Metro, that's still 3.5 million people to sell to.

Now consider that the extra costs for developing for a new platform will reduce costs for future titles developed for that platform, and is thus an investment. Experience with the pad will also help them to improve their future Wii U titles.

That you then referred to "lucrative markets of the PC, 360 and PS3" shows me that you really don't know what you're talking about. Why do you think that THQ is in a hole in the first place? Why are the tipped to be the next publisher to collapse? Well, let's look at their support for the Wii... other than a few select titles, their Wii games consist of low quality licensed games (like Ratatouille). Of those few exceptions, there were a couple of weak WWE games, Big Beach Sports (and similar), a forgettable racing title that was launched late (compared to other platform versions), de Blob, Deadly Creatures, Drawn to Life... and that's it. Oh, except for their uDraw thing. For the entire generation. And yet, they still saw a better net performance on Wii than on PS3, and comparable to 360.

Note that their best-rated game of all time on the Wii was "You Don't Know Jack", with de Blob at second place with 81.12% according to GameRankings.

The fact of the matter is, THQ didn't put in the effort with the Wii, and they're not really putting in the effort with the Wii U. And it'll only hurt them further.

In 2 -3 years the market will be with the next generation of consoles (PS4/next 360). This current generation will be left behind and therefore it's not worth developing for the Wii U. Sales haven't been brilliants, Nintendo stocks are bombing, and the Wii U offers almost the same power as the 360 and PS3.

You also need to consider that many wii U owners will probably own either a PS3 or 360. As the Wii U is just a multiplatform console as such, why bother developing for it at this moment in time? Trying to set up brand loyalty is ludcirous as there is no guarentee it'll work. Do you really think THQ want to be taking gambles when all the other devs are giving the WIi U a miss?

THQ is in a hole because it made some very, very bad games and even worse management decisions, not because people refuse to buy games...

You idea that support for the Wii is indicitive of success is ludicrous. How many core game publishers for the Wii have gone bust? Oh right, most of them. Deep Silver? Eurocom? Remember those names? Also by your bizzare-o logic, Treyarch and Infinity Ward should be bust...
How much of that net performance on the Wii was to do with the hardware sold rather then anything else? And outside of Nintendo and bundled titles, how well did games sell?

No one other then Nintendo put effort into the Wii. And frankly not putting effort into the Wii U makes sense as people will still buy the games, but just for their other console. That way you save dev costs and still sell just as many titles. 



Ultimately, I just want the Wii U to have the big JRPGs, so as long as they are dominating Japan, they'll have those and I'll be a really happy man(lets see how much dumber SE and other JP devs can be :D ). I'll keep using my PC as my primary shooter box of course, although the notion of using the game pad as a scanner in Aliens sounds really intriguing for sure, that might be a reason why I'd get that for Wii U instead.

Sucks that THQ is in such bad position right now, but looking at Metro 2033 on PC, I'd say optimizing codes on the Wii U might not be a strong point for the devs no matter how much resource you pour into the Wii U in such a short time frame, I honestly don't think they can do it, they simply don't have the man power or talent to pull it off, Metro devs are just not good enough.