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Forums - Nintendo - Online Petition demanding Dark Souls II for Wii U

freebs2 on 11 December 2012
binary solo said:
freebs2 said:
binary solo said:
freebs2 said:

binary solo said:

The only people who fall into the can't afford PC gaming rig/don't want to pay for XBL Gold / don't have or want a PS3 are...WIi owners. So bascially, bring Dark Souls to Wii U because that's the system Wii owners who are into hard and violent games will buy. Wow most revelatory! Should be good for about 100K sales.

I've never seen any violent game on Wii, except those developed during coffee breaks whith a ridiculous budget, so it has yet to be proven how much violent games could sell on WiiU. So far ZombieU is the 2nd most sold game on WiiU, right?

About hard games... SSB is very competitve at high difficult levels -> 11m copies; DKCR is the hardest plaform game on sale at full price -> 5.75m copies; Monster Hunter isn't exactly an easy game -> 2m copies.

edit: Anyway I wouldn't even consider Dark Souls a really violent game, it's a fantasy game whith a very dark tone, but you don't see in it more blood and gore than in the average RPG.

Hence hard AND violent. It would be beyond ignorant for anyone to claim Nintendo doesn't do hard games.

Do you see the market for SSB, DKCR and Monster Hunter having a significant cross over with the market for Dark Souls 2? Of those 3 Monster Hunter, perhaps. That's a game that sold well, but not amazingly well. And while they're in the same broad genre they aren't much alike. So I don't see much of a ppoint to be made by looking at the sales of those 3 games as any kind of indicator of the sales potential for DS2. It would struggle to sell 250K I reckon. The market for Dark Souls is heavily weighted to PS3 because that was where it all started with Demon's Souls. Dark Souls PS3 > 2x 360. I would think 360 > 2x Wii U if it did get a Wii U release.

I haven't yet played Dark Souls, but I've played Demon's Souls. Demon's Souls is a violent game. Its ratings classification is "strong violence". I assume Dark Souls is on the same level in terms of violence as Demon's Souls.

I think it's a mistake for Wii U fans to look backwards and demand last gen IPs make a transisiton to Wii U. Have DS2 by all means, but don't expect it to do anything for WIi U sales. New IP for the new generation it what's needed.

That's not what I meant, of course I'm not expecting a console sales boost from DS2. But if everyone comes up with the same unproven argument "hardcore games don't sell on Wii", and nobody actually tries to bring an hardcore IP on it then the situation will never change.

It's true the DS market is weighted on Ps3 (that's imo partially because Demon Souls was initally on Ps3, as you suggest, and partially because 360 almost doesn't exist in the japanese market, hence all jap sales are on Ps3), but that doesn't mean FromSoftware did't get a benefit porting the game on 360 and on PC. Also, you have to consider things dinamically, when you get a game ported on a new platform for the first time you have yet to enstablish a reputation within the new console userbase, so it's kind of natural the game initally sells less on 360 compared to the Ps3 where the game is esntablished. Once you have established the game on both platforms, than the overall userbase will grow, I'm confident DS2 will sell more copies on 360 and PC.

But really Dark Souls 2 is not the game to prove "hard core" sells on Nintendo. It's only a moderately popular game on its main platform to start with. I agree with someone upthread who says they'd sign a petition for GTA5. Now that's a hard core game with a large fanbase which could attract a lot of sales on Wii U. Probably won't win many converts from the other platforms, but hopefully the Nintendo hard core would get behind it and give it mutli-million sales.

DS2 should expand a bit on 360, but I dont think it'll get anywhere near PS3 numbers. And It's not just Japan that gave PS3 the edge with Dark Souls. Dark Souls sold considerably more on PS3 in North America. And considering the difference in install base that's huge even if the PS3 market was primed with Demon's Souls.

Ah ok, I think I misunderstood you. Yes, to prove there is an hardcore market on WiiU I agree there are more relevant games than DS2, like GTA for the matter. That said, I don't see anything wrong make a petition for DS2, it wouldn't damage neither the console nor the developer.



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outlawauron on 12 December 2012
oniyide said:
outlawauron said:
gronk-bonk said:
Sommernacht said:
Why do we need another sequel to a game which has never been on a Nintendo console? I thought about signing the petition but then I changed my mind. First of all I highly doubt this will change anything but more importantly I am sure this game will not sell on the Wii U. So I guess the developers know what they're doing.

If you played the first Dark Souls get the sequel on your PS360/PC.

I'd personally rather have some exclusives coming to Wii U which really make use of the Gamepad other than just putting an inventory on there (which IMO definitely is no USP for the Wii U version).

Agreed.

At this point of the wii u's life - i believe the only way 3rd parties can get some success on the wii u is making exclusives. They should try to appeal to the nintendo crowd and not to the ps3/360 base because they are not gonna buy a wii u port if they already can get the 360/ps3 version.

The sooner people realize this, the better off we all will be.

Didnt they do something similar with Wii? and I dont think that went over well with some folks. (financial it did)

Depends on where you look and how you look at it? Some of the equa Wii versions were late or had some circumstance against them that people use to justify the sales. Truly, it's just userbases and people buy big games where their friends are (assuming the big games we're talking about are multiplayer, because that's mostly true).



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oniyide on 12 December 2012
outlawauron said:
oniyide said:
outlawauron said:
gronk-bonk said:
Sommernacht said:
Why do we need another sequel to a game which has never been on a Nintendo console? I thought about signing the petition but then I changed my mind. First of all I highly doubt this will change anything but more importantly I am sure this game will not sell on the Wii U. So I guess the developers know what they're doing.

If you played the first Dark Souls get the sequel on your PS360/PC.

I'd personally rather have some exclusives coming to Wii U which really make use of the Gamepad other than just putting an inventory on there (which IMO definitely is no USP for the Wii U version).

Agreed.

At this point of the wii u's life - i believe the only way 3rd parties can get some success on the wii u is making exclusives. They should try to appeal to the nintendo crowd and not to the ps3/360 base because they are not gonna buy a wii u port if they already can get the 360/ps3 version.

The sooner people realize this, the better off we all will be.

Didnt they do something similar with Wii? and I dont think that went over well with some folks. (financial it did)

Depends on where you look and how you look at it? Some of the equa Wii versions were late or had some circumstance against them that people use to justify the sales. Truly, it's just userbases and people buy big games where their friends are (assuming the big games we're talking about are multiplayer, because that's mostly true).


im talking these "NINTY" games, lets be honest the most popular type of games on Wii were your sports, dance, and fitness games. And 3rd parties did make those in abundance, thats what i was talking about. 



Siko1989 on 12 December 2012

I dont even know why i keep signing these... they barely work.




superchunk on 12 December 2012

well, its approaching 9,000 signatures. I wonder how many it will need to get attention.

I also wonder what factor they use when considering these petitions, if at all.

Maybe a multiplier of 10? so 9k would be 90k real owners? Figure they need 250k sales to make the ROI on another port worth it? So at least 25k signatures?

idk... just tossing out numbers.



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SvennoJ on 12 December 2012
KylieDog said:
Dr.Grass said:
KylieDog said:


Can you play Dark Souls single player and/or completely offline?  Your reply highlights how completely you fail to grasp good game design.


This has probably gone on too long already, but there is a point that needs to be made clearer.

 

- You are claiming that the inability to pause is a design flaw. Specifically this is a flaw for the offline player.

- But what is the function of the pause button in games akin to Dark Souls? It is simply to ensure that there can be no lives lost during a break in play for the player. Now let me ask you this, is it not possible to simply stand in a corner where you can't be spotted for as long as you like, thereby fulfulling the full purpose of the pause button? You can peacefully go to the toilet or have a joint or whatever and know for certain that you're still alive.

- If one wanted to pause a game mid battle, or after being spotted by the enemy, then:

 

1:The player might want to alter his equipment for the specific situation. This is clearly against the entire ethos of the Souls series, and it is much appreciated by the devout fans. (Of course you are not vying for this)

2:The player might want time to consider the best course of action. This is both unrealistic and again against the entire ethos of Souls. The fact that you have to ALWAYS be ready to fight IS THE VERY SUBSTANCE that gives these games life.

3:The player might want to catch his breath due to being caught off guard. This would take away the suspense of the game immeasurably.

 

But you're going to argue that these above 3 points are not what you are referring to. So now I ask you this, should a feature be implemented extraneously if it is implicitly possible to achieve without it's very presence!? Now you are the one causing difficulty, because there should be times where it's impossible to pause due to an enemy being alert to one's presence, or being mid battle, which would inherently changes the entire structure of the game and turn it into a mundane experience - but you're surely not referring to this.

The very fact that there is no pause button adds immensely to the game.


...or you know, I'm mid battle and the telephone rings, or there is a knock at the door, or my partner wants me for something.  Your points are exaggerated opinion at best,

- I've already pointed out that a pause ability doesn't need to have anything to do with inventory so this 'need to prepare' argument is completely void. 

- Is nothing stopping someone using a guide to prepare for battle and know a tactic ahead of time, pausing to figure out a tactic is no different, if the player wants to cheapen the experience for themselves it is up to the player, failing to include basic game design features is not an excuse for this.

- Pause to catch breath during battle?   Who does that exactly, extremely fat people who exhaust themselves pressing buttons on a controller?  Is a straight up laughable excuse.


My points are real issues.  A door will knock unexpectedly, a phone will ring unexpectedly, there are a million real things that can not be avoid and aren't player choice if they happen and a pasue feature, a basic feature, is needed.  Is why the feature was invented, because of the real world interupting gaming.

Unless you're suggesting Dark Souls is a game for social hermits who have no friends to call them, no family or partners to interupt them and live miles away from anywhere so nobody will ever knock on a door.

I was going to say the same thing. I have died unnecesarily in Dark Souls because of the baby waking up crying mid engagement. And when my 3 year old unexpectantly walks into the room it's nice to be able to pause instead of give him nightmares.

You can lock out everything during pause and blank the screen, zero advantage, still possible to play without resorting to waiting until the middle of the night tom play undisturbed.

One good thing I hope they keep is the save anywhere function. Games that expect you to get to some arbitrary checkpoint or lose all progress are far worse.



Roma on 12 December 2012

haha at this thread!

it seems so important for the non Nintendo fans that this game does not got to Nintendos WiiU!

I think some might kill themselves if it does end up on WiiU!

there where a few games that where not announced for WiiU until a month or so before the games release on other platforms like COD:BO and I donno some other games...

honestly I just want this game on WiiU for the luls it will bring for a couple of days!

and yes i will buy it to show support if it does come to WiiU!



    R.I.P Mr Iwata :'(

zarx on 12 December 2012
superchunk said:
well, its approaching 9,000 signatures. I wonder how many it will need to get attention.

I also wonder what factor they use when considering these petitions, if at all.

Maybe a multiplier of 10? so 9k would be 90k real owners? Figure they need 250k sales to make the ROI on another port worth it? So at least 25k signatures?

idk... just tossing out numbers.


PC petition got a official acknowledgement at ~66k from a quick search, after one week. So Wii U owners will need to get a move on. I would say 30-40k signs is probably where it needs to get by the end of the week otherwise it will lose momentum.



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Dr.Grass on 12 December 2012
KylieDog said:
Dr.Grass said:
KylieDog said:


Can you play Dark Souls single player and/or completely offline?  Your reply highlights how completely you fail to grasp good game design.


This has probably gone on too long already, but there is a point that needs to be made clearer.

 

- You are claiming that the inability to pause is a design flaw. Specifically this is a flaw for the offline player.

- But what is the function of the pause button in games akin to Dark Souls? It is simply to ensure that there can be no lives lost during a break in play for the player. Now let me ask you this, is it not possible to simply stand in a corner where you can't be spotted for as long as you like, thereby fulfulling the full purpose of the pause button? You can peacefully go to the toilet or have a joint or whatever and know for certain that you're still alive.

- If one wanted to pause a game mid battle, or after being spotted by the enemy, then:

 

1:The player might want to alter his equipment for the specific situation. This is clearly against the entire ethos of the Souls series, and it is much appreciated by the devout fans. (Of course you are not vying for this)

2:The player might want time to consider the best course of action. This is both unrealistic and again against the entire ethos of Souls. The fact that you have to ALWAYS be ready to fight IS THE VERY SUBSTANCE that gives these games life.

3:The player might want to catch his breath due to being caught off guard. This would take away the suspense of the game immeasurably.

 

But you're going to argue that these above 3 points are not what you are referring to. So now I ask you this, should a feature be implemented extraneously if it is implicitly possible to achieve without it's very presence!? Now you are the one causing difficulty, because there should be times where it's impossible to pause due to an enemy being alert to one's presence, or being mid battle, which would inherently changes the entire structure of the game and turn it into a mundane experience - but you're surely not referring to this.

The very fact that there is no pause button adds immensely to the game.


...or you know, I'm mid battle and the telephone rings, or there is a knock at the door, or my partner wants me for something.  Your points are exaggerated opinion at best,

- I've already pointed out that a pause ability doesn't need to have anything to do with inventory so this 'need to prepare' argument is completely void. 

- Is nothing stopping someone using a guide to prepare for battle and know a tactic ahead of time, pausing to figure out a tactic is no different, if the player wants to cheapen the experience for themselves it is up to the player, failing to include basic game design features is not an excuse for this.

- Pause to catch breath during battle?   Who does that exactly, extremely fat people who exhaust themselves pressing buttons on a controller?  Is a straight up laughable excuse.


My points are real issues.  A door will knock unexpectedly, a phone will ring unexpectedly, there are a million real things that can not be avoid and aren't player choice if they happen and a pasue feature, a basic feature, is needed.  Is why the feature was invented, because of the real world interupting gaming.

Unless you're suggesting Dark Souls is a game for social hermits who have no friends to call them, no family or partners to interupt them and live miles away from anywhere so nobody will ever knock on a door.


Well the bottom line is that pausing because the phone rings or there's some unimportant person at the door is not part of Dark Souls. You have to decide whether you want to live or die.

If you and Sven don't think that's downright awesome-kick-ass then feel free to complain about the status of your minority group. The rest of us don't want it and applaud it's absence.



MDMAlliance on 12 December 2012

Do you think that the same person could be signing the petition multiple times? Maybe multiple people signing multiple times? That's possible, right?