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Forums - Gaming Discussion - Playstation All-Stars Is No Super Smash Bros. Brawl, It’s Better

Brawl is much larger, that is pretty much the only unbiased thing you can say. As for the actual gameplay it really depends on the person and which character you use.

To me one of PSASBR's biggest accomplishments is the diverse roster. No character is a clone. What this means is some characters play like Smash while others are so far out there they feel alien. Drake is a great example of this because a match of four Nathans is as far from Smash as you can get. Meanwhile a match of four Heihachis is on the other end of the spectrum and is very close to traditional fighters. In between characters like Sweet Tooth replicate Smash's fighting, ignoring the differences in metagames of course.

This is also why many people think the roster is unbalanced. The characters are just like a rock paper scissors game in 1v1 matches. Heihachi beats Sweet Tooth, Sweet Tooth beats Drake, and Drake beats Heihachi. This is why the game really shines with free for all matches and 2v2.

As far as the metagames go, both Smash and All Stars are fantastic. The problem for PSASBR though is it sounds bad on paper. "Supers are the only way to kill and attacks don't do damage? F that!" After playing however most people start to understand the magic. One thing in particular that I find fantastic is how each super level takes more and more AP to reach. What this means is if a player is close to a level two, they can preform three level ones in a row back to back. Without playing you can't fully understand why this is great, but long story short it allows you to see when a player is desperate.

So Brawl is steak while PlayStation All Stars Battle Royale is lobster. Personally I'm in the mood for seafood right now, but man do I also crave a prime rib.



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pezus said:
Nem said:
Nice joke.

I am not a fan of either game, but i can tell Smash brothers is alot more interesting.

Oh, it's not a joke. It's one writer's opinion. And he actually has played both games, unlike you.


You assume much. I never said i didnt play the games.

The mechanics are the problem with the game. Your whole character move-set is pretty much useless because you can only beat other players with the supers. Its not a very good design at all, and it doesnt work for a compelling experience. Besides, its lame that its a complete rip-off on smash brothers aside the mechanics. The characters also dont mesh very well together but that is secondary.

Also, sales seem to agree with me. Anyone will have more fun playing Smash brothers than PASBR. I didnt say you cant have fun with PASBR, but if you think its more appealing or "better" than Smash brothers i can also say that is a very far-fetched opinion, wich for me is a joke. I am also entitled to my opinion, you see. :)



pezus said:
Nem said:
pezus said:
Nem said:
Nice joke.

I am not a fan of either game, but i can tell Smash brothers is alot more interesting.

Oh, it's not a joke. It's one writer's opinion. And he actually has played both games, unlike you.


You assume much. I never said i didnt play the games.

The mechanics are the problem with the game. Your whole character move-set is pretty much useless because you can only beat other players with the supers. Its not a very good design at all, and it doesnt work for a compelling experience. Besides, its lame that its a complete rip-off on smash brothers aside the mechanics. The characters also dont mesh very well together but that is secondary.

Also, sales seem to agree with me. Anyone will have more fun playing Smash brothers than PASBR. I didnt say you cant have fun with PASBR, but if you think its more appealing or "better" than Smash brothers i can also say that is a very far-fetched opinion, wich for me is a joke. I am also entitled to my opinion, you see. :)

"I can tell..." certainly sounds like it comes from someone who hasn't played both, at least not extensively.


I can tell, because i only tried PALBR for a few moments. Its not the same as buying and playing the game extensively, but i could tell from the short experience.



JWeinCom said:

The idea that MK is OPed because Sakurai made him is silly.  Kirby was made by Sakurai and he's been mediocre to bad in all three games.  Dedede is pretty mediocre as well.

MK is not particularly unbalanced in low level play.  If you gave two brand new players Link and MK to play with, I think the results would be about 50/50.  MK's best tools relate to stalling, planking, and his aerials, particularly D/Uair.  I'm a very good Smash Bros player and MK is one of my worst characters because I never put any effort into learning how to play as him.  It's not nearly as simple as "pick up controller and win".  If my life depended on winning a Smash Bros match and I could pick between Ganondorf and MK, I'd pick Ganondorf every time.

I'm not familiar with the term planking.

But you could be right, I'll ask my smash friend what he thinks about it.

EDIT: k, just had a little chat with my bud and he reminded me that Kirby was pretty awesome in smash64, and actually is placed 2nd tier for ssb64. His uptilt has a sick hitbox: http://img52.imageshack.us/img52/8015/kirbyutilt.gif

Then, he made the point that in all 3 games, his characters have at least average or better mechanics to them. And, well I don't have a source for this, but apparently he cares alot about MK.

Then, I asked him about noob mk vs noob link, and he told me that MK could basically win with two moves: The tornabo ( b ), and the downsmash, since tornados suck up all projectiles and can only be beat by select moves.

Which apparently was answered here already -> http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=4931646



I tried it myself for about 30 seconds. I can confirm that I don't have any interest in either game and don't care at all which is better. I'm pretty casual though so that might be why.



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i never even heard of polygon man, but he looks like an Andros clone from Starfox, pretty much like the whole game.



 

Nem said:
pezus said:
Nem said:
pezus said:
Nem said:
Nice joke.

I am not a fan of either game, but i can tell Smash brothers is alot more interesting.

Oh, it's not a joke. It's one writer's opinion. And he actually has played both games, unlike you.


You assume much. I never said i didnt play the games.

The mechanics are the problem with the game. Your whole character move-set is pretty much useless because you can only beat other players with the supers. Its not a very good design at all, and it doesnt work for a compelling experience. Besides, its lame that its a complete rip-off on smash brothers aside the mechanics. The characters also dont mesh very well together but that is secondary.

Also, sales seem to agree with me. Anyone will have more fun playing Smash brothers than PASBR. I didnt say you cant have fun with PASBR, but if you think its more appealing or "better" than Smash brothers i can also say that is a very far-fetched opinion, wich for me is a joke. I am also entitled to my opinion, you see. :)

"I can tell..." certainly sounds like it comes from someone who hasn't played both, at least not extensively.


I can tell, because i only tried PALBR for a few moments. Its not the same as buying and playing the game extensively, but i could tell from the short experience.

That's your problem. Find a character you like, play a bunch of matches, and I guarantee you will think differently. That's a ok if you don't love it but it's 100% BS to say the mechanics are like you describe them.



Nem said:
pezus said:
Nem said:
Nice joke.

I am not a fan of either game, but i can tell Smash brothers is alot more interesting.

Oh, it's not a joke. It's one writer's opinion. And he actually has played both games, unlike you.


You assume much. I never said i didnt play the games.

The mechanics are the problem with the game. Your whole character move-set is pretty much useless because you can only beat other players with the supers. Its not a very good design at all, and it doesnt work for a compelling experience. Besides, its lame that its a complete rip-off on smash brothers aside the mechanics. 

 


Different moves reward you with different amounts of AP (Just like in other fighting games where they do different amounts of damage), not to mention vary in timing, potential combo links, ideal setup positions etc. So the moveset is just as relevant as any other fighting game. It's like saying your moveset in Smash Brothers don't count because in the end you can just use smash attacks to ko opponents.

As for the bit in bold. Surely if a game isn't copying the mechanics, then it's not a rip-off. Otherwise i'm just going to go ahead and call Smash Brothers a Street Fighter clone. It's based around characters fighting each other on a 2d plane after all.  

 



happydolphin said:
JWeinCom said:

The idea that MK is OPed because Sakurai made him is silly.  Kirby was made by Sakurai and he's been mediocre to bad in all three games.  Dedede is pretty mediocre as well.

MK is not particularly unbalanced in low level play.  If you gave two brand new players Link and MK to play with, I think the results would be about 50/50.  MK's best tools relate to stalling, planking, and his aerials, particularly D/Uair.  I'm a very good Smash Bros player and MK is one of my worst characters because I never put any effort into learning how to play as him.  It's not nearly as simple as "pick up controller and win".  If my life depended on winning a Smash Bros match and I could pick between Ganondorf and MK, I'd pick Ganondorf every time.

I'm not familiar with the term planking.

But you could be right, I'll ask my smash friend what he thinks about it.

EDIT: k, just had a little chat with my bud and he reminded me that Kirby was pretty awesome in smash64, and actually is placed 2nd tier for ssb64. His uptilt has a sick hitbox: http://img52.imageshack.us/img52/8015/kirbyutilt.gif

Then, he made the point that in all 3 games, his characters have at least average or better mechanics to them. And, well I don't have a source for this, but apparently he cares alot about MK.

Then, I asked him about noob mk vs noob link, and he told me that MK could basically win with two moves: The tornabo ( b ), and the downsmash, since tornados suck up all projectiles and can only be beat by select moves.

Which apparently was answered here already -> http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=4931646

What do you mean in all three games his characters have above average or better mechanics to them?  First off, I don't know what above average mechanics means.  Secondly, there is no disputing that Kirby is awful in Melee.  He's just very bad all around.  Kirby and Dedede are both middle of the road characters in Brawl.  Dedede is above average for now, but he's been constantly sinking.

And I disagree with your friend.  Tornado doesn't do too much damage and it's highly punishable if used carelessly.  If the tornado ends off the ground, that's a free hit for link.   Meanwhile, MK lacks many KO moves and is very light.  MK's advantages are his insane gimping game, his offstage game, his ledge game, and his aerials, which aren't likely to be seen in noob level play.

But ignoring the hypothetical noob matchup, the point remains that picking MK doesn't magically make you win.  His advantages only come into play when you start utilizing his insane offstage game, quick aerials, stalling, and so on. 

If MK was as overpowered as people try to say you'd NEVER see any other character place highly, yet other characters consistently do place well in top tournaments.   Against the top portion of the cast, most of MK's matchups are only around 60/40 anyway.  MK isn't like bringing a gun to a knife fight.  MK is like bringing an 8" knife to a 6" knife fight.

@TheOMGZNoClones Argument-

This is really a weak argument to say PSASBR is better than Smash, and seemingly the only one given in the OP article.

Taking away any characters that could be considered clones (Luigi, Toon Link, Fox, Wolf, Ness, Falcon) you STILL have 29-33 (depending on how you want to count Pokemon Trainer and Samus) unique characters.  Smash has a large and diverse roster and the small amount of clones doesn't change things.



Super Smash bros is without doubt the better game. For the nostalgia, for the replay ability, for the raucous sounds of friends screeching when Pikachu gets fly kicked off the screen by Link. Awesome.