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Forums - General Discussion - ‘You’ve made your choice’: Man shares dad’s brutal letter disowning him for being gay

Icy-Zone said:
llewdebkram said:

And a single 3 letter word in that letter is to blame for all that hate and predjudice, the word being...

'GOD'

GOD and the bible is surely responsible for more hate, prejudice, intollerence and evil than anything else EVER in the history of mankind!

 


http://www.reason4living.com/articles/totw0144.htm

More people have died in the name of atheism than by the name of God. Numbers hardly lie.


Where exactly does this page show anyone who died in the name of atheism?  It just seems to take any death that wasn't directly caused by religion and say "lol atheists did it".



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theprof00 said:
happydolphin said:

@prof. Can you be 1) less ambiguous, 2) less insulting, and 3) actually participate and try to dialogue for a change. Guys, this isn't parliament (or senate or whatever you guys call it). We're here to talk not judge each other.

Less ambiguity about what?

Less insulting? Who am I insulting?

What dialogue? There WILL NEVER BE a dialogue.

I was referring to this " The anti-gay crowd never ceases in their ability to impress me with their shallow, callous, short-sighted behavior. "

I understand this is a sensitive topic but please calm down so we can talk....

 

For someone so smart, you have a hard time grasping the reality of the situation.

Of course I do. I've never been a father, and have never been in a situation as the one in OP where someone close to me came out of the closet.

 

 The problem with religion is that nobody can ever raise argument against it. It just causes further retraction into the safety of the hallowed shell. All appeal to common sense and peaceful protests and marches are "Assaults on Christianity". This is the face of persecution.....obviously.

How does this relate to anything in the thread? Can you quote a specific post?

 

Rational argument just can't exist. Solar Orbit, Round Earth, Witch-trials, The Inquisition. Religion is the foundation of nearly all segregational hate in this country, from Asians, to the Irish, to Blacks, etc etc. It never ends.

Aren't you taking this a little far? What about what religion did to help against segregation, such as the work of Martin Luther King?

 

Every major religious nation is in CONSTANT WAR.

I don't know what you're getting at but I don't want to ask because I feel you're venting and I want you to let it out.

 

It's just an endless cycle of hate and violence.

What is??

 

And the worst part is, you real Christians- the good Christians (I know there is a difference), tolerate it, or maybe it's worse that you can't even see it.

Tolerate what, what are we talking about now, war, or OP? :((

 

I'm lost. But I think this is an important topic for you so I'm willing to listen. I see you feel upset and I've seen this before and I'm not mad at you. I don't know what to say though.



llewdebkram said:

And a single 3 letter word in that letter is to blame for all that hate and predjudice, the word being...

'GOD'

GOD and the bible is surely responsible for more hate, prejudice, intollerence and evil than anything else EVER in the history of mankind!

I feel like there is a lot of anger in this thread.

What the person chooses to do is his personal conviction, God never forced it on anybody...



Icy-Zone said:
llewdebkram said:

And a single 3 letter word in that letter is to blame for all that hate and predjudice, the word being...

'GOD'

GOD and the bible is surely responsible for more hate, prejudice, intollerence and evil than anything else EVER in the history of mankind!

 


http://www.reason4living.com/articles/totw0144.htm

More people have died in the name of atheism than by the name of God. Numbers hardly lie.

Ouch, you'd love to call that "in the name of atheism". The sad truth of it is that you or whoever has fed you this bile, is looking for a scapegoat. No lives have ever been claimed "in the name of atheism". Warriors fight sometimes with God's name on their lips, and sometimes not.

A man who kills his wife for cheating doesn't do it in the name of atheism.

The argument that the church loves to spout is "these people didn't have God", but saying that one extremely large group of people is slightly more warlike than group of much smaller groups isn't much to be proud of. That's how you know it's a desperate claim.



fordy said:
Icy-Zone said:

I'm agnostic now after being born to Muslim parents, but even I can tell you that Christianity isn't all about free will. It's also about avoiding sins such as lust, with homosexuality being included in this. And by the way, I have no ill will against gays, and my posts are only to say that people here shouldn't be so quick to judge the father and label him as "someone who hates his son." It may be much deeper than you think.

So you've converted? Yes, as stated above.

What's to say that the son didn't convert too? I didn't dispute this above.

Maybe he chose not to live under the bounds of what people would consider sin, but he considers "part of himself". Again, I didn't dispute this possibility.

Who's to say that the son is even a Christian anymore? Didn't dispute this possibility........

Why is he bound by the beliefs of his father and being punished as such? Didn't say he was bound to his father's beliefs. About him being punished, that you're interpretation of his father's actions. I intrepreted the letter as the father trying to protect his son based on his personal values and beliefs.

Did your parents disown you for leaving the Muslim faith? They're upset about my decision, but they've mentioned they're upset out of love for me.

Not to sound like a jerk here, but did you read my post at all?



"Common sense is not so common." - Voltaire

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Well the son did make the wrong choice so it's natural a father would act that way, I'm sure any father would be a bit ashamed if there offspring was gay. At least he did it in a polite manner though, just unfortunate for the son that he went down that road is all.



I'm not going to argue about whether what the son did was right or wrong, but the letter clearly wasn't polite.  Disowning your son is inherently impolite regardless of what words you use.

If I slam you in the head with a baseball bat, then say "Oh, I'm so sorry about that.  I hope I didn't hit you too hard.  Have a nice day." My actions weren't polite.



JWeinCom said:

I'm not going to argue about whether what the son did was right or wrong, but the letter clearly wasn't polite.  Disowning your son is inherently impolite regardless of what words you use.

If I slam you in the head with a baseball bat, then say "Oh, I'm so sorry about that.  I hope I didn't hit you too hard.  Have a nice day." My actions weren't polite.

What if you're dating a girl and it's not working out. How do you tell her it's not working out without hurting her?

It's kind of similar here, magnified by a thousand times since this is a blood bond.



theprof00 said:
Icy-Zone said:
llewdebkram said:

And a single 3 letter word in that letter is to blame for all that hate and predjudice, the word being...

'GOD'

GOD and the bible is surely responsible for more hate, prejudice, intollerence and evil than anything else EVER in the history of mankind!

 


http://www.reason4living.com/articles/totw0144.htm

More people have died in the name of atheism than by the name of God. Numbers hardly lie.

Ouch, you'd love to call that "in the name of atheism". The sad truth of it is that you or whoever has fed you this bile, is looking for a scapegoat. No lives have ever been claimed "in the name of atheism". Warriors fight sometimes with God's name on their lips, and sometimes not.

A man who kills his wife for cheating doesn't do it in the name of atheism.

The argument that the church loves to spout is "these people didn't have God", but saying that one extremely large group of people is slightly more warlike than group of much smaller groups isn't much to be proud of. That's how you know it's a desperate claim.

Look at the bold highlight in the first post. My post was in response to this baseless and emotionally fuelled claim. The link highlights that communist governments, who believe in not a single God, have killed and caused more overall suffering than those who believe in a God. Which one of us had the desperate claim? Again, I'm a neutral agnostic person here, but the statistics, I think, prove me right here.



"Common sense is not so common." - Voltaire

Platinumed Destiny, Vanquish, Ninja Gaiden Sigma Plus, Catherine, and Metal Gear Rising. Get on my level!!


Get your Portable ID!                                                                                     

happydolphin said:
JWeinCom said:

I'm not going to argue about whether what the son did was right or wrong, but the letter clearly wasn't polite.  Disowning your son is inherently impolite regardless of what words you use.

If I slam you in the head with a baseball bat, then say "Oh, I'm so sorry about that.  I hope I didn't hit you too hard.  Have a nice day." My actions weren't polite.

What if you're dating a girl and it's not working out. How do you tell her it's not working out without hurting her?

It's kind of similar here, magnified by a thousand times since this is a blood bond.

It's a way different situation with a girl or guy you're dating.

A romantic relationship is something based around choice.  It's something that for the most part must be monogomous (unless you and your girl/guy are into that sort of thing. No judging here.)

If you're engaged in a romantic relationship with someone you don't love, you are preventing them from finding someone who does love them.  Once you break up with them, they're free to find someone else.

If you disown a son, you're not helping them to pursue other opportunities.  They're not going to find another father (at least not at that age) or anything like that.  It's not going to help them out in anyway.  And of course, the obligations of a parent to his child is different than the relationship between two people in a romantic relationship and a father/son.