I prefer Joker by a country mile. He had an eccentric madness to him and you didn't know what he was gonna do next so kept us guessing. Bane was pretty basic a villain in comparison and needed subtiltles to understand him thanks to his god awful muffled voice. Also he let everyone know his plan about the bomb which is basically saying "come stp me". Joker was mysterious and crazy but definitely had a method to his madness .

You almost nailed it. That last reveal was a mistake, in my opinion. It took Bane down to the level of being mere muscle, and not even particularly strong muscle at that. A pity that all that set up was ultimately for nothing.

The only part we disagree is that, even before that, I never put Bane ahead of Joker. Bane was initially a cunning brute. Joker was always a criminal mastermind. And while Bane uses raw strength to do a lot of his damage, Joker's scenes always felt far more visceral and brutal. The scenes where he murders the gang leader, or the "magic trick" moment still make me wince...

Bane didn't just become a lackey, though I can understand if that's how you saw it. It looked to me like they were partners/equals, but it could also be said that she was the 'President' while he was the commander of the forces. As though she had the overarching vision (using the fusion core for a bomb) and Bane had the drive/resources to do it (and creatively at that).

>_>

Why did I read this thread?

Bane had the respect of everybody beneath him.  He would tell somebody, "Get me a grape soda and when you get back, I'm going to kill you."  They'd bring him the soda and smile as he crushed their windpipe.  He was the man.  But in the end, Talia was like "Bane, you stay hear and die with Batman in the explosion."  Bane pretty much was like, "......fuck.  Oh well.  I guess I have to."

They definitely weren't equals.

Talia was the heir to the League of Shadows. She's the one who wants to follow her father's vision and destroy Gotham. She's the one who did the impossible and escaped the prison. She's presumably the one who commands the League's resources, seeing as how Bane got kicked out of said League. She's the one who insisted that Bane be saved in the first place. She's the one who makes it a point to break Wayne's spirit by gaining his trust and then smashing it. She orders Bane to stay and turn into a s'more, and he does it. As near as I can tell, it was all her. Bane basically follows her around like a giant puppy. Supposedly because he loves her.

I just hope said love develops exclusively after her escape. When she's, y'know, actually hit puberty. Because otherwise, eeeeewww...

I like both of them. I'm truly sad the Joker couldn't have had some role in "Rises".

I think you missed the point in their relationship a little bit though man.  He didn't stay behind or obey her because he was dumb muscle.  He wasn't at all he was cunning and intelligent and actually had motives and beliefs all his own.

Didn't you notice him crying when Talia was telling the story.  He did everything out of sheer love and devotion for her.  Which actually moved me even more and made Bane a truley tragic character.  He became not just a monster but a human with a soul like the rest of us.

Why isn't this a POLL, dammit you fail.

Bane. Much better. His role was 100 times more scary, and brilliantly done. He felt real, as the Joker never did. I also got a sense of his pain, or his anger. Something yet again the Joker lacked. Plus, the character of Bane was far better to watch on screen. He is a very interesting character, and Nolan did him right. Only don't like how he went out, at all, it bothered me.

I think you don't get Bane. He is methodical. The plan was his. But he was doing it for her (Talia). Bane was the ultimate member of the league of shadows. He isn't a puppet. They were going to die with the blast the whole time. This was very clear when you recall the beginning when he told one of his soldiers to say, and essentially die because they need a body. No fight was had because you get to understand they all expected to die in the end anyways, as Gotham is in ashes. Those people are his (Bane).