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Forums - Microsoft Discussion - Epic and Microsoft!

twesterm said:
erikers said:
twesterm said:
Considering we've seen nothing of Gears 2, I guarantee you that FFXIII will be released before Gears 2.

I love it when people make baseless guarantees about things they have no idea about. We hadn't seen anything of Rainbow Six Vegas 2 a few weeks ago yet it'll be out over a year before FFXIII. Common sense sinking in yet? You don't know anything about any of those games development so don't guarantee anything as it is pointless and you aren't in any real position to make any valid guarantees.

Seriously, you don't work on either of these games, what goes through your mind that you think you have any justification in guaranteeing anything? Anymore insider info you happen to have?


 Well, since I do work in the video game industry I do have a good idea of how things flow but I don't really need to know that because it's just common sense. 

Epic takes their time on everything they do.  If I remember correctly Gears of War was released towards the end of 2006.  If Gears of War 2 were released at the end of 2008, that would be a two year project cycle.  Two years is not a long time and I promise you they will take longer than two years to complete that game.  You only take two years to make something if you're on a tight schedule with a stingy publisher breathing down your neck.  Microsoft Game Studios knows Epic is a proven studio and knows that if they need the time they can have it because they will make a quality game that will make money.

If I had to take a guess, I would expect Gears of War 2 mid to late 2009.

 

 Is it impossible that they have been doing some work on it before now, with a smaller group of people just getting the story, artwork all that stuff in place before full work on it starts. I don't know how much that cuts down the time to make it, but I'm sure that might let them get it out this year, considering they would have done all of that almost immediately after the release.

Anyway, how come Insomniac makes a game a year?



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Wojtas said:
Gosh, most of the people that posted now are totally in the dark. UT3 for the PS3 flopped hard. it sold less than 120k up till now, nowhere near the amount that Epic needs to recoup their losses from making the game.

With that in mind it would seem a good idea on MS's side to fight for the 3rd GOW title for their console. They just have a very good reason for that title to be on the xbox and not on the PS3, a supposed AAAAA+ title (as stated by Leo-j and a few others) just turned out to have awful sales for the PS3. Doesn't matter if the franchise is or isn't popular like some of you people say, this game should've sold more than it has, regardles of it's public status.

 160k up till now, and it will sell at least 500k overall. Not great, but not a complete flop.

@ SSJ, it has certainly been released in the UK, so I would expect Europe to have it to



@ Munkeh

I live in the UK and i can tell you now that it has not been released here on the PS3 at least, the PC i'm not too sure of (possibly has) but i know quite a lot of people on the PS forums that are hotly anticipating this title :D



Munkeh111 said:
Wojtas said:
Gosh, most of the people that posted now are totally in the dark. UT3 for the PS3 flopped hard. it sold less than 120k up till now, nowhere near the amount that Epic needs to recoup their losses from making the game.

With that in mind it would seem a good idea on MS's side to fight for the 3rd GOW title for their console. They just have a very good reason for that title to be on the xbox and not on the PS3, a supposed AAAAA+ title (as stated by Leo-j and a few others) just turned out to have awful sales for the PS3. Doesn't matter if the franchise is or isn't popular like some of you people say, this game should've sold more than it has, regardles of it's public status.

 160k up till now, and it will sell at least 500k overall. Not great, but not a complete flop.

@ SSJ, it has certainly been released in the UK, so I would expect Europe to have it to


 well this site has no Other numbers for the PS3 version and no PC version is tracked or can be accurately tracked thanks to sites like Direct to Drive. UT3 should be selling well, on the PC, in the UK.

 

Edit: PC has been released in the UK. All reports I have seen were a week after the US release which was 12 days before UK's release. I have yet to hear complaints about sales of the game now. Heck even Crysis I havent heard complaints about sales since launch in the UK. 



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ymeaga1n said:
Aj_habfan said:
I don't get your point with Unreal Tournament failing on PC/PS3, I'm sure if a game like Gears of War 2 was released on PS3/PC it would have done MUCH better. The Unreal franchise is not that popular anymore and there was no advertising, it's not like it will do great on 360 either.

First off, I don't know what he's talking about with pc/ps3 doing crappy but 360 doing well (?), but what is your basis for claiming gears 2 would do better on ps3/pc and as compared to what, 360/pc? (if you are comparing those two...read on...)

Sounds ridiculous to me...ps3s install base is no where near xbox's install base (NA particularly). PS3's online network, at this point in time, cannot compare to xboxs (and i doubt it will even be on par with it before the end of the year) which was a major selling point for the original gears of war. And, gears already has an installled based with its 360 users. Tell me why install base on ps3 would buy more gears 2 than the install base of 360.


 

Wow, I didn't say anything close to that. Really, not sure what the hell you were reading. My point was that you can't compare the success of a game like Gears of War 2 with Unreal Tournament III, because there is not nearly as much interest in Unreal Tournament as there is with GoW.

Also, I never said anything about it doing better than 360, I said a game like Gears of War 2 on PS3 would do MUCH better than Unreal Tournament III on the PS3.



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Well this thread was derailed from the start...

Thoughts on Epic and Microsoft?

They teamed up once and created a new IP and a great game. This is good for the 360, this leaves the door open for possibly other exclusives from Epic.

If Epic wanted to create an exclusive game (Hypothetically, since their more likely to stay multiplatform) then they would keep in mind the prior success with Gears of War. Except for the charging for the DLC fiasco, Epic and MS had a good partnership, and it was reported that both teams worked really well together.



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CAL4M1TY said:
halil23 said:
 
the reason Gears of War sales were good on xbox is because Microsoft put a lot of money on advertising this game, whereas Unreal Tournament 3 is no where big as Gears of War advertising, thus the sales weren't good (NOT "flopped horribly").
 

By your logic, there is no such thing as a sleeper hit (which everyone knows they indeed exist) and by that same "flawless" logic every big budget title is a winner (which everyoneknows is indeed not true).

EDIT: You should also note that you're comparing the next install of a critically acclaimed and highly established franchise to a single game....  

@twesterm: Actually considering they have an unreal engine sitting there (so they don't need to develop that) as well as the game mechanics of Gears of War pretty much "complete" in the first game (thus not needing to run as many trials on the combat/shooter system) development time should take less then the original. I do agree that a 2 year development cycle is a little short, but saying FFXIII who have a new engine built from the ground up as well as development for a new platform, will come first, is a bit of a stretch. You say that Epic is meticulous in their development, I'm sure the same can be said of Square Enix when it comes to the FF titles in the main series (I to X and then XII). Also, just because they show trailers, doesn't mean that game is definitely ahead in development compared to a game that doesn't show much (or at all), I mean look at the more recent extreme cases Duke Nukem and S.T.A.L.K.E.R.

 

 


 I think S.T.A.L.K.E.R. is a fantastic game.  I'm also glad they are making another one.



Munkeh111 said:
twesterm said:
erikers said:
twesterm said:
Considering we've seen nothing of Gears 2, I guarantee you that FFXIII will be released before Gears 2.

I love it when people make baseless guarantees about things they have no idea about. We hadn't seen anything of Rainbow Six Vegas 2 a few weeks ago yet it'll be out over a year before FFXIII. Common sense sinking in yet? You don't know anything about any of those games development so don't guarantee anything as it is pointless and you aren't in any real position to make any valid guarantees.

Seriously, you don't work on either of these games, what goes through your mind that you think you have any justification in guaranteeing anything? Anymore insider info you happen to have?


Well, since I do work in the video game industry I do have a good idea of how things flow but I don't really need to know that because it's just common sense.

Epic takes their time on everything they do. If I remember correctly Gears of War was released towards the end of 2006. If Gears of War 2 were released at the end of 2008, that would be a two year project cycle. Two years is not a long time and I promise you they will take longer than two years to complete that game. You only take two years to make something if you're on a tight schedule with a stingy publisher breathing down your neck. Microsoft Game Studios knows Epic is a proven studio and knows that if they need the time they can have it because they will make a quality game that will make money.

If I had to take a guess, I would expect Gears of War 2 mid to late 2009.


Is it impossible that they have been doing some work on it before now, with a smaller group of people just getting the story, artwork all that stuff in place before full work on it starts. I don't know how much that cuts down the time to make it, but I'm sure that might let them get it out this year, considering they would have done all of that almost immediately after the release.

Anyway, how come Insomniac makes a game a year?


 While Resistance was being made I highly doubt the game was actually being worked on other than by a few members and ideas floating in peoples head.  The end of a project cycle is all fluffy puppies and parties, it's 100+ work weeks and very heavy crunch.  Everyone is working to their fullest in order to get the game out on time and it's pretty hard to spare people.

And you do you realize that even small studios can have more than one team correct?  Or do you think the same team that brought us Ratchet and Clank also brought us Resistance? 



Aj_habfan said:
ymeaga1n said:
Aj_habfan said:
I don't get your point with Unreal Tournament failing on PC/PS3, I'm sure if a game like Gears of War 2 was released on PS3/PC it would have done MUCH better. The Unreal franchise is not that popular anymore and there was no advertising, it's not like it will do great on 360 either.

First off, I don't know what he's talking about with pc/ps3 doing crappy but 360 doing well (?), but what is your basis for claiming gears 2 would do better on ps3/pc and as compared to what, 360/pc? (if you are comparing those two...read on...)

Sounds ridiculous to me...ps3s install base is no where near xbox's install base (NA particularly). PS3's online network, at this point in time, cannot compare to xboxs (and i doubt it will even be on par with it before the end of the year) which was a major selling point for the original gears of war. And, gears already has an installled based with its 360 users. Tell me why install base on ps3 would buy more gears 2 than the install base of 360.


 

Wow, I didn't say anything close to that. Really, not sure what the hell you were reading. My point was that you can't compare the success of a game like Gears of War 2 with Unreal Tournament III, because there is not nearly as much interest in Unreal Tournament as there is with GoW.

Also, I never said anything about it doing better than 360, I said a game like Gears of War 2 on PS3 would do MUCH better than Unreal Tournament III on the PS3.


oh dont' throw a fit. you were in no way clear with your first statement. and i clearly pointed out not to read my post if i steered off course and you still did....it's only your own fault lol.




Played_Out said:
So much fanboyism on both sides of the fence.

The only problem I have with the original post is the suggestion that developers licensed UE3 after seeing Gears of War. That is simply not true. Each successive iteration of UE is a hotly anticipated event, and UE3 had been licensed to developers long before Gears was released (e.g. Rainbow 6: Vegas, which uses the engine, was released around the same time).

I think you need to take a look at the number of games that have used the Unreal Engine ever since it's first incarnation. Let's just say it's a sh*tload, and I'll wager that licensing the engine has been Epic's primary source of income for over decade.
They would turn a profit even if they didn't release their own games at all.

 I didn't say that noone used UT3 until after Gears of War, just that it increased adoption of the engine (eg. Last Remnant).

I also did not say that Epic could fail to turn a profit, but that the relative failure of their Unreal Tournament IP's latest iteration will hit their bottom line this year, making it a good time for Microsoft to approach them about further GoW exclusivity.



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