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Forums - Politics Discussion - A modest proposal to solve the homeless problem in America....

Dr.Grass said:
NinjaguyDan said:
Marks said:
NinjaguyDan said:
Marks said:
NinjaguyDan said:

There are enough resources and productivity in the world to provide for the basic needs of everyone alive right now.
Why isn't that happening?


FUCKING GREED! Plain and simple.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gRwIZ36po3Y

 

The rich are our masters and they're total fucking idiots, what does that make us?


That's the worst type of greed! I hate fucking greed. 

 

My solution is to elect Ron Paul and let him fix it. He knows what he's doing. 


His "free market" bullshit will only make things worse.


LMAO how did you come to that conclusion? You really think continued deficit spending and ineffective social programs are the solution?

You've given that a try for years now and things are worse, how about you guys give capitalism a try? I mean real capitalism i.e. free market. What America has now isn't capitalism. 


We are at the terminal stage of the Reagan Revolution.  I've been watching it unfold in excruciatingly slow real-time over the last 30 yrs.

And that's where we are.  Blame social programs all you want but it's obvious where the real waste is.

 

Let's put that in a global perspective

 

So, if the US is spending as much on defense as all of those countries combined, then we should be able to fight and win a war against all of them simultaneously.  Right?


I hope someone tries to answer this.


Look at Military spending as a percentage of GDP  ...

 

Rank   Countries  Amount  Date  
# 1     Korea, North: 22.9%  2003 
# 2     Oman: 11.4%  2005 
= 3     Qatar: 10%  2005 
= 3     Saudi Arabia: 10%  2005 
= 5     Jordan: 8.6%  2006 
= 5     Iraq: 8.6%  2006 
# 7     Israel: 7.3%  2006 
# 8     Yemen: 6.6%  2006 
# 9     Eritrea: 6.3%  2006 
# 10     Macedonia, Republic of: 6%  2005 
= 11     Burundi: 5.9%  2006 
= 11     Syria: 5.9%  2005 
# 13     Angola: 5.7%  2006 
= 14     Maldives: 5.5%  2005 
= 14     Mauritania: 5.5%  2006 
= 16     Kuwait: 5.3%  2006 
= 16     Turkey: 5.3%  2005 
= 18     El Salvador: 5%  2006 
= 18     Morocco: 5%  2004 
# 20     Singapore: 4.9%  2005 
# 21     Swaziland: 4.7%  2006 
= 22     Bahrain: 4.5%  2006 
= 22     Bosnia and Herzegovina: 4.5%  2005 
= 22     Brunei: 4.5%  2006 
= 25     Greece: 4.3%  2005 
= 25     China: 4.3%  2006 
# 27     Chad: 4.2%  2006 
# 28     United States: 4.06%  2005 
# 29     Côte d'Ivoire: 4%  2006 
= 30     Tajikistan: 3.9%  2005 
= 30     Libya: 3.9%  2005 
= 30     Russia: 3.9%  2005 
= 33     Djibouti: 3.8%  2006 
= 33     Zimbabwe: 3.8%  2006 
= 33     Cuba: 3.8%  2006 
= 33     Cyprus: 3.8%  2005 
# 37     Namibia: 3.7%  2006 
# 38     Armenia: 3.5%  2006 
= 39     Turkmenistan: 3.4%  2005 
= 39     Gabon: 3.4%  2005 
= 39     Colombia: 3.4%  2005 
= 39     Egypt: 3.4%  2005 
= 43     Algeria: 3.3%  2006 
= 43     Botswana: 3.3%  2006 
# 45     Pakistan: 3.2%  2006 
= 46     Guinea-Bissau: 3.1%  2005 
= 46     Lebanon: 3.1%  2005 
= 46     Congo, Republic of the: 3.1%  2006 
= 46     United Arab Emirates: 3.1%  2005 
= 50     Ethiopia: 3%  2006 
= 50     Solomon Islands: 3%  2006 
= 50     Cambodia: 3%  2005 
= 50     Indonesia: 3%  2005 
= 50     Sudan: 3%  2005 
= 55     Zambia: 2.9%  2006 
= 55     Rwanda: 2.9%  2006 
= 57     Comoros: 2.8%  2006 
= 57     Kenya: 2.8%  2006 
= 57     Ecuador: 2.8%  2006 
= 60     Korea, South: 2.7%  2006 
= 60     Chile: 2.7%  2006 
= 62     Azerbaijan: 2.6%  2005 
= 62     France: 2.6%  2005 
= 62     Lesotho: 2.6%  2006 
= 62     Sri Lanka: 2.6%  2006 
= 62     Brazil: 2.6%  2006 
= 62     Bulgaria: 2.6%  2005 
= 68     Congo, Democratic Republic of the: 2.5%  2006 
= 68     Iran: 2.5%  2006 
= 68     India: 2.5%  2006 
= 68     Vietnam: 2.5%  2005 
# 72     Romania: 2.47%  2005 
= 73     Australia: 2.4%  2006 
= 73     United Kingdom: 2.4%  2005 
# 75     Croatia: 2.39%  2005 
= 76     Portugal: 2.3%  2005 
= 76     Sierra Leone: 2.3%  2006 
= 78     Uganda: 2.2%  2006 
= 78     Fiji: 2.2%  2005 
= 78     Taiwan: 2.2%  2006 
# 81     Burma: 2.1%  2005 
# 82     Malaysia: 2.03%  2005 
= 83     Estonia: 2%  2005 
= 83     Seychelles: 2%  2006 
= 83     Finland: 2%  2005 
= 83     Uzbekistan: 2%  2005 
= 83     Venezuela: 2%  2006 
= 88     Bolivia: 1.9%  2006 
= 88     Mali: 1.9%  2006 
= 88     Senegal: 1.9%  2006 
= 88     Lithuania: 1.9%  2005 
= 88     Norway: 1.9%  2005 
= 88     Afghanistan: 1.9%  2006 
# 94     Slovakia: 1.87%  2005 
# 95     Czech Republic: 1.81%  2005 
= 96     Italy: 1.8%  2005 
= 96     Guyana: 1.8%  2006 
= 96     Thailand: 1.8%  2005 
# 99     Hungary: 1.75%  2005 
# 100     Poland: 1.71%  2005 
= 101     Slovenia: 1.7%  2005 
= 101     Benin: 1.7%  2006 
= 101     Guinea: 1.7%  2006 
= 101     South Africa: 1.7%  2006 
= 105     Togo: 1.6%  2005 
= 105     Nepal: 1.6%  2006 
= 105     Netherlands: 1.6%  2005 
= 105     Tanzania: 1.6%  2006 
= 105     Uruguay: 1.6%  2006 
= 110     Germany: 1.5%  2005 
= 110     Nigeria: 1.5%  2006 
= 110     Bangladesh: 1.5%  2006 
= 110     Kazakhstan: 1.5%  2006 
= 110     Denmark: 1.5%  2005 
= 110     Sweden: 1.5%  2006 
= 110     Peru: 1.5%  2006 
# 117     Albania: 1.49%  2005 
= 118     Belize: 1.4%  2006 
= 118     Ukraine: 1.4%  2005 
= 118     Papua New Guinea: 1.4%  2005 
= 118     Belarus: 1.4%  2005 
= 118     Mongolia: 1.4%  2006 
= 118     Tunisia: 1.4%  2006 
= 118     Kyrgyzstan: 1.4%  2005 
= 125     Niger: 1.3%  2006 
= 125     Belgium: 1.3%  2005 
= 125     Malawi: 1.3%  2006 
= 125     Cameroon: 1.3%  2006 
= 125     Liberia: 1.3%  2006 
= 125     Argentina: 1.3%  2005 
= 125     Somalia: 1.3%  2006 
= 132     Latvia: 1.2%  2005 
= 132     Spain: 1.2%  2005 
= 132     Burkina Faso: 1.2%  2006 
= 135     Philippines: 1.1%  2006 
= 135     Central African Republic: 1.1%  2006 
= 135     Canada: 1.1%  2005 
= 138     Madagascar: 1%  2006 
= 138     Paraguay: 1%  2006 
= 138     Panama: 1%  2006 
= 138     New Zealand: 1%  2005 
= 138     Switzerland: 1%  2005 
= 138     Bhutan: 1%  2005 
= 144     Austria: 0.9%  2005 
= 144     Ireland: 0.9%  2005 
= 144     Tonga: 0.9%  2006 
= 144     Luxembourg: 0.9%  2005 
= 148     Ghana: 0.8%  2006 
= 148     São Tomé and Príncipe: 0.8%  2006 
= 148     Japan: 0.8%  2006 
= 148     Dominican Republic: 0.8%  2006 
= 148     Mozambique: 0.8%  2006 
= 153     Cape Verde: 0.7%  2006 
= 153     Malta: 0.7%  2006 
= 155     Jamaica: 0.6%  2006 
= 155     Nicaragua: 0.6%  2006 
= 155     Suriname: 0.6%  2006 
= 155     Honduras: 0.6%  2006 
# 159     Georgia: 0.59%  2005 
= 160     Bahamas, The: 0.5%  2006 
= 160     Laos: 0.5%  2006 
= 160     Mexico: 0.5%  2006 
= 160     Gambia, The: 0.5%  2006 
= 160     Antigua and Barbuda: 0.5%  2006 
= 160     Barbados: 0.5%  2006 
= 166     Haiti: 0.4%  2006 
= 166     Guatemala: 0.4%  2006 
= 166     Costa Rica: 0.4%  2006 
= 166     Moldova: 0.4%  2005 
= 170     Trinidad and Tobago: 0.3%  2006 
= 170     Mauritius: 0.3%  2006 
# 172     Bermuda: 0.11%  2005 
# 173     Equatorial Guinea: 0.1%  2006 
# 174     Iceland: 0%  2005 

 

Even though it is still much higher than most other developed nations, the amount the United States spends on their military as a percentage of GDP is reasonable considering they want to be a military super-power and are engaged in multiple wars.



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Well looking at history, Superpowers need to have a strong military to remain dominate.
It can led to severe Fin restrain, but imagine how the British would be if they did have the best Navy in the world in the past?
Also, it naive to think war will not occur and terrible things will not happen.

Looking at the spending, China will likley spend, double or triple or even more in the future as their economy expands.

So imo the US, can spend a lot of money on its military as great powers have in the past. They need to collect more revenue through taxes and this is something the US does not do well. Many loopholes mean Corporations avoid paying taxes and the wealthy can as well.



NinjaguyDan said:

 

Although I agree defence spending is far too high. This is only discretionary spending. You need also look at mandatory spending, both current and future.

The Federal Government has a spending problem, period. The defense deparment is only one part of the problem.



Mr Khan said:
SamuelRSmith said:
theprof00 said:
The answer is simple really.
And a good economic solution during times of crisis.

You pay people to do jobs they really don't want to do, like digging holes.
You pay people to dig holes for minimum wage, or prepare lanes for national railway, etc etc.
The vagrants sleep on a railroad card anyway, so you just put the railcart on the rails and have the homeless somewhere in the mid-US building railroads at minimum wage or something like that.


We have people who are digging holes in Iraq and Afghanistan... spending trillions doing so.

Granted in Afghanistan this could be productive in the long run, if by "digging holes" we are referring to broader infrastructural development programs. Afghanistan sits on a fortune of rare earth metals, last i heard.

Actually, I was referring to the war. Keynsians who believe that spending is spending should have no problem with billions being spent on bombs, etc.



SamuelRSmith said:
Mr Khan said:
SamuelRSmith said:
theprof00 said:
The answer is simple really.
And a good economic solution during times of crisis.

You pay people to do jobs they really don't want to do, like digging holes.
You pay people to dig holes for minimum wage, or prepare lanes for national railway, etc etc.
The vagrants sleep on a railroad card anyway, so you just put the railcart on the rails and have the homeless somewhere in the mid-US building railroads at minimum wage or something like that.


We have people who are digging holes in Iraq and Afghanistan... spending trillions doing so.

Granted in Afghanistan this could be productive in the long run, if by "digging holes" we are referring to broader infrastructural development programs. Afghanistan sits on a fortune of rare earth metals, last i heard.

Actually, I was referring to the war. Keynsians who believe that spending is spending should have no problem with billions being spent on bombs, etc.


That is the strange disconnect isn't it?  One war got us out of depression because of huge government spending, and another helped get us in one due to huge government spending and is why we can't recover.

I've never seen those two points reconciled.



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Kasz216 said:
SamuelRSmith said:

Actually, I was referring to the war. Keynsians who believe that spending is spending should have no problem with billions being spent on bombs, etc.


That is the strange disconnect isn't it?  One war got us out of depression because of huge government spending, and another helped get us in one due to huge government spending and is why we can't recover.

I've never seen those two points reconciled.

These wars have helped business, to be certain. I would say the general changes in our economic factors (the much smaller share of manufacturing) makes the difference, but these wars have helped some smaller companies in manufacturing. My dad's steel forging company has benefitted most from the war and from (sadly enough) hydraulic fracking



Monster Hunter: pissing me off since 2010.

Or we could ship them to Canada.



Mr Khan said:
Kasz216 said:
SamuelRSmith said:
 

Actually, I was referring to the war. Keynsians who believe that spending is spending should have no problem with billions being spent on bombs, etc.


That is the strange disconnect isn't it?  One war got us out of depression because of huge government spending, and another helped get us in one due to huge government spending and is why we can't recover.

I've never seen those two points reconciled.

These wars have helped business, to be certain. I would say the general changes in our economic factors (the much smaller share of manufacturing) makes the difference, but these wars have helped some smaller companies in manufacturing. My dad's steel forging company has benefitted most from the war and from (sadly enough) hydraulic fracking

Wow that's got to be a pretty big ethical dilema for you.  It reminds me of the episode of Roseanne where Darlene realizes that all of the money she gets from stuff comes from her mother's loose meat restraunt despite her being a staunch vegetarian.  (Of course it only reminds me of this because I work a boring nightshfit job with a TV and that episode was just on recently.)

Still, in general all I hear on TV from liberals is how the Wars sent us into this crashing recession.  Went from watching no TV to way to much with no choice.  (Just active enough that reading a book doesn't work.)



Kasz216 said:
Mr Khan said:

These wars have helped business, to be certain. I would say the general changes in our economic factors (the much smaller share of manufacturing) makes the difference, but these wars have helped some smaller companies in manufacturing. My dad's steel forging company has benefitted most from the war and from (sadly enough) hydraulic fracking

Wow that's got to be a pretty big ethical dilema for you.  It reminds me of the episode of Roseanne where Darlene realizes that all of the money she gets from stuff comes from her mother's loose meat restraunt despite her being a staunch vegetarian.  (Of course it only reminds me of this because I work a boring nightshfit job with a TV and that episode was just on recently.)

Still, in general all I hear on TV from liberals is how the Wars sent us into this crashing recession.  Went from watching no TV to way to much with no choice.  (Just active enough that reading a book doesn't work.)

Not an ethical dilemma as such. I'm not opposed to hydraulic fracking right off the top of my head, just how the fracking industry seems to be determined to avoid all environmental regulation or responsibility. Marcellus shale presents possibilities, but environmental standards must be enforced, and while i did not support the beginning of the Iraq war, i supported its continuation in the peacekeeping phase (in the "we made this mess, we clean it up" morality), and supported the war in Afghanistan



Monster Hunter: pissing me off since 2010.

Mr Khan said:
Kasz216 said:
SamuelRSmith said:
 

Actually, I was referring to the war. Keynsians who believe that spending is spending should have no problem with billions being spent on bombs, etc.


That is the strange disconnect isn't it?  One war got us out of depression because of huge government spending, and another helped get us in one due to huge government spending and is why we can't recover.

I've never seen those two points reconciled.

These wars have helped business, to be certain. I would say the general changes in our economic factors (the much smaller share of manufacturing) makes the difference, but these wars have helped some smaller companies in manufacturing. My dad's steel forging company has benefitted most from the war and from (sadly enough) hydraulic fracking


What we have here is the problem between the seen, and the unseen. War spending has aided business because the Government has bought steel, etc. What's not seen is how the money would have been spent IF the Government had not have gone to war, if it wasn't taken away in tax.