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Forums - Sony - New PSN attack is more bigger but it wouldn’t hurt the members – Unknown

M.U.G.E.N on 22 June 2011
CGI-Quality said:
Dodece said:
The grammar may be poor, but that may merely be a artifact of translation. The author may not be fluent, and speak another language entirely. Remember "Won't" is not a typical contraction, and if my memory serves me correctly it was not officially recognized as a real world until quite recently. Speaking to much and more. I can see where any translation software could view them as interchangeable. So I wouldn't write this off. Pun purely intentional. As the work of a moron or idiot. Incapable of doing real harm.

Sony security is nothing less then laughable. This company has been breached twenty times this year. That isn't even including all the denial of service attacks. Sony really is a paper tiger when it comes to security. So can we cut all of the shit please. The hackers have nothing to be afraid of, and are probably going to continue to be successful. Sony basically had no security. It will take longer then a couple months for them to actually get good at security. So the moral of the story is that Sony probably cannot do much to stop hacking at the moment, and any successful hacker will get away with their crime. The preponderance of evidence supports this supposition.

Their gaming network was not rebuilt so much as it was patched. So while the initial vulnerability has been fixed. It doesn't mean that there aren't a lot more vulnerabilities, and based on the content of their manifesto it sounds to be more like a end around attack. I suggest others read that again, because they aren't just proclaiming a attack to take place in the future, but that at least one attack has taken place. They are claiming to have confidential files that they probably intend to share. They make it all sound pretty damning. Which means they think people will be outraged when they read them.

This all reads like they are intending a multifaceted approach. Like they have some parts, but they want to build up bulk so they can do a big dump. Other groups that have attacked Sony have done the same. It is clearly a form of media manipulation. One small attack could go ignored, but announcing two or three at the same time. Creates the impression that it is far bigger then it is.

On the plus side they are claiming that consumers will not be collateral in these attacks. Not that there was much meat left on that bone anyway. I am also not buying into this nonsense that an attack on Sony is a attack on the consumers. You might have been ignorant the first time, but nobody is a innocent babe in the woods at this time. The first attack proved that Sony didn't practice basic security, and all the subsequent attacks have done a real good job of highlighting that the problem is systemic.

Those who still have a PS3 have made the conscious decision to stay on a boat that has had twenty leaks in what amounts to short order. You can blame the guys drilling holes in the hull, but that doesn't exactly justify why you are staying on a ship that is sinking, or why you are wasting time complaining. By all means play on a console that is hack fodder, but just be honest with yourself. Sony hacking doesn't seem to be going away. So either you are cool with that or you aren't.

I guess you must think a lot of companies have "laughable" security, as this has happened to more than Sony. Also, it's news to me that Sony has been breached over 20 times in 2011 alone. Any sources?

I find it hilarious that he thinks he is an expert on sony's past and current security systems and also even more laughable about the part on how hackers are getting away with things considering how many hackers are getting revealed and gets arrested these days. it's also funny how he makes NO attempt to blame hackers...sad really...and lol at the ship analogy. >_>



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nightsurge on 22 June 2011
M.U.G.E.N said:
CGI-Quality said:
Dodece said:
The grammar may be poor, but that may merely be a artifact of translation. The author may not be fluent, and speak another language entirely. Remember "Won't" is not a typical contraction, and if my memory serves me correctly it was not officially recognized as a real world until quite recently. Speaking to much and more. I can see where any translation software could view them as interchangeable. So I wouldn't write this off. Pun purely intentional. As the work of a moron or idiot. Incapable of doing real harm.

Sony security is nothing less then laughable. This company has been breached twenty times this year. That isn't even including all the denial of service attacks. Sony really is a paper tiger when it comes to security. So can we cut all of the shit please. The hackers have nothing to be afraid of, and are probably going to continue to be successful. Sony basically had no security. It will take longer then a couple months for them to actually get good at security. So the moral of the story is that Sony probably cannot do much to stop hacking at the moment, and any successful hacker will get away with their crime. The preponderance of evidence supports this supposition.

Their gaming network was not rebuilt so much as it was patched. So while the initial vulnerability has been fixed. It doesn't mean that there aren't a lot more vulnerabilities, and based on the content of their manifesto it sounds to be more like a end around attack. I suggest others read that again, because they aren't just proclaiming a attack to take place in the future, but that at least one attack has taken place. They are claiming to have confidential files that they probably intend to share. They make it all sound pretty damning. Which means they think people will be outraged when they read them.

This all reads like they are intending a multifaceted approach. Like they have some parts, but they want to build up bulk so they can do a big dump. Other groups that have attacked Sony have done the same. It is clearly a form of media manipulation. One small attack could go ignored, but announcing two or three at the same time. Creates the impression that it is far bigger then it is.

On the plus side they are claiming that consumers will not be collateral in these attacks. Not that there was much meat left on that bone anyway. I am also not buying into this nonsense that an attack on Sony is a attack on the consumers. You might have been ignorant the first time, but nobody is a innocent babe in the woods at this time. The first attack proved that Sony didn't practice basic security, and all the subsequent attacks have done a real good job of highlighting that the problem is systemic.

Those who still have a PS3 have made the conscious decision to stay on a boat that has had twenty leaks in what amounts to short order. You can blame the guys drilling holes in the hull, but that doesn't exactly justify why you are staying on a ship that is sinking, or why you are wasting time complaining. By all means play on a console that is hack fodder, but just be honest with yourself. Sony hacking doesn't seem to be going away. So either you are cool with that or you aren't.

I guess you must think a lot of companies have "laughable" security, as this has happened to more than Sony. Also, it's news to me that Sony has been breached over 20 times in 2011 alone. Any sources?

I find it hilarious that he thinks he is an expert on sony's past and current security systems and also even more laughable about the part on how hackers are getting away with things considering how many hackers are getting revealed and gets arrested these days. it's also funny how he makes NO attempt to blame hackers...sad really...and lol at the ship analogy. >_>

You are only as strong as your weakest link. Sony had apache servers without something even as basic as a firewall. That is pretty laughable, and I'm sure this same thing can be found in other corporations as others have been getting hacked as well, as you mentioned.

As far as the 20  times comment, I think he means Sony as a whole. I remember seeing a new article almost every other day for a while about Sony.com, SonyFilms, PSN, SonyStyle, or whatever other random websites Sony has that were hacked into.



M.U.G.E.N on 22 June 2011
nightsurge said:
M.U.G.E.N said:
CGI-Quality said:
Dodece said:
The grammar may be poor, but that may merely be a artifact of translation. The author may not be fluent, and speak another language entirely. Remember "Won't" is not a typical contraction, and if my memory serves me correctly it was not officially recognized as a real world until quite recently. Speaking to much and more. I can see where any translation software could view them as interchangeable. So I wouldn't write this off. Pun purely intentional. As the work of a moron or idiot. Incapable of doing real harm.

Sony security is nothing less then laughable. This company has been breached twenty times this year. That isn't even including all the denial of service attacks. Sony really is a paper tiger when it comes to security. So can we cut all of the shit please. The hackers have nothing to be afraid of, and are probably going to continue to be successful. Sony basically had no security. It will take longer then a couple months for them to actually get good at security. So the moral of the story is that Sony probably cannot do much to stop hacking at the moment, and any successful hacker will get away with their crime. The preponderance of evidence supports this supposition.

Their gaming network was not rebuilt so much as it was patched. So while the initial vulnerability has been fixed. It doesn't mean that there aren't a lot more vulnerabilities, and based on the content of their manifesto it sounds to be more like a end around attack. I suggest others read that again, because they aren't just proclaiming a attack to take place in the future, but that at least one attack has taken place. They are claiming to have confidential files that they probably intend to share. They make it all sound pretty damning. Which means they think people will be outraged when they read them.

This all reads like they are intending a multifaceted approach. Like they have some parts, but they want to build up bulk so they can do a big dump. Other groups that have attacked Sony have done the same. It is clearly a form of media manipulation. One small attack could go ignored, but announcing two or three at the same time. Creates the impression that it is far bigger then it is.

On the plus side they are claiming that consumers will not be collateral in these attacks. Not that there was much meat left on that bone anyway. I am also not buying into this nonsense that an attack on Sony is a attack on the consumers. You might have been ignorant the first time, but nobody is a innocent babe in the woods at this time. The first attack proved that Sony didn't practice basic security, and all the subsequent attacks have done a real good job of highlighting that the problem is systemic.

Those who still have a PS3 have made the conscious decision to stay on a boat that has had twenty leaks in what amounts to short order. You can blame the guys drilling holes in the hull, but that doesn't exactly justify why you are staying on a ship that is sinking, or why you are wasting time complaining. By all means play on a console that is hack fodder, but just be honest with yourself. Sony hacking doesn't seem to be going away. So either you are cool with that or you aren't.

I guess you must think a lot of companies have "laughable" security, as this has happened to more than Sony. Also, it's news to me that Sony has been breached over 20 times in 2011 alone. Any sources?

I find it hilarious that he thinks he is an expert on sony's past and current security systems and also even more laughable about the part on how hackers are getting away with things considering how many hackers are getting revealed and gets arrested these days. it's also funny how he makes NO attempt to blame hackers...sad really...and lol at the ship analogy. >_>

You are only as strong as your weakest link. Sony had apache servers without something even as basic as a firewall. That is pretty laughable, and I'm sure this same thing can be found in other corporations as others have been getting hacked as well, as you mentioned.

As far as the 20  times comment, I think he means Sony as a whole. I remember seeing a new article almost every other day for a while about Sony.com, SonyFilms, PSN, SonyStyle, or whatever other random websites Sony has that were hacked into.

was that apache server thing ever get proven? all I remember was some professor making a comment on it based on a blog or something. then some site even found evidence for updated servers. didn't really see much news on it afterwards

and come on now most of the 'attacks' were DDOS were they not? heck even CIA and government sites were attacked using them iirc. it's not that sony has horrible security it's just not that great, like pretty much everyone else. I mean hackers hit how many sites/companies already? PBS, CIA, Ninty, Sega, take 2 etc etc. SEGA was hacked after a security update and over 1million user info were leaked.

and NO one knows (at least on this site) what the current situation of security at sony is.

fact of the matter is most of those who do this are not amateurs or anything. these are planned attacks. sometimes even the best security can be breached with crimes like that. good news is tho they will NOT get away with it :) lulzsec for example is going down real hard now..apparently they have picked a fight with a lot of other more capable hackers as well :P their identities are known now and many others will follow soon.

and don't get me wrong I'm not trying to sugar coat sonys shortcomings here, I'm sure they had plenty security holes. But I think it's funny (And tragic at the same time) how some users on this site try to pin the blame on sony alone. that's why I even post in threads like this as I usually avoid them as much as I can.



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For All News/Info related to the PlayStation Vita, Come and join us in the Official PSV Thread!

AlkamistStar on 22 June 2011
CGI-Quality said:
Dodece said:
The grammar may be poor, but that may merely be a artifact of translation. The author may not be fluent, and speak another language entirely. Remember "Won't" is not a typical contraction, and if my memory serves me correctly it was not officially recognized as a real world until quite recently. Speaking to much and more. I can see where any translation software could view them as interchangeable. So I wouldn't write this off. Pun purely intentional. As the work of a moron or idiot. Incapable of doing real harm.

Sony security is nothing less then laughable. This company has been breached twenty times this year. That isn't even including all the denial of service attacks. Sony really is a paper tiger when it comes to security. So can we cut all of the shit please. The hackers have nothing to be afraid of, and are probably going to continue to be successful. Sony basically had no security. It will take longer then a couple months for them to actually get good at security. So the moral of the story is that Sony probably cannot do much to stop hacking at the moment, and any successful hacker will get away with their crime. The preponderance of evidence supports this supposition.

Their gaming network was not rebuilt so much as it was patched. So while the initial vulnerability has been fixed. It doesn't mean that there aren't a lot more vulnerabilities, and based on the content of their manifesto it sounds to be more like a end around attack. I suggest others read that again, because they aren't just proclaiming a attack to take place in the future, but that at least one attack has taken place. They are claiming to have confidential files that they probably intend to share. They make it all sound pretty damning. Which means they think people will be outraged when they read them.

This all reads like they are intending a multifaceted approach. Like they have some parts, but they want to build up bulk so they can do a big dump. Other groups that have attacked Sony have done the same. It is clearly a form of media manipulation. One small attack could go ignored, but announcing two or three at the same time. Creates the impression that it is far bigger then it is.

On the plus side they are claiming that consumers will not be collateral in these attacks. Not that there was much meat left on that bone anyway. I am also not buying into this nonsense that an attack on Sony is a attack on the consumers. You might have been ignorant the first time, but nobody is a innocent babe in the woods at this time. The first attack proved that Sony didn't practice basic security, and all the subsequent attacks have done a real good job of highlighting that the problem is systemic.

Those who still have a PS3 have made the conscious decision to stay on a boat that has had twenty leaks in what amounts to short order. You can blame the guys drilling holes in the hull, but that doesn't exactly justify why you are staying on a ship that is sinking, or why you are wasting time complaining. By all means play on a console that is hack fodder, but just be honest with yourself. Sony hacking doesn't seem to be going away. So either you are cool with that or you aren't.

I guess you must think a lot of companies have "laughable" security, as this has happened to more than Sony. Also, it's news to me that Sony has been breached over 20 times in 2011 alone. Any sources?

I'm not too sure about Sony being breached 20 times, but I wouldn't be surprised if that was accurate. It's certainly been a lot. Sony's game, music, and motion picture divisions were all hacked. The most being their music websites. I can't recall how many myself, but i got most of this info from Engadget as it was happening - but that was weeks ago.



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brendude13 on 22 June 2011
badgenome said:
radishhead said:
This new attack sounds good for us - it turns into a learning process for Sony, and helps them to improve services in the future, but it also doesn't affect the consumers in any way. Unless you own stocks in Sony, I don't see how you can object to this

Agreed. It doesn't affect the customers in any way. Unless they want to actually use the products they've spent money on or something stupid like that. Go, hackers! Save us from ourselves!

Your comments make my day xD.

Even your sig cracks me up.



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Dodece on 22 June 2011

@topic

Unfortunately most of you have it all wrong. These attacks are absolutely amateurish. They exploit a very basic tool for hacking. The hackers haven't exactly been secretive about what technique they are using. Even then Sony seems to have been lethargic about addressing the problem in the rest of its network. The lack or very recent hacks really probably has more to do with new targets then it has to do with Sony suddenly getting much better.

@CGI-Quality

Don't get me wrong there are a lot of companies with bad security, but there are also a lot of companies that have bothered to implement good security. You never hear about that though, because it isn't news. What makes Sony laughable is their uncoordinated response to what was happening to them. They were hacked the exact same way over and over again. That says a lot about information sharing. Where the lessons learned from one incident were not applied to other vulnerable targets. That does constitute a joke. It reads like the three stooges were in charge of the security. Anyway follow the link for a synopsis of all the hacks.

http://attrition.org/security/rants/sony_aka_sownage.html

@Mugen

Follow the above link. While both denial of service attacks, and breaches are technically hacking. One is far more worse then the other. One is like toilet papering a house, and the other is like a burglary. Sony has been burglarized a lot. Speaking to what is proven or not proven there is such a thing as something being very likely. Sony is never going to divulge the exact chain of events, but given the utter simplicity of the following attacks it is safe to say that the first breach wasn't likely to have been any different.



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Hornet303 on 22 June 2011
radishhead said:
This new attack sounds good for us - it turns into a learning process for Sony, and helps them to improve services in the future, but it also doesn't affect the consumers in any way. Unless you own stocks in Sony, I don't see how you can object to this


New attack sounds like its good for us?  If that means to rewind all our intelligence that we've gained during our life spans, than uhh, I still dont get it.  I understand that it was probably translated (very poorly), but that text is by most basic measurements, is totally unreadable.  Seriously, if you're running a giant company like Sony and get a threat like that, do you laugh or get scared?  If fear was their intent, I kinda doubt that worked.

 

Its possible they have some dirt, but who is going to get heard and what is going to get squashed?  If anyone believes a major organization like Sony dosnt have any skeletons in their closets, then you need to re-evaluate your understanding of corporations.  

 

I am all for treating people with respect and I believe that will come full circle at some point in time, but the amount of crap that people believe is credible on the internet is crazy.  I know that people used to believe what was on the news back in the day.  Now that Im older I realize that everyone has their agenda and that typically does not concern any agenda of others.  Id say my internet trust is declining to a good 30% truth out there.  Most is just bullshit written in a fashion to garner traffic and hopefully click on their beloved adds.

 



Notorius.A.i.G on 23 June 2011

How exactly will it be bigger if it won't hurt PSN owners ?



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Galaki on 23 June 2011
CGI-Quality said:
Dodece said:
@topic

Unfortunately most of you have it all wrong. These attacks are absolutely amateurish. They exploit a very basic tool for hacking. The hackers haven't exactly been secretive about what technique they are using. Even then Sony seems to have been lethargic about addressing the problem in the rest of its network. The lack or very recent hacks really probably has more to do with new targets then it has to do with Sony suddenly getting much better.

@CGI-Quality

Don't get me wrong there are a lot of companies with bad security, but there are also a lot of companies that have bothered to implement good security. You never hear about that though, because it isn't news. What makes Sony laughable is their uncoordinated response to what was happening to them. They were hacked the exact same way over and over again. That says a lot about information sharing. Where the lessons learned from one incident were not applied to other vulnerable targets. That does constitute a joke. It reads like the three stooges were in charge of the security. Anyway follow the link for a synopsis of all the hacks.

http://attrition.org/security/rants/sony_aka_sownage.html

@Mugen

Follow the above link. While both denial of service attacks, and breaches are technically hacking. One is far more worse then the other. One is like toilet papering a house, and the other is like a burglary. Sony has been burglarized a lot. Speaking to what is proven or not proven there is such a thing as something being very likely. Sony is never going to divulge the exact chain of events, but given the utter simplicity of the following attacks it is safe to say that the first breach wasn't likely to have been any different.

It's still coming off as you exaggerating the situation. Many companies were hacked, some nearly as bad as Sony. In fact, companies are hacked everyday, but you don't always hear about it.

The difference usually is that they don't lose the kind of customer info that Sony seem to be hogging regardless whether they need the said piece of info. That made the situation worse.

Also, there are open source sql injection tools that allows you to test it against your own network. There are also paid services and tools that are (assumingly) better. If they can't be bother to secured themselves against such n00b attacks, can you really not blame them?



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Rath on 23 June 2011
CGI-Quality said:

As a matter of fact, several companies have lost customer info (some on a significant scale). Again, the PSN situation dwarfs recent attacks and nobody has denied that Sony f*ed up on security, but it has been exaggerated and other attacks have been nearly as bad. They just weren't against a gaming network itself, giving Sony's situation more headlines. Simple matter of media coverage.

It's all about scale, as you say the Sony attack dwarfs pretty much all others. The biggest of the other attacks recently have been ~1 million customers, Sony was ~100 million. While recent attacks have been bad (and show that other companies also have pretty poor security) none of them were in charge of as much customer data as Sony, which is why Sony has been more widely covered - also I don't think most of the other hacks involved credit card information in any form, and credit cards get people twitchy.