By using this site, you agree to our Privacy Policy and our Terms of Use. Close

Forums - General - Lots of bashing for the belief of God....

Rath on 28 April 2011
amp316 said:
sapphi_snake said:
amp316 said:

I find it amusing that many people that "don't believe" in God get extremely angry when he's brought up. 

This is a very simplistic assumption you have there. Maybe you should think a little harder on why that is.

Sometimes things are that simple and it isn't an assumption.  I've seen people on several occasions get furious when God is brought up.  If people truly think that he is just a fictional character like King Arthur, then why do they get so angry?  If I said that I believe in Spiderman, many people would just assume that I am nuts or a child.  There have been several times in my life I have said that I believe in God and have been called an idiot and told things like F--- God, he doesn't exist and hasn't helped you in any way.  Why is this?

I'll tell you why.  I think that many people truly HOPE that there isn't a God so that they don't have to answer for all of the things that they've done in life.  People get angry because they don't want to follow his rules.

I don't force my beliefs on other people so believe what you want, but don't get angry at people for defending what they believe.


It's when belief in God interferes where it shouldn't that people usually get annoyed.

People who believe in God are fine by me.

People who believe that evolution should not be taught to students annoy me. People who believe that homosexuality is evil because God said so  annoy me. People who tell others that they're going to hell annoy me.

The belief in God doesn't always mean these irrational beliefs, but some people hold these beliefs due to their religion and it's often these beliefs that really annoy people.

 

Also the entire 'Deep down atheists believe in god, they just pretend not to so they don't have to think they're going to hell' is some of the most annoying bullshit ever. That really is just offensive.



Around the Network
sapphi_snake on 28 April 2011
amp316 said:
sapphi_snake said:
amp316 said:

@ sapphi snake  I stopped reading after oppressive dictator, no better than Hitler or Stalin.  You are just trying to touch a nerve and I won't let you get to me. 

I wish you the best and hope that one day you will learn tolerance. 

I did not mean to touch a nerve. This is how I genuenly view him. I was just trying to express where I'm coming from.

Then what you're talking about then isn't atheism. 

That's called playing for the other team.  You know, the one that Hitler and Stalin belong to.

I was talking about the hypothetical situation in which the deity you worshiped existed (I do not believe it does, hence why I'm an atheist). This was meant as a counter to the notion that your religion brings any good to the world. Also, Hitler and Stalin had their own teams.



"I don't understand how someone could like Tolstoy and Dostoyevsky, but not like Twilight!!!"

"Last book I read was Brokeback Mountain, I just don't have the patience for them unless it's softcore porn."

                                                                               (The Voice of a Generation and Seece)

"If you cant stand the sound of your own voice than dont become a singer !!!!!"

                                                                               (pizzahut451)

amp316 on 28 April 2011
Rath said:
amp316 said:
sapphi_snake said:
amp316 said:

I find it amusing that many people that "don't believe" in God get extremely angry when he's brought up. 

This is a very simplistic assumption you have there. Maybe you should think a little harder on why that is.

Sometimes things are that simple and it isn't an assumption.  I've seen people on several occasions get furious when God is brought up.  If people truly think that he is just a fictional character like King Arthur, then why do they get so angry?  If I said that I believe in Spiderman, many people would just assume that I am nuts or a child.  There have been several times in my life I have said that I believe in God and have been called an idiot and told things like F--- God, he doesn't exist and hasn't helped you in any way.  Why is this?

I'll tell you why.  I think that many people truly HOPE that there isn't a God so that they don't have to answer for all of the things that they've done in life.  People get angry because they don't want to follow his rules.

I don't force my beliefs on other people so believe what you want, but don't get angry at people for defending what they believe.


It's when belief in God interferes where it shouldn't that people usually get annoyed.

People who believe in God are fine by me.

People who believe that evolution should not be taught to students annoy me. People who believe that homosexuality is evil because God said so  annoy me. People who tell others that they're going to hell annoy me.

The belief in God doesn't always mean these irrational beliefs, but some people hold these beliefs due to their religion and it's often these beliefs that really annoy people.

 

Also the entire 'Deep down atheists believe in god, they just pretend not to so they don't have to think they're going to hell' is some of the most annoying bullshit ever. That really is just offensive.

What you're talking about isn't Christianity at all.  What you're talking about is right-wing Republican politicians trying to use God to further their agenda. 

I never claimed that atheists believe in God.  I am claiming that the "atheists" that get angry when he's mentioned do.  And you know what I find offensive?  When someone calls my God an oppressive dictator like Hitler or Stalin. 



Proud member of the SONIC SUPPORT SQUAD

Tag "Sorry man. Someone pissed in my Wheaties."

"There are like ten games a year that sell over a million units."  High Voltage CEO -  Eric Nofsinger

amp316 on 28 April 2011
sapphi_snake said:
amp316 said:
sapphi_snake said:
amp316 said:

@ sapphi snake  I stopped reading after oppressive dictator, no better than Hitler or Stalin.  You are just trying to touch a nerve and I won't let you get to me. 

I wish you the best and hope that one day you will learn tolerance. 

I did not mean to touch a nerve. This is how I genuenly view him. I was just trying to express where I'm coming from.

Then what you're talking about then isn't atheism. 

That's called playing for the other team.  You know, the one that Hitler and Stalin belong to.

I was talking about the hypothetical situation in which the deity you worshiped existed (I do not believe it does, hence why I'm an atheist). This was meant as a counter to the notion that your religion brings any good to the world. Also, Hitler and Stalin had their own teams, don't really see

When you come out and say that you would reject God if he actually did exist means that you are actually rejecting him in my eyes.  Like I said before, you don't believe and I do and that's fine by me, but don't go on a rant comparing God to Hitler.  God gave everyone in the world life according to my beliefs.  Hitler was the exact opposite.  Also, about religion never doing any good in the world, you are gravely mistaken.  Plenty of people live by the treating others the way that they wish to be treated philosophy and the world is a better place for it whether you believe that God is fabricated or not.



Proud member of the SONIC SUPPORT SQUAD

Tag "Sorry man. Someone pissed in my Wheaties."

"There are like ten games a year that sell over a million units."  High Voltage CEO -  Eric Nofsinger

Rath on 28 April 2011
amp316 said:

What you're talking about isn't Christianity at all.  What you're talking about is right-wing Republican politicians trying to use God to further their agenda. 

I never claimed that atheists believe in God.  I am claiming that the "atheists" that get angry when he's mentioned do.  And you know what I find offensive?  When someone calls my God an oppressive dictator like Hitler or Stalin. 

And right wing republican politicians who use God to further their agenda really annoy me =P. But it isn't only politicians, there are a significant proportion of the population - especially in the USA - who base a very socially conservative (read: completely fucking backwards) agenda on the bible. They're called fundamentalists, and their beliefs really do irk me.

And I wouldn't know about atheists who get angry when God is mentioned, I've never met one. The ones I know (including me) only usually get annoyed with religion/God when people start doing things like I mentioned above.



Around the Network
sapphi_snake on 28 April 2011
amp316 said:

When you come out and say that you would reject God if he actually did exist means that you are actually rejecting him in my eyes.  Like I said before, you don't believe and I do and that's fine by me, but don't go on a rant comparing God to Hitler.  God gave everyone in the world life according to my beliefs.  Hitler was the exact opposite.  Also, about religion never doing any good in the world, you are gravely mistaken.  Plenty of people live by treated others the way that they wish to be treated philosophy and the world is a better place for it whether you believe that God is fabricated or not.

The Christian God aims to control people and every aspect of their lives. The basis is that he somehow has some sort of right to the lives of the people he created, and his whims must be law. That's no different than a dictator. Christianity is full of irrational oppressive rules, than in no way make everyone's lives better. The philosophy you talk about predates Christianity. Confucious came up with the Golden Rule long before Jesus was even born.



"I don't understand how someone could like Tolstoy and Dostoyevsky, but not like Twilight!!!"

"Last book I read was Brokeback Mountain, I just don't have the patience for them unless it's softcore porn."

                                                                               (The Voice of a Generation and Seece)

"If you cant stand the sound of your own voice than dont become a singer !!!!!"

                                                                               (pizzahut451)

pizzahut451 on 28 April 2011
vlad321 said:
pizzahut451 said:
vlad321 said:
pizzahut451 said:


IF we assume that abrahamic religon is right, like Christianity, than the non-abrahamic beleiver doesnt go to Hell, because the single most importnat rule that abrahamic God gave us is that you should love your fellow man. God doesnt judge people by the symbolics and religious figures they worship, but what kind of man were they during their life on Earth. Was the man good, loving and peacefull person, he wont go to Hell. The ''hell'' in today's soceity is greatly misunderstood. its not the place where demons torture you and you burn in fire, those are just symbolics. Hell, in its original concept in Christianity, is a place in afterlife without God, the place where man isnt with God in afterlife. And afterlife without God is said to cause great agonasing sorrow and spiritual pain to the person's soul.

IF we assume abrahamic religion, lke Christianity are wrong, then the beleiver in abrahamic religion wont go to Hell because Hell is pretty much non-existant in non-abrahamic religions. So one way or the other, a religious person wont go to Hell for worshiping a wrong religious figure.

And the Christ's teachings are right because they are morally correct and shows us the way how a good person should live his life.  I mean, do you even know what his teaching were?


I am oging to repost this:

Ah "whatever," the answer of a person with a defeated argument.I posted whatever on the sentence that had absolutely nothing to do with the main point of our discussion

I think you missed the point. I was asking how you determined what the right message is. You say Christianity doesn't have to be the only one with the right message, well, what makes the messages in the bible "the right messages?" I see you have absouletly no idea what Christ's teachings and message was on this world. He was teaching morals and righteous ways on how person should live his life. Puting it in simple English, his message was ''never do anything to another person that you dont wish to be done to yourself''  and ''respect  your God and see hims as the loving and kind God'' Those are his teachings summerized in 2 simple sentences. So what exactly is wrong about his message? Those are both 2 morally corect statements. But again, it all comes down if you beleive in absolute universal laws of morality, or do you believe if they are subjecitve.

There are many other teachings, for instance to Aztecs you were definitely going to their version of hell unless you died in a few very specific way, one of which was being sacrificed to gods. Why is their message of "I need to be sacrificed to a god" not right? Why does it depend on what the other teachings are for them to be valid? What information do you have that is more valid than theirs? Again, substitute anything for Aztec beliefs, even several fairy tales work, and all my questions still hold. You missed the point I was talking about. It doesnt matter if Aztec's beliefs were right or wrong, that doesnt debunk the New Testament and it doesnt make it less vailed or less sacred compared to Aztecs. This only futher proves my theory that you havent read a single page of the New Testament.The New Testament isnt about proving Christianity as the best and the single correct religion in the world. Its about the life on the founder of Christianity and his motal teachings to everyone who choose to follow him or just anyone who wishes to be a good person. Not once did Jesus say that he is the only person people should listen to and that symbolics of abrahamic relgion actually matter.

In your own words: " it does give it vaildity as correct and righteous teachings"  what exactly is that first "it?" Christ's words/ New testament. It comes down to if you believe in universal or subjective morals.

Finally, only the majority of biblical scholars believe Jesus existed. There are still plenty historians who aren't sure either. Just as the case of Arthur. He may have existed, he may not have.There is a lot of non-biblical evidence for hisotircal existance of Jesus Christ. There are few videos about it on youtube but Im too lazy to post them.

And add another question, why do you think it is morally right? Who told you that it is morally right? If you say "because Christ said so" that is extremely circular logic, and therefore wrong.Like I said above, it all comes down to if you believe morals are God given or man-made. I beleive morals are universal and God given, becaue I found all morals given by God and Jesus Christ to be perfectly correct. Its all about faith.



No, the whatever was meant specifically for that single point, I thought you'd catch on.


So... you basically admit to using circular logic to justify whatever you believe in. Good to know. Just as you say "I found all morals given by God are perfectly correct," I can say "I found all morals given by XXXXXXXXX are perfectly correct" where XXXXX is literally anything, again even fairy tales hold as much logical backing as any belief system out there. In fact using circular logic like you do, I can make ust about anything sound true.


As long as those morals given by XXXXXXXX are perfecttly correct too, I dont see a reason why you shouldnt listen to XXXXXX. That is, assuming XXXXXX ia giving correct, good and righteous morals. If XXXXXXXX is givng false and bad morals, than XXXXXX doesnt hold much credit or value in comprassion with God. LIKE I SAID BEFORE, IN THIS ARGUMENT, IT ALL COMES DOWN TO WEATHER YOU BELIEVE IN UNVERSAL OR SUBJECTIVE MORALS. I don't think you know the difference between the 2.



pizzahut451 on 28 April 2011
dib8rman said:
RCTjunkie said:

I find that on the internet forums, people are very respectful to different genders, races, and sexual orientations, but there is something about the belief in God that pushes some (certainly not all) people to become extremely bigoted, more generalizing, and overall more hateful and hostile to this specific group of people. 

Take this random quote:

"I've noticed Christians are hypocrites."

What if we replaced "Christains" with another group:

"I've noticed African Americans are hypocrites."

It seems more hateful and politically incorrect, right? So why is it that people with a belief in God are seemingly excluded for the political corectness that help protects so many other groups?

I know certain groups of people were oppressed over time, but there should be a call for equality, not revenge......

Maybe I'm just too sensitive, but it just comes off that way to me......

Starting today I'm going to start beliving in African American belief diety thing-a-mabob.. damn does that even make sense?

Last I checked a good chunk of African Americans were theists though so then can a theist still be a theist but also be atheist?

I know being a pinker pigment doesn't make you a theist or atheist though... why am I even bothering.

Sad OP is sad. World views are to be criticized and ridiculed when asserted to be correct without any evidence to the claim. In the theist case the very virtue of Christianity is the absence of evidence aka faith.


And  how is atheism any diffrent than Christianity when it comes to evidence and faith? Is there any evidence that supports non-existance of God? HELL NO. Atheist believe theire is no God based on no evidence. Christians beleive there is a God based on no evidence. So we should ridicule Atehism as well right? But, Richard Dawking forbiid than anyone thinks anything even remotly bad about your supeiror beleif. Stop acting like atheism is a proven beleif or something. its not even close to that.



Rath on 28 April 2011
pizzahut451 said:


As long as those morals given by XXXXXXXX are perfecttly correct too, I dont see a reason why you shouldnt listen to XXXXXX. That is, assuming XXXXXX ia giving correct, good and righteous morals. If XXXXXXXX is givng false and bad morals, than XXXXXX doesnt hold much credit or value in comprassion with God. LIKE I SAID BEFORE, IN THIS ARGUMENT, IT ALL COMES DOWN TO WEATHER YOU BELIEVE IN UNVERSAL OR SUBJECTIVE MORALS. I don't think you know the difference between the 2.


Lets say for the sake of argument that morals are objective. Different groups claim to have the correct set of morals. What is it that makes you certain that your morals are the correct and objective ones?



DélioPT on 28 April 2011
sapphi_snake said:
amp316 said:

When you come out and say that you would reject God if he actually did exist means that you are actually rejecting him in my eyes.  Like I said before, you don't believe and I do and that's fine by me, but don't go on a rant comparing God to Hitler.  God gave everyone in the world life according to my beliefs.  Hitler was the exact opposite.  Also, about religion never doing any good in the world, you are gravely mistaken.  Plenty of people live by treated others the way that they wish to be treated philosophy and the world is a better place for it whether you believe that God is fabricated or not.

The Christian God aims to control people and every aspect of their lives. The basis is that he somehow has some sort of right to the lives of the people he created, and his whims must be law. That's no different than a dictator. Christianity is full of irrational oppressive rules, than in no way make everyone's lives better. The philosophy you talk about predates Christianity. Confucious came up with the Golden Rule long before Jesus was even born.

How does God intend to control every aspect of our lives when we were given freedom to choose? Well, seeing as he is the Creator of all things, in a sense He has a right to decide things. Dictators didn`t create life.
Irrational oppressive rules? Well seeing as Jesus never obligated anyone of his followers but asked them to join them and seeing that He even died for us because of love, where exactly those kind of rules emanate from, because the commandment that He taught was to love one another like He loved us. Isn`t that the highest value? Doesn`t that make people an end per se and not a means to an end?

What you don`t seem to understand is that faith IS love and, like love for a any single person, it envolves one giving himself to God, because people believe that love it`s mutual. Does God expect something of us. Yes He does. Does He force anyone to do it? No. People choose what they want to do.

 

To the comments above, one thing is saying that religions are against homosexuality and another is they are against homosexuals. Unfortunately, many, many people (religious people aswell), don`t separate these two and thus give the impression that there isn`t a difference there when there is. What religions aim for is to be people to correct their ways thus fighting sin/temptation and not the person who sins. When people don`t see this separation, then they are doing something that they shouldn`t.