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Forums - Sales - Will Wii offer more of what the Ps2 did or more of the DS?

Seconding/thirding/whatevering "neither."

The closest analogy to the Wii is the PS1, but even that doesn't afford a full comparison. Like the PS1, the Wii is being, and will be, deluged by low-quality shovelware aimed at the class of people buying the system. It ended up taking the PS1 a couple of years to work up a decent library of games, because few developers trusted in its longevity. Once it proved to be a phenomenon, though, it picked up the vast majority of major franchises and paved the way for the PS2's near-monopoly on third-party exclusives.

Now, what the Wii has that the PS1 didn't have is one of the best software development and publishing houses in the world backing it from the outset. As a result, while it took the PS1 a year or two before it found its first true "killer aps," Nintendo already has several: Wii Sports, Wii Play, Super Mario Galaxy, Mario Party, and (in Japan and soon worldwide) Wii Fit. These titles are generating a userbase which will allow for a handful of millions-selling casual titles, a whole bunch of junky shovelware, and an eventually-huge library of more "gamery" titles."

Contrast that with the DS (which has a good offering of casual and party games, but little else) and the PS1 (which wasn't able to expand the market nearly as much as the Wii).



"'Casual games' are something the 'Game Industry' invented to explain away the Wii success instead of actually listening or looking at what Nintendo did. There is no 'casual strategy' from Nintendo. 'Accessible strategy', yes, but ‘casual gamers’ is just the 'Game Industry''s polite way of saying what they feel: 'retarded gamers'."

 -Sean Malstrom

 

 

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RolStoppable said:

Most likely the Wii will become a combination of PS2, GC, DS (if we go by recent systems for a comparison):

  • the most good games of the gen
  • the best exclusives of the gen
  • the best exclusives in new (sub-)genres and the best games for new audiences
People, don't make the mistake to compare the full PS2 library of nearly eight years to the library of the Wii's first year. If you want to make a more realistic comparison, look what the PS2 had when it was in its lifecycle where the Wii is now. In a first year vs. first year comparison the Wii beats the PS2 with ease.

Going by Metacritic, where I've regarded any games above 80 as being a great game and relevant to any discussion about the quality of a consoles library:

PS2's First Year (based on Japanese release, 04/03/2000)

- 12 games 80+

- 4 games 90+ 

 

PS2's First Year (based on US release, 26/10/2000)

- 41 games 80+

- 13 games 90+ 

 

Compared to:

Wii's First Year (19/11/2006, includes a couple of games that were released early)

- 12 games 80+

- 4 games 90+ 

 

Perhaps you have a different definition of what "ease" requires but in terms of its release in the US, the release that is the most important to most gamers here, the Wii got beat with "ease". There is really no comparison. For the record though, the overall quality of the Wii library is also substantially inferior to the Xbox 360's first year and also inferior to the PS3's first year (although the Wii's highs are higher).

 

Xbox 360's First Year (22/11/2005)

- 32 games 80+

- 3 games 90+

 

PS3's First Year (11/11/2006)

- 31 games 80+

- 2 games 90+

 

It seems that the Wii has a couple of really great games (SMG for example) and the quality falls like an absolute rock. The PS2 on the other hand in its first year in the US had the great games (GTA3, GT3 for example) and the quality level remains high with 41 games rated 80+. Sure it had some advantage through a staggered release but seeing as most people here are from the West I figure its a more useful number for comparison. Both the 360 and PS3 showed depth with their libraries in their first year with over 30 games rated 80+. 

 At this point in time it is hard to imagine the Wii ever having the quality levels that we saw on the PS2, or even having a similar level of quality to the Xbox 360.



 
Debating with fanboys, its not
all that dissimilar to banging ones
head against a wall 

as part of the "blue ocean" consumer, i sincerely hope it goes the route of DS as opposed to the PS2.

cry as the "core" gamers might, we're going to win out, and they know it. and they know there's nothing they can do about it. so they keep denouncing the so-called "casual" games.

actually i'm not that "blue ocean", since i do enjoy lite RPGs from time to time. and i play lots of sports games. but i do hope i get to play more games of different variety. from guitar hero to mario and sonic to wii sports to zack and wiki to wii fit.

public gaming tastes change. we're in the midst of one, in fact. most people are afraid of changes, as they threaten what they are used to and have grown accustomed to. hardcore gamers are no different. the correct mentality is to learn to embrace new kinds of games, not to reject games based on the target audience.

not being capable of adapting to change, of course, is the primary fear for most. i, for instance, never grew accustomed to 3D gaming from the NES 2D gaming days. which is... well, just too bad for me. and of course there wasn't anything i could do about it... until the DS came along and my 2D gaming needs are satisfied once more.



the Wii is an epidemic.

I think the Wii is going to be a mix of the DS and NES, it will not only be the system that takes gaming to the masses but also saves gaming



 

Predictions:Sales of Wii Fit will surpass the combined sales of the Grand Theft Auto franchiseLifetime sales of Wii will surpass the combined sales of the entire Playstation family of consoles by 12/31/2015 Wii hardware sales will surpass the total hardware sales of the PS2 by 12/31/2010 Wii will have 50% marketshare or more by the end of 2008 (I was wrong!!  It was a little over 48% only)Wii will surpass 45 Million in lifetime sales by the end of 2008 (I was wrong!!  Nintendo Financials showed it fell slightly short of 45 million shipped by end of 2008)Wii will surpass 80 Million in lifetime sales by the end of 2009 (I was wrong!! Wii didn't even get to 70 Million)

Garcian Smith said:
Seconding/thirding/whatevering "neither."

The closest analogy to the Wii is the PS1, but even that doesn't afford a full comparison. Like the PS1, the Wii is being, and will be, deluged by low-quality shovelware aimed at the class of people buying the system. It ended up taking the PS1 a couple of years to work up a decent library of games, because few developers trusted in its longevity. Once it proved to be a phenomenon, though, it picked up the vast majority of major franchises and paved the way for the PS2's near-monopoly on third-party exclusives.

Now, what the Wii has that the PS1 didn't have is one of the best software development and publishing houses in the world backing it from the outset. As a result, while it took the PS1 a year or two before it found its first true "killer aps," Nintendo already has several: Wii Sports, Wii Play, Super Mario Galaxy, Mario Party, and (in Japan and soon worldwide) Wii Fit. These titles are generating a userbase which will allow for a handful of millions-selling casual titles, a whole bunch of junky shovelware, and an eventually-huge library of more "gamery" titles."

Contrast that with the DS (which has a good offering of casual and party games, but little else) and the PS1 (which wasn't able to expand the market nearly as much as the Wii).

 

I agree with everything except the last line.

 

The PS is the single console that has expanded the market in never before seen proportions. It sold 40 million more than the NES, the second biggest selling console at the time, made console gaming mainstreal and "cool" not just a nerd kids passtime. Once the Wii outsells the PS2 we can talk about market expansion but til then it has only shifted the market.



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Well, if it gets as good as the DS then it will be hard for the universe to contain all the awesomeness. If it only gets as good as the PS2 then it will be okay but not great.


europe-asia-hate-usa said:
Garcian Smith said:
Seconding/thirding/whatevering "neither."

The closest analogy to the Wii is the PS1, but even that doesn't afford a full comparison. Like the PS1, the Wii is being, and will be, deluged by low-quality shovelware aimed at the class of people buying the system. It ended up taking the PS1 a couple of years to work up a decent library of games, because few developers trusted in its longevity. Once it proved to be a phenomenon, though, it picked up the vast majority of major franchises and paved the way for the PS2's near-monopoly on third-party exclusives.

Now, what the Wii has that the PS1 didn't have is one of the best software development and publishing houses in the world backing it from the outset. As a result, while it took the PS1 a year or two before it found its first true "killer aps," Nintendo already has several: Wii Sports, Wii Play, Super Mario Galaxy, Mario Party, and (in Japan and soon worldwide) Wii Fit. These titles are generating a userbase which will allow for a handful of millions-selling casual titles, a whole bunch of junky shovelware, and an eventually-huge library of more "gamery" titles."

Contrast that with the DS (which has a good offering of casual and party games, but little else) and the PS1 (which wasn't able to expand the market nearly as much as the Wii).

 

I agree with everything except the last line.

 

The PS is the single console that has expanded the market in never before seen proportions. It sold 40 million more than the NES, the second biggest selling console at the time, made console gaming mainstreal and "cool" not just a nerd kids passtime. Once the Wii outsells the PS2 we can talk about market expansion but til then it has only shifted the market.


 Actually look at the hardware shipments for NES and PS1 and you'll see why PS1 sold more than NES, it had nothing to do with making gaming cool or anything about expanding the market

 PS          Sony Mar-2007 0.00 / 21.59 0.00 / 40.78 0.00 / 40.12 0.00 / 102.49

NES Nintendo Mar-2007 0.00 / 19.23 0.00 / 34.00 0.00 / 8.56 0.00 / 61.79 

 

 Notice something?  The shipments for Japan and NA are pretty much the same, the only difference being population growth but the numbers for the PAL regions are where you see the big gains for PS over NES, the reason isn't any expansion of the market demographics, but merely because Nintendo never tried to push the NES in the PAL regions to any great degree and it shows, while playstation was truly a global console



 

Predictions:Sales of Wii Fit will surpass the combined sales of the Grand Theft Auto franchiseLifetime sales of Wii will surpass the combined sales of the entire Playstation family of consoles by 12/31/2015 Wii hardware sales will surpass the total hardware sales of the PS2 by 12/31/2010 Wii will have 50% marketshare or more by the end of 2008 (I was wrong!!  It was a little over 48% only)Wii will surpass 45 Million in lifetime sales by the end of 2008 (I was wrong!!  Nintendo Financials showed it fell slightly short of 45 million shipped by end of 2008)Wii will surpass 80 Million in lifetime sales by the end of 2009 (I was wrong!! Wii didn't even get to 70 Million)

Avinash_Tyagi said:
europe-asia-hate-usa said:
Garcian Smith said:
Seconding/thirding/whatevering "neither."

The closest analogy to the Wii is the PS1, but even that doesn't afford a full comparison. Like the PS1, the Wii is being, and will be, deluged by low-quality shovelware aimed at the class of people buying the system. It ended up taking the PS1 a couple of years to work up a decent library of games, because few developers trusted in its longevity. Once it proved to be a phenomenon, though, it picked up the vast majority of major franchises and paved the way for the PS2's near-monopoly on third-party exclusives.

Now, what the Wii has that the PS1 didn't have is one of the best software development and publishing houses in the world backing it from the outset. As a result, while it took the PS1 a year or two before it found its first true "killer aps," Nintendo already has several: Wii Sports, Wii Play, Super Mario Galaxy, Mario Party, and (in Japan and soon worldwide) Wii Fit. These titles are generating a userbase which will allow for a handful of millions-selling casual titles, a whole bunch of junky shovelware, and an eventually-huge library of more "gamery" titles."

Contrast that with the DS (which has a good offering of casual and party games, but little else) and the PS1 (which wasn't able to expand the market nearly as much as the Wii).

 

I agree with everything except the last line.

 

The PS is the single console that has expanded the market in never before seen proportions. It sold 40 million more than the NES, the second biggest selling console at the time, made console gaming mainstreal and "cool" not just a nerd kids passtime. Once the Wii outsells the PS2 we can talk about market expansion but til then it has only shifted the market.


Actually look at the hardware shipments for NES and PS1 and you'll see why PS1 sold more than NES, it had nothing to do with making gaming cool or anything about expanding the market

PS Sony Mar-2007 0.00 / 21.59 0.00 / 40.78 0.00 / 40.12 0.00 / 102.49

NES Nintendo Mar-2007 0.00 / 19.23 0.00 / 34.00 0.00 / 8.56 0.00 / 61.79

 

Notice something? The shipments for Japan and NA are pretty much the same, the only difference being population growth but the numbers for the PAL regions are where you see the big gains for PS over NES, the reason isn't any expansion of the market demographics, but merely because Nintendo never tried to push the NES in the PAL regions to any great degree and it shows, while playstation was truly a global console


PS clearly expanded the market. What you have failed to consider is that the NES essentially had a monopoly, whereas the PS operated in a duopoly market. The industry grew far larger in all markets during the PS/N64 era, and it seems reasonable to suggest that a large reason for this was the PS.

The PS sold more units in both the Americas and Japan, whilst competing against the N64, which managed to sell approximately 33m units itself. Unambiguously, the PS drove a significant expansion of the market in the America's and Japan, in addition to the expansion that occurred in the PAL region.

 



 
Debating with fanboys, its not
all that dissimilar to banging ones
head against a wall 

I dont know where people are getting nintendo is expanding the market from..



 

mM
Picko said:
Avinash_Tyagi said:
europe-asia-hate-usa said:
Garcian Smith said:
Seconding/thirding/whatevering "neither."

The closest analogy to the Wii is the PS1, but even that doesn't afford a full comparison. Like the PS1, the Wii is being, and will be, deluged by low-quality shovelware aimed at the class of people buying the system. It ended up taking the PS1 a couple of years to work up a decent library of games, because few developers trusted in its longevity. Once it proved to be a phenomenon, though, it picked up the vast majority of major franchises and paved the way for the PS2's near-monopoly on third-party exclusives.

Now, what the Wii has that the PS1 didn't have is one of the best software development and publishing houses in the world backing it from the outset. As a result, while it took the PS1 a year or two before it found its first true "killer aps," Nintendo already has several: Wii Sports, Wii Play, Super Mario Galaxy, Mario Party, and (in Japan and soon worldwide) Wii Fit. These titles are generating a userbase which will allow for a handful of millions-selling casual titles, a whole bunch of junky shovelware, and an eventually-huge library of more "gamery" titles."

Contrast that with the DS (which has a good offering of casual and party games, but little else) and the PS1 (which wasn't able to expand the market nearly as much as the Wii).

 

I agree with everything except the last line.

 

The PS is the single console that has expanded the market in never before seen proportions. It sold 40 million more than the NES, the second biggest selling console at the time, made console gaming mainstreal and "cool" not just a nerd kids passtime. Once the Wii outsells the PS2 we can talk about market expansion but til then it has only shifted the market.


Actually look at the hardware shipments for NES and PS1 and you'll see why PS1 sold more than NES, it had nothing to do with making gaming cool or anything about expanding the market

PS Sony Mar-2007 0.00 / 21.59 0.00 / 40.78 0.00 / 40.12 0.00 / 102.49

NES Nintendo Mar-2007 0.00 / 19.23 0.00 / 34.00 0.00 / 8.56 0.00 / 61.79

 

Notice something? The shipments for Japan and NA are pretty much the same, the only difference being population growth but the numbers for the PAL regions are where you see the big gains for PS over NES, the reason isn't any expansion of the market demographics, but merely because Nintendo never tried to push the NES in the PAL regions to any great degree and it shows, while playstation was truly a global console


PS clearly expanded the market. What you have failed to consider is that the NES essentially had a monopoly, whereas the PS operated in a duopoly market. The industry grew far larger in all markets during the PS/N64 era, and it seems reasonable to suggest that a large reason for this was the PS.

The PS sold more units in both the Americas and Japan, whilst competing against the N64, which managed to sell approximately 33m units itself. Unambiguously, the PS drove a significant expansion of the market in the America's and Japan, in addition to the expansion that occurred in the PAL region.

 


 No I haven't forgotten that, what you've forgotten is multiple console ownership, population growth between 1985 and 1995, PS didn't expand the market it took advantage of the fact that it was pushed further into global markets than any console before it, the fact that N64 sold 30 odd million as well has nothing to do with an expanded market, just a larger market thanks to more global coverage and more people alive, and the fact that adjusted for inflation console prices were lower and more people could afford multiple consoles



 

Predictions:Sales of Wii Fit will surpass the combined sales of the Grand Theft Auto franchiseLifetime sales of Wii will surpass the combined sales of the entire Playstation family of consoles by 12/31/2015 Wii hardware sales will surpass the total hardware sales of the PS2 by 12/31/2010 Wii will have 50% marketshare or more by the end of 2008 (I was wrong!!  It was a little over 48% only)Wii will surpass 45 Million in lifetime sales by the end of 2008 (I was wrong!!  Nintendo Financials showed it fell slightly short of 45 million shipped by end of 2008)Wii will surpass 80 Million in lifetime sales by the end of 2009 (I was wrong!! Wii didn't even get to 70 Million)