Player's Choice games came at half the price, so they were a nice way to buy good titles at a cheap price. But that really doesn't matter for my point, because I am saying that people picked it up expecting a FPS and that can only hold up for initial sales, so the first two months at best. In the same way, the majority of people who liked Metroid Prime would also pick up Echoes within the first two months of release, unless it was a flawed game (which it wasn't going by reviews and initial opinions certainly weren't as devastating as the ones for Other M). I hope that makes sense.

Which leads me directly to numbers. Metroid Prime sold 722k units in its first two months in the USA, compared to 470k for Echoes in the same timeframe. At the time of Echoes' release, Metroid Prime was closing in on 1.2m copies being sold, but less than half of those people bought the sequel in its initial two months on the market. Normally sequels to successful games open with similar or even higher numbers than the previous game which again leads me to believe that many people indeed bought Metroid Prime with the wrong expectations after being sucked in by the hype. 

There was nothing like Metroid Prime before Metroid Prime, so there is a good chance that many people ended up not liking the game, simply because they didn't know what they were getting into. Hence why I am talking about inflated sales. The question is would Metroid Prime's sales have been higher or lower, if people had already played a game like it before? I am settling for lower.

There are no drastic changes between the three games of the Metroid Prime Trilogy and sales around the 1.5m mark seem to be the most the series can hope for under normal conditions. The first game launched under exceptional conditions though, that's why out of the three games I point to Metroid Prime as the anomaly and the other two games as the norm for the series' sales. Nintendo and Retro did nothing wrong with Echoes and Corruption, the series simply can't sell more than it has due to its content.

Lastly, I would have had a good counterpoint if I had been quicker with my quick edit.

It's hard to define innovation anymore, what Nintendo needs to focus on is making the best games as they used to  ( not anymore), but stop coming up with gimmick although popular but devalues their standards. I know their goals is to find new ways to play games which is fine, but what's more important: making the best games or the most innovative game? As to me,  innovation as to coming up with new stuff is quite overrated because when you focus on great things innovation comes automaticly. 

I think many people debated that point in a thread not too far back... the best versions of many of Nintendos biggest IPs have come out this gen be it on DS or Wii as well as really good new IPs that flat out carried the Wii when third parties didn't... so that's a hard point to sell to people, just saying.

As for the thread, I expected to see some rol tactics here but this was pretty much straight forward and I agree generally when games, genres, etc keep adding things because that's what the core "wants", it generally leads to decline, when a popular series goes back to it's roots, makes it a bit more accessible, the sales usually increase by a lot even if the reviews don't.  So it's like this do you listen to the stuck up people (be they reviewers or "hardcore" gamers)or do you listen to the people that play games? Hrm.

I think we are confusing best selling to best version. Nintendo was regarded as the best developers of games, it's debatable these days no matter how many fans sees it. That doesn't mean they are making bad games, far from it, they just don't make the best games anymore. 

I'm sorry popular has never meant quality to me no matter the genre. Nintendo has been very smart early most of this Generation, they made games that draw in a new market, they have a couple games that have sold insane numbers and continue to sell, as far as being the best games, they were not. 

And I am not picking on Nintendo with this whole innovation thing, Sony is having their own issue too because they think everything they make has to so powerful. Which is why I think MS is the most balance right now. 

No I'm not confusing anything at all, best 3D Mario, best Smash, best Kart, best Donkey Kong, best New Super Mario Bros, best Animal Crossing, etc out of those Animal Crossing is the only one to not live up to sales of the game that came before it as well.... sooooo no I've never meant best selling, I meant the best versions, they're just going hand in hand for the most part.

I will give you best 3D Mario as they are truly great games. I havent played DK or Animal crossing this gen. Everything else is debateble to me. 

And there you have it, it's debatable to you not to many others, hell I've been playing most of these Nintendo series since I was barely old enough to hold an NES controller and well flat out Nintendo was off their game during the Gamecube era, they made some of the worst choices they ever have.  The Wii/DS they've been knocking it out of the park time and time again, New Super Mario Bros Wii is the best 2D Mario since the SNES days and for me since Super Mario Bros 3, Mario Kart for DS stomps the crap out of the entire series and Mario Kart Wii is right behind it, I'm certain Rol here would probably say the Wii version is better than the DS version.  

Melee was a step in the wrong direction for Smash even then between it and Double Dash that was all that kept Gamecube going, but they came out with Brawl taking out the glitches tournament players abused the hell out of, added in online, and then gave people what they wanted and more with content out the wazoo. Donkey Kong Country Returns is the only good Donkey Kong game to come out since the SNES and even then it's better than those SNES titles.  

Honestly to believe Nintendo has not been on top of their game this gen is basically believing the hype of the snooty internet reviewer, website, or "hardcore" forum poster.  It's utter rubbish and they didn't get to the top of the pile with hope and luck alone or brought back in many of their old fans while making games for the new crowds... I'm not saying they didn't "slip up" at any time, far from that, but that's like saying the SNES/N64 (the two consoles the "hardcore swear by) had hit after hit every month IE it didn't, people just like to look into the past with rose tinted glasses.