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Forums - Nintendo - Pachter doesn't know priorities!

 

Pachter doesn't know priorities!

Heresy! Pachter is God! 11 12.64%
 
Even a god may be wrong sometimes... 5 5.75%
 
Pachter is a demigod 3 3.45%
 
Pachter has priorities mo... 12 13.79%
 
Pachter is my dad 4 4.60%
 
Pachter is my cat 52 59.77%
 
Total:87
Darth Tigris on 31 January 2011
Khuutra said:
Darth Tigris said:
Khuutra said:

Hm

No, not at all, particularly not for the systems with Nintendo games.

Nintendo games aren't the reason why the Wii is as popular as it is.  The N64 and GC were home to a better library of Nintendo games than the Wii but didn't sell near as well.

That's just not true. Wii Sports carried this system for about 30 million units by itself.

And frankly, the Wii's library is both better and better-selling than its predecessors when it comes to Nintendo games.

Nintendo games were what drove the Wii and the DS. You can't blame it on anything but the games - certainly not the operating system and related services.

I'm not talking sales, I'm talking actual games.  With the exception of SMG and SMG2 (which are spectaculous!), most of the games have been dirivatives of older, better Nintendo games.

The thing is that the initial gimmick of the Wii caused a bunch of people to come BACK and enjoy Nintendo's franchises in addition to the new motion based IP's.  If it was just quality game based, why didn't Mario 64, Zelda: OoT, MM, WW, SMS (ok, that wasn't so great but still really good) and the scores of other great Nintendo developed games push the N64 or GC to huge install bases?  

With 80 million Wii's out there vs <33 mil of the N64 and GC, Nintendo software is bound to sell much better.  The motion control is what drove the Wii, the games helped sustain it.  I can't believe I'm having to actually argue this ...



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Azelover on 31 January 2011

The Wii was successful because it was different, aside from that 2D Mario is huge and that's really what it boils down to. The Wii having a new market all by itself, with no competition and 2D Mario coming back made the Wii what it is.



badgenome on 31 January 2011

Pachter doesn't know shit.



Sempuukyaku on 31 January 2011
Darth Tigris said:
Khuutra said:
Darth Tigris said:
Khuutra said:

Hm

No, not at all, particularly not for the systems with Nintendo games.

Nintendo games aren't the reason why the Wii is as popular as it is.  The N64 and GC were home to a better library of Nintendo games than the Wii but didn't sell near as well.

That's just not true. Wii Sports carried this system for about 30 million units by itself.

And frankly, the Wii's library is both better and better-selling than its predecessors when it comes to Nintendo games.

Nintendo games were what drove the Wii and the DS. You can't blame it on anything but the games - certainly not the operating system and related services.

I'm not talking sales, I'm talking actual games.  With the exception of SMG and SMG2 (which are spectaculous!), most of the games have been dirivatives of older, better Nintendo games.

The thing is that the initial gimmick of the Wii caused a bunch of people to come BACK and enjoy Nintendo's franchises in addition to the new motion based IP's.  If it was just quality game based, why didn't Mario 64, Zelda: OoT, MM, WW, SMS (ok, that wasn't so great but still really good) and the scores of other great Nintendo developed games push the N64 or GC to huge install bases?  

With 80 million Wii's out there vs <33 mil of the N64 and GC, Nintendo software is bound to sell much better.  The motion control is what drove the Wii, the games helped sustain it.  I can't believe I'm having to actually argue this ...


What??

 

Wii Sports was actually a decent game that PLAYED WELL in response to the motion controls. If the game had been a trainwreck, the Wii would never have left the station and consumers would have cared less about motion controls. 

 

I'm also going to have to challenge your assertion that it was just older "better" Nintendo games (what a back-handed comment) that sustained the Wii. I don't recall Wii Fit or Wii Fit Plus being derivatives of older games. Same with Wii Play, Epic Mickey, Wii Party, Just Dance, Just Dance 2, Mario & Sonic at the Olympic Games, Deca Sports, or Big Brain Academy for that matter...all million sellers.



Khuutra on 31 January 2011
Darth Tigris said:
Khuutra said:

That's just not true. Wii Sports carried this system for about 30 million units by itself.

And frankly, the Wii's library is both better and better-selling than its predecessors when it comes to Nintendo games.

Nintendo games were what drove the Wii and the DS. You can't blame it on anything but the games - certainly not the operating system and related services.

I'm not talking sales, I'm talking actual games.  With the exception of SMG and SMG2 (which are spectaculous!), most of the games have been dirivatives of older, better Nintendo games.

The thing is that the initial gimmick of the Wii caused a bunch of people to come BACK and enjoy Nintendo's franchises in addition to the new motion based IP's.  If it was just quality game based, why didn't Mario 64, Zelda: OoT, MM, WW, SMS (ok, that wasn't so great but still really good) and the scores of other great Nintendo developed games push the N64 or GC to huge install bases?  

With 80 million Wii's out there vs <33 mil of the N64 and GC, Nintendo software is bound to sell much better.  The motion control is what drove the Wii, the games helped sustain it.  I can't believe I'm having to actually argue this ...

You can throw around that language all you like, but the Wii's library has been demonstrably better on several levels.

What's more is that motion control didn't sell the games - it's the games that sold motion control. Do you think anyone would have given a shit about motion controls if not for Wii Sports, or Wii Play, or Mario Kart Wii? You are wrong. It is the games, always the games, that drive concepts and harware. The Wii did not magically sell that much on its own, by sheer virtue of its "gimmick" - the games spoke for themselves and had more appeal than their predecessors.

You aren't actually arguing it much. It will be an argument when you provide reasoning for it or cite examples. Keep in mind, though, that while quality is subjective, appeal isn't, and the appeal of the Wii's library is objectively greater.



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Alby_da_Wolf on 31 January 2011
Squilliam said:

He didn't say it'd fail, he said it'd fail to sell more than the Wii. In respect to both the Wii and DS and their 3DS and Wii 2 counter-parts it isn't too unsafe to say that they may sell less than their previous incarnations. The Wii is selling more than 100M consoles LTD, and the DS will sell well over 160M.

Since we know that the 3DS is essentially a DS2 plus 3D and is coming into more handheld competition than the DS ever faced from the likes of Apple and it doesn't seem to hold any revolutionary new values to the same extent the DS had over the GBA and whilst the Wii 2 is still unknown at this point the majority of what made Wii new and innovative has now been incorporated into competing consoles.

You give a possible sensible reason, I agree with you, not with Pachter. And the vast majority of Wii's and DS' new markets are simply happy with what those two devices give them, they give them all the gaming/not gaming/casual gaming they need, a big part of them could simply not feel any need to upgrade to next gen. Also, as you said, now some of Wii's features are available on the competition too, but while I agree with those telling you and others that good games using those features are necessary to succeed, I don't see why Nintendo's competitors shouldn't have their 1st and 3rd parties making those games.



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Khuutra on 31 January 2011
Alby_da_Wolf said:

You give a possible sensible reason, I agree with you, not with Pachter. And the vast majority of Wii's and DS' new markets are simply happy with what those two devices give them, they give them all the gaming/not gaming/casual gaming they need, a big part of them could simply not feel any need to upgrade to next gen. Also, as you said, now some of Wii's features are available on the competition too, but while I agree with those telling you and others that good games using those features are necessary to succeed, I don't see why Nintendo's competitors shouldn't have their 1st and 3rd parties making those games.

Mmmm, the fear of users not upgrading to other hardware only really works if those users don't buy games - but they do. They seek out new experiences, and will continue to do so wherever they can.



Ishar on 31 January 2011

Well, Pachter always put a smile on my face :]



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mhsillen on 31 January 2011
Squilliam said:

He didn't say it'd fail, he said it'd fail to sell more than the Wii. In respect to both the Wii and DS and their 3DS and Wii 2 counter-parts it isn't too unsafe to say that they may sell less than their previous incarnations. The Wii is selling more than 100M consoles LTD, and the DS will sell well over 160M.

Since we know that the 3DS is essentially a DS2 plus 3D and is coming into more handheld competition than the DS ever faced from the likes of Apple and it doesn't seem to hold any revolutionary new values to the same extent the DS had over the GBA and whilst the Wii 2 is still unknown at this point the majority of what made Wii new and innovative has now been incorporated into competing consoles.

Actually he said it would fail

His arrogant comments about how the wii hd was coming and then when it didn't he wasn't wrong nintendo was wrong. 

he is like a little kid going thru all angry demonstrations when they don't get their way . Whining then crying then holding their breath and then a full out lying on the floor, screaming bloody murder, tantrum 



Joelcool7 on 31 January 2011
Darth Tigris said:
Khuutra said:
Squilliam said:
Khuutra said:

I think the majority of disagreement with Mr. Pachter will come as a result of the idea that it's not hardware features the make a platform unique or successful, it's games.

Games yes but since a lot of software is multiplatform truthfully the most unique thing about each platform is actually the operating system and the associated services.

Hm

No, not at all, particularly not for the systems with Nintendo games.


Nintendo games aren't the reason why the Wii is as popular as it is.  The N64 and GC were home to a better library of Nintendo games than the Wii but didn't sell near as well.


Hey their thats my bit (Defend GameCube) two years ago I would totally have agreed that GameCube and N64 had better libraries. However since NewSuperMarioBros , Donkey Kong and Kirby are all present on the Wii with another great looking Zelda title on the way and at least another year of Nintendo releases. Even GameCube's great library is inferior to the Wii.

Nobody can argue that Nintendo hasn't put a ton of swet and tears into giving the Wii the best first party games possible.



-JC7

"In God We Trust - In Games We Play " - Joel Reimer