By using this site, you agree to our Privacy Policy and our Terms of Use. Close

Forums - General - The death penalty.

Khuutra said:
Slimebeast said:
Khuutra said:
Slimebeast said:

Is there something wrong with revenge?

Revenge, at first though sweet,
Bitter ere long back on itself recoils.

Is that a quote from Yoda?

John Milton, Paradise Lost. If you think George Lucas could write something liek that, youv'e never watched Star Wars in English.

From the book of Romans:

12:17 Do not repay anyone evil for evil; consider what is good before all people. 18 If possible, so far as it depends on you, live peaceably with all people. 19 Do not avenge yourselves, dear friends, but give place to God’s wrath, for it is written, “Vengeance is mine, I will repay,” says the Lord. 20 Rather, if your enemy is hungry, feed him; if he is thirsty, give him a drink; for in doing this you will be heaping burning coals on his head. 21 Do not be overcome by evil, but overcome evil with good.

That's if you believe in a God that will take out your revenge for you. And it still acknowledges revenge as something rightful (in the end).

But if you don't believe in God you need to have the state to deal out the revenge instead.



Around the Network

justice is not served by revenge.  its served by fair punishment.  the execution of people who murdered others is fair.



"I like my steaks how i like my women.  Bloody and all over my face"

"Its like sex, but with a winner!"

MrBubbles Review Threads: Bill Gates, Jak II, Kingdom Hearts II, The Strangers, Sly 2, Crackdown, Zohan, Quarantine, Klungo Sssavesss Teh World, MS@E3'08, WATCHMEN(movie), Shadow of the Colossus, The Saboteur

Khuutra said:
badgenome said:
Khuutra said:

This is almost definitely not true.

The average cost for someone to be imprisoned in California - as I recall - is about 50,000 USD a year; as in you could send them to UC Berkley with room, board, books, and everything, and spend a lot less money.

Extrapolate that shit to fifty years.

Yeah, but if you factor in court appeals and how long it takes to actually getting around to executing someone (10 years or more)? I can see it.

Court appeals happen without the death penalty, too. Even assuming that a person sentenced to life only lives ten years logner in prison than does someone on death row (this is not the case), you also have to factor in increased cost of care as a person ages - once you hit your mid forties, you become a lot harder to take care of. Execution would have to be enormously, egregiously expensive in order to outweigh how huge the cost of holding a prisoner for the course of his life is.

There's a great deal more deliberation (and often many more appeals) when it's a capital case, though. In North Carolina, it costs something like $2.5 million just to bring about such a case. A Duke University study from '93 put the total cost of execution at $163,000 more than a 20 year stretch in the slammer; if it's like everything else, that discrepancy has probably grown rather than shrunk over the last 17 years.



Slimebeast said:

That's if you believe in a God that will take out your revenge for you. And it still acknowledges revenge as something rightful (in the end).

But if you don't believe in God you need to have the state to deal out the revenge instead.

Except that revenge doesn't serve anyone, even without the background of scripture. Milton's words still ring true; revenge does not help, only serving to make ragged fresh wounds.

And the point of that passage is that revenge is not the domain of man, not that it is the domain of God. The latter is used to explain the former, not as a justification.



badgenome said:

There's a great deal more deliberation (and often many more appeals) when it's a capital case, though. In North Carolina, it costs something like $2.5 million just to bring about such a case. A Duke University study from '93 put the total cost of execution at $163,000 more than a 20 year stretch in the slammer; if it's like everything else, that discrepancy has probably grown rather than shrunk over the last 17 years.

Very interesting, though that 20 year stretch in the slammer is not the same as a literal life sentence (which I believe was the point of contention), which can last for three or four decades.



Around the Network

Kill the killers, they deserve to die unless they are insane or something.



Khuutra said:
badgenome said:

There's a great deal more deliberation (and often many more appeals) when it's a capital case, though. In North Carolina, it costs something like $2.5 million just to bring about such a case. A Duke University study from '93 put the total cost of execution at $163,000 more than a 20 year stretch in the slammer; if it's like everything else, that discrepancy has probably grown rather than shrunk over the last 17 years.

Very interesting, though that 20 year stretch in the slammer is not the same as a literal life sentence (which I believe was the point of contention), which can last for three or four decades.

That's true. I've not found anything else comparably academic on more extended prison stays, just stuff that looks suspiciously like anti-death penalty propaganda. Either way, the savings from killing someone vs. feeding and housing them for a few decades clearly aren't what they'd seem at first blush.



badgenome said:
Khuutra said:

Very interesting, though that 20 year stretch in the slammer is not the same as a literal life sentence (which I believe was the point of contention), which can last for three or four decades.

That's true. I've not found anything else comparably academic on more extended prison stays, just stuff that looks suspiciously like anti-death penalty propaganda. Either way, the savings from killing someone vs. feeding and housing them for a few decades clearly aren't what they'd seem at first blush.

On that point we agree, though I think as an issue cost effectiveness would be more appropriate a topic for a discussion about the failings of our penal system in general.



For it only in extenuating circumstances.

Against it for people who have scope for improvement.

Making that distinction is up to the government or the court.



All hail the KING, Andrespetmonkey

I've never understood how kiling another person, no matter how wicked and terrible that person is, could ever be viewed as a valid option.



"I don't understand how someone could like Tolstoy and Dostoyevsky, but not like Twilight!!!"

"Last book I read was Brokeback Mountain, I just don't have the patience for them unless it's softcore porn."

                                                                               (The Voice of a Generation and Seece)

"If you cant stand the sound of your own voice than dont become a singer !!!!!"

                                                                               (pizzahut451)