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Forums - General Discussion - Belief in God produces Hell on Earth

pizzahut451 said:
kowhoho said:
pizzahut451 said:

I dont think i have EVER in my life seen so much double standared hypocrites and ignornce in one plce as i have in this thread today. Dear God...

I haven't been keeping up with this thread (as it's entirely derailed at this point). If you wouldn't mind terribly could you give some examples of this hypocracy so I could have even a small chance of re-entering this conversation?

The last page or so is riddled with convoluted quote boxes and italiced/non-italicized text and everyone is using different formatting techniques. It's all very confusing! >.<

Well, i see people saying ''you have no right to judge anyone because they are attracted to same gender'' but than they call other people who disagree with them biggots and homophobes. Than they say ''youur beliefs dont matter'' but than they pretend like their beliefs are the right ones simply because they think so and try to force them on you. Then they go out and say that christianity sees homosexuality as a sin. thiat is an example of pure ignorance. then the people go on saying that if you dont support gay marrige your a big homophobe and biggot. i dont support it and im not either of those things. and if you try to convice me diffrent, you just proved my 1st point.

Oh, then I guess we shouldn't have any sort of reasonable discussion about it.Pffft.

They didn't call him a bigot and a homophobe because he "thinks differently than them," it's because he shows signs of a negative predisposition to gays in general.

You are also blowing the whole "forcing beliefs down my throat" thing way out of proportion. This forum is a place for people to say what they think (and in the case of atheists, provide support for it), which is not, in itself, oppressive in any way. You yourself are showing signs of bigotry against atheists by your incessant overdramatizing of us. You say we "pretend" our beliefs are right "because they think so" but that's definitely not the case. Atheists actually provide evidence for what they belief, as opposed to the majority of organized religion. Your using an argument that is more commonly used against the religious.

I suppose if you were against gay marraige for some sort of technical or objective reason, one couldn't call you a biggot. However, since by saying you don't support the marraige of gays you are implying that you don't think gays deserve the same rights of everyone else (which would by definition land you the title of biggot). Can I ask why you don't support gay marraige, if not because of your religion?



I survived the Apocalyps3

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Scoobes said:
pizzahut451 said:
kowhoho said:
pizzahut451 said:

I dont think i have EVER in my life seen so much double standared hypocrites and ignornce in one plce as i have in this thread today. Dear God...

I haven't been keeping up with this thread (as it's entirely derailed at this point). If you wouldn't mind terribly could you give some examples of this hypocracy so I could have even a small chance of re-entering this conversation?

The last page or so is riddled with convoluted quote boxes and italiced/non-italicized text and everyone is using different formatting techniques. It's all very confusing! >.<

Well, i see people saying ''you have no right to judge anyone because they are attracted to same gender'' but than they call other people who disagree with them biggots and homophobes. Than they say ''youur beliefs dont matter'' but than they pretend like their beliefs are the right ones simply because they think so and try to force them on you.

Who's forcing anyone's views on anyone else? If you disagree that homosexuality isn't a natural occurence then you're comming from a position of ignorance. If you think that gay people shouldn't have the same rights as heterosexuals then that is the definition of homophobic. Nothing judgmental about it, just a simple definition of the word. And noone is impossing anything on your rights as an indvidual by saying it.

Then they go out and say that christianity sees homosexuality as a sin. thiat is an example of pure ignorance. then the people go on saying that if you dont support gay marrige your a big homophobe and biggot. i dont support it and im not either of those things. and if you try to convice me diffrent, you just proved my 1st point.

Considerring their are quotes in the bible that suggest it's a sin you can see where they may get this view. Out of interest, why don't you support gay marriage/civil partnerships? Why exactly are heterosexuals more deserving of these rights than heterosexuals?




I DO THINIK homosexuality is natural. And so did the guy with the monkey avatar.But calling someone homophobic for not sharing your views is FORCING your views on somebody. And just because i think gay marrige is wrong doesnt mean i hate and fear gay people which homophobia really is about. And i dont see marrige as a ''right'.I see it as a trdition between man and a woman. Love and being able to be in open public relationship with someone you love regardles the gender is a right. And btw, i am not impossing anybody's rights by saying my opinnion on gay marrige NEITHER. Thats what the people i talked about need to understand.

And where exactly does God or Jesus say that homosexaulity is a sin? God and Jesus, the son of God, are the only ones who can determinate whats a sin in christian religion, so where do they say it? Whoever else said it in the bible, its not a sin, unless said otherwise by God himself or Jesus Christ.



kowhoho said:
pizzahut451 said:
kowhoho said:
pizzahut451 said:

I dont think i have EVER in my life seen so much double standared hypocrites and ignornce in one plce as i have in this thread today. Dear God...

I haven't been keeping up with this thread (as it's entirely derailed at this point). If you wouldn't mind terribly could you give some examples of this hypocracy so I could have even a small chance of re-entering this conversation?

The last page or so is riddled with convoluted quote boxes and italiced/non-italicized text and everyone is using different formatting techniques. It's all very confusing! >.<

Well, i see people saying ''you have no right to judge anyone because they are attracted to same gender'' but than they call other people who disagree with them biggots and homophobes. Than they say ''youur beliefs dont matter'' but than they pretend like their beliefs are the right ones simply because they think so and try to force them on you. Then they go out and say that christianity sees homosexuality as a sin. thiat is an example of pure ignorance. then the people go on saying that if you dont support gay marrige your a big homophobe and biggot. i dont support it and im not either of those things. and if you try to convice me diffrent, you just proved my 1st point.

Oh, then I guess we shouldn't have any sort of reasonable discussion about it.Pffft.

They didn't call him a bigot and a homophobe because he "thinks differently than them," it's because he shows signs of a negative predisposition to gays in general.

You are also blowing the whole "forcing beliefs down my throat" thing way out of proportion. This forum is a place for people to say what they think (and in the case of atheists, provide support for it), which is not, in itself, oppressive in any way. You yourself are showing signs of bigotry against atheists by your incessant overdramatizing of us. You say we "pretend" our beliefs are right "because they think so" but that's definitely not the case. Atheists actually provide evidence for what they belief, as opposed to the majority of organized religion. Your using an argument that is more commonly used against the religious.

I suppose if you were against gay marraige for some sort of technical or objective reason, one couldn't call you a biggot. However, since by saying you don't support the marraige of gays you are implying that you don't think gays deserve the same rights of everyone else (which would by definition land you the title of biggot). Can I ask why you don't support gay marraige, if not because of your religion?

I never once mentioned atheists or any other group of people in my post, so why are you bringing them up is beyond me. And since you said atheists, you meant the people who dont believe in any God and you said they provide an evidence for that, but there is no evidence that shows that God doesnt exist. But thats another discussion and it doesnt really matter tho, since i didnt even mention them. The monkey avatar guy said he doesnt support gay marrige and all the sudden people started calling him homophobe and bigot. So he got attacked for not sharing your views, even tho he himself said he doesnt have anything against gays.it would be like if the atheist guy said '' I dont support religion and i think its wrong, but i have nothing agaisnt religious people at all''. is he a biggot? How the hell can the monkey avatar guy be a biggot or even a homophobe if he said he has nothing agaisnt them?



pizzahut451 said:
Scoobes said:
pizzahut451 said:
kowhoho said:
pizzahut451 said:

I dont think i have EVER in my life seen so much double standared hypocrites and ignornce in one plce as i have in this thread today. Dear God...

I haven't been keeping up with this thread (as it's entirely derailed at this point). If you wouldn't mind terribly could you give some examples of this hypocracy so I could have even a small chance of re-entering this conversation?

The last page or so is riddled with convoluted quote boxes and italiced/non-italicized text and everyone is using different formatting techniques. It's all very confusing! >.<

Well, i see people saying ''you have no right to judge anyone because they are attracted to same gender'' but than they call other people who disagree with them biggots and homophobes. Than they say ''youur beliefs dont matter'' but than they pretend like their beliefs are the right ones simply because they think so and try to force them on you.

Who's forcing anyone's views on anyone else? If you disagree that homosexuality isn't a natural occurence then you're comming from a position of ignorance. If you think that gay people shouldn't have the same rights as heterosexuals then that is the definition of homophobic. Nothing judgmental about it, just a simple definition of the word. And noone is impossing anything on your rights as an indvidual by saying it.

Then they go out and say that christianity sees homosexuality as a sin. thiat is an example of pure ignorance. then the people go on saying that if you dont support gay marrige your a big homophobe and biggot. i dont support it and im not either of those things. and if you try to convice me diffrent, you just proved my 1st point.

Considerring their are quotes in the bible that suggest it's a sin you can see where they may get this view. Out of interest, why don't you support gay marriage/civil partnerships? Why exactly are heterosexuals more deserving of these rights than heterosexuals?




I DO THINIK homosexuality is natural. And so did the guy with the monkey avatar.But calling someone homophobic for not sharing your views is FORCING your views on somebody. And just because i think gay marrige is wrong doesnt mean i hate and fear gay people which homophobia really is about. And i dont see marrige as a ''right'.I see it as a trdition between man and a woman. Love and being able to be in open public relationship with someone you love regardles the gender is a right. And btw, i am not impossing anybody's rights by saying my opinnion on gay marrige NEITHER. Thats what the people i talked about need to understand.

And where exactly does God or Jesus say that homosexaulity is a sin? God and Jesus, the son of God, are the only ones who can determinate whats a sin in christian religion, so where do they say it? Whoever else said it in the bible, its not a sin, unless said otherwise by God himself or Jesus Christ.

God hasn't ever said anything to anybody.



I survived the Apocalyps3

pizzahut451 said:
kowhoho said:
pizzahut451 said:
kowhoho said:
pizzahut451 said:

I dont think i have EVER in my life seen so much double standared hypocrites and ignornce in one plce as i have in this thread today. Dear God...

I haven't been keeping up with this thread (as it's entirely derailed at this point). If you wouldn't mind terribly could you give some examples of this hypocracy so I could have even a small chance of re-entering this conversation?

The last page or so is riddled with convoluted quote boxes and italiced/non-italicized text and everyone is using different formatting techniques. It's all very confusing! >.<

Well, i see people saying ''you have no right to judge anyone because they are attracted to same gender'' but than they call other people who disagree with them biggots and homophobes. Than they say ''youur beliefs dont matter'' but than they pretend like their beliefs are the right ones simply because they think so and try to force them on you. Then they go out and say that christianity sees homosexuality as a sin. thiat is an example of pure ignorance. then the people go on saying that if you dont support gay marrige your a big homophobe and biggot. i dont support it and im not either of those things. and if you try to convice me diffrent, you just proved my 1st point.

Oh, then I guess we shouldn't have any sort of reasonable discussion about it.Pffft.

They didn't call him a bigot and a homophobe because he "thinks differently than them," it's because he shows signs of a negative predisposition to gays in general.

You are also blowing the whole "forcing beliefs down my throat" thing way out of proportion. This forum is a place for people to say what they think (and in the case of atheists, provide support for it), which is not, in itself, oppressive in any way. You yourself are showing signs of bigotry against atheists by your incessant overdramatizing of us. You say we "pretend" our beliefs are right "because they think so" but that's definitely not the case. Atheists actually provide evidence for what they belief, as opposed to the majority of organized religion. Your using an argument that is more commonly used against the religious.

I suppose if you were against gay marraige for some sort of technical or objective reason, one couldn't call you a biggot. However, since by saying you don't support the marraige of gays you are implying that you don't think gays deserve the same rights of everyone else (which would by definition land you the title of biggot). Can I ask why you don't support gay marraige, if not because of your religion?

I never once mentioned atheists or any other group of people in my post, so why are you bringing them up is beyond me. And since you said atheists, you meant the people who dont believe in any God and you said they provide an evidence for that, but there is no evidence that shows that God doesnt exist. But thats another discussion and it doesnt really matter tho, since i didnt even mention them. The monkey avatar guy said he doesnt support gay marrige and all the sudden people started calling him homophobe and bigot. So he got attacked for not sharing your views, even tho he himself said he doesnt have anything against gays.it would be like if the atheist guy said '' I dont support religion and i think its wrong, but i have nothing agaisnt religious people at all''. is he a biggot? How the hell can the monkey avatar guy be a biggot or even a homophobe if he said he has nothing agaisnt them?

He didn't have to say anything directly against them. The fact that he doesn't approve of their marraige implies that he sees them to be less deserving of it. This would be bigotry.

I brought up atheists as an example that applies directly to you.

I'll ask you a second time: why don't you think gays deserve anything less than everyone else?



I survived the Apocalyps3

Around the Network
pizzahut451 said:
Scoobes said:
pizzahut451 said:
kowhoho said:
pizzahut451 said:

I dont think i have EVER in my life seen so much double standared hypocrites and ignornce in one plce as i have in this thread today. Dear God...

I haven't been keeping up with this thread (as it's entirely derailed at this point). If you wouldn't mind terribly could you give some examples of this hypocracy so I could have even a small chance of re-entering this conversation?

The last page or so is riddled with convoluted quote boxes and italiced/non-italicized text and everyone is using different formatting techniques. It's all very confusing! >.<

Well, i see people saying ''you have no right to judge anyone because they are attracted to same gender'' but than they call other people who disagree with them biggots and homophobes. Than they say ''youur beliefs dont matter'' but than they pretend like their beliefs are the right ones simply because they think so and try to force them on you.

Who's forcing anyone's views on anyone else? If you disagree that homosexuality isn't a natural occurence then you're comming from a position of ignorance. If you think that gay people shouldn't have the same rights as heterosexuals then that is the definition of homophobic. Nothing judgmental about it, just a simple definition of the word. And noone is impossing anything on your rights as an indvidual by saying it.

Then they go out and say that christianity sees homosexuality as a sin. thiat is an example of pure ignorance. then the people go on saying that if you dont support gay marrige your a big homophobe and biggot. i dont support it and im not either of those things. and if you try to convice me diffrent, you just proved my 1st point.

Considerring their are quotes in the bible that suggest it's a sin you can see where they may get this view. Out of interest, why don't you support gay marriage/civil partnerships? Why exactly are heterosexuals more deserving of these rights than heterosexuals?




I DO THINIK homosexuality is natural. And so did the guy with the monkey avatar.But calling someone homophobic for not sharing your views is FORCING your views on somebody. And just because i think gay marrige is wrong doesnt mean i hate and fear gay people which homophobia really is about. And i dont see marrige as a ''right'.I see it as a trdition between man and a woman. Love and being able to be in open public relationship with someone you love regardles the gender is a right. And btw, i am not impossing anybody's rights by saying my opinnion on gay marrige NEITHER. Thats what the people i talked about need to understand.

And where exactly does God or Jesus say that homosexaulity is a sin? God and Jesus, the son of God, are the only ones who can determinate whats a sin in christian religion, so where do they say it? Whoever else said it in the bible, its not a sin, unless said otherwise by God himself or Jesus Christ.

It's not the only thing that can determine homophobia as their are different degrees. It's not just black and white. Just because you don't see marriage as a "right" doesn't meant others don't. For those that believe marriage is a right, what you are saying can be construed as homphobic for the simple fact you're depriving them of what they perceive as a right.

Fo instance, it was a "tradition" for white and black people to not inter-marry. If someone was to say they didn't believe that white people and black people should be allowed to marry, that would be perceived as racist.



kowhoho said:
Smidlee said:
kowhoho said:
Smidlee said:
kowhoho said:
pizzahut451 said:

I dont think i have EVER in my life seen so much double standared hypocrites and ignornce in one plce as i have in this thread today. Dear God...

I haven't been keeping up with this thread (as it's entirely derailed at this point). If you wouldn't mind terribly could you give some examples of this hypocracy so I could have even a small chance of re-entering this conversation?

The last page or so is riddled with convoluted quote boxes and italiced/non-italicized text and everyone is using different formatting techniques. It's all very confusing! >.<

Maybe he is referring to the fact if there is no God then there is no such thing as gay rights or any other rights. The universe nor nature itself  does not reveals right vs wrong including killing,rape,etc . Killing is very natural. Again atheist is a "nothing" which of itself stand for or against nothing. Without God the only rights  that exist is the one government gives you which are in the position of God.

Our emotions are the product of thousands of years of evolution. Morality is a product of natural selection. We work best as a species when we work collaboratively, which is the reason why we nurture our young and love each other. It's not that it makes those emotions any less "real," though. The big bad government isn't the only thing we can look to in leiu of religion; our morality can be based solely off of social interaction and past experience.

you do realize this is a religous belief itself and can't be proven with hard facts. How do you know ours moral comes from evolution?

Let me set something straight here. Evolution is not a religious belief (i.e. it has a logical foundation). Everything from the fossil record to a recent experiment involving some 40,000 generations of E-coli (which over just 20 years of experimentation evolved the ability to utilize citrate which is impossible in the wild strain of the bacteria) provide very solid evidence for the phenomenon of evolution. While we cannot be completely, 100% certain of anything(...ever!), probability tips the scale almost completely in favor of the evolutionary theory.

My hypothesis regarding the origins of morality is also not without basis. Quite simply, at the point in time when our primate ancestors branched off into two separate evolutionary paths, homo sapiens differentiated from others in their collaborative effort, skill for communication and improvisation of tools. We still carry these traits today. Other current day primates also work collaboratively to hunt prey and so on.

It's ridiculous to say that evolution is a religious belief. This would imply that you are solely using faith to provide evidence for what you think (believing something with no evidence to speak of), whereas we can be relatively certain (by your logic nobody can't "know" anything at all) that the phenomena described in evolutionary theory are sound.

not true, I'm 100% certain that I just ate some spaghetti and breadsticks.  



gergroy said:

not true, I'm 100% certain that I just ate some spaghetti and breadsticks.  

How do you know you didn't just fall asleep and dream that you ate Spaghetti and breadsticks and you actually ate a spider in your sleep?



gergroy said:
kowhoho said:
Smidlee said:
kowhoho said:
Smidlee said:
kowhoho said:
pizzahut451 said:

I dont think i have EVER in my life seen so much double standared hypocrites and ignornce in one plce as i have in this thread today. Dear God...

I haven't been keeping up with this thread (as it's entirely derailed at this point). If you wouldn't mind terribly could you give some examples of this hypocracy so I could have even a small chance of re-entering this conversation?

The last page or so is riddled with convoluted quote boxes and italiced/non-italicized text and everyone is using different formatting techniques. It's all very confusing! >.<

Maybe he is referring to the fact if there is no God then there is no such thing as gay rights or any other rights. The universe nor nature itself  does not reveals right vs wrong including killing,rape,etc . Killing is very natural. Again atheist is a "nothing" which of itself stand for or against nothing. Without God the only rights  that exist is the one government gives you which are in the position of God.

Our emotions are the product of thousands of years of evolution. Morality is a product of natural selection. We work best as a species when we work collaboratively, which is the reason why we nurture our young and love each other. It's not that it makes those emotions any less "real," though. The big bad government isn't the only thing we can look to in leiu of religion; our morality can be based solely off of social interaction and past experience.

you do realize this is a religous belief itself and can't be proven with hard facts. How do you know ours moral comes from evolution?

Let me set something straight here. Evolution is not a religious belief (i.e. it has a logical foundation). Everything from the fossil record to a recent experiment involving some 40,000 generations of E-coli (which over just 20 years of experimentation evolved the ability to utilize citrate which is impossible in the wild strain of the bacteria) provide very solid evidence for the phenomenon of evolution. While we cannot be completely, 100% certain of anything(...ever!), probability tips the scale almost completely in favor of the evolutionary theory.

My hypothesis regarding the origins of morality is also not without basis. Quite simply, at the point in time when our primate ancestors branched off into two separate evolutionary paths, homo sapiens differentiated from others in their collaborative effort, skill for communication and improvisation of tools. We still carry these traits today. Other current day primates also work collaboratively to hunt prey and so on.

It's ridiculous to say that evolution is a religious belief. This would imply that you are solely using faith to provide evidence for what you think (believing something with no evidence to speak of), whereas we can be relatively certain (by your logic nobody can't "know" anything at all) that the phenomena described in evolutionary theory are sound.

not true, I'm 100% certain that I just ate some spaghetti and breadsticks.  


I'm sure there is some kind of evolutionary explanation why you ate spaghetti and breadsticks.



Scoobes said:
gergroy said:

not true, I'm 100% certain that I just ate some spaghetti and breadsticks.  

How do you know you didn't just fall asleep and dream that you ate Spaghetti and breadsticks and you actually ate a spider in your sleep?

lol, this is exactly what I was talking about!



I survived the Apocalyps3