By using this site, you agree to our Privacy Policy and our Terms of Use. Close

Forums - General - Dinosaurs co-existed with man.

highwaystar101 said:

 

How about something a little more ambiguous from person to person and society to society? How about abortion?

Many people think abortion is an abhorrent act, totally immoral; where as many others  think that abortion is morally acceptable and that the rights of the mother supersede the rights of the foetus. How can moral absolution be right when some people believe terminating a pregnancy should be punishable, and others believe it to be an acceptable right?

The morals aren't absolute by any means. The morals are relative, from society to society, even from person to person. You can't just say "abortion is wrong, and there is a clear defined line and everyone sits on the one side", when it is blindingly obvious that this isn't the case. There really is no defined right or wrong answer that is agreed on by everyone.

Very bad example, see above my reply to Rath.

 

highwaystar101 said:
Slimebeast said:

You don't seem to get it. How hard can it be? It doesn't matter if the cannibals thought murder and cannibalism was a perfectly fine thing to do because they did wrong!


I almost started off my last post by saying you don't get it. Because you genuinely can't see it when it's right there in front of you.

Look, seriously. Wrong by whose standards? Your standards? My standards? Their standards?


No, wrong by the standards of absolute morals.



Around the Network
Slimebeast said:
Rath said:
Slimebeast said:
highwaystar101 said:
Slimebeast said:
 

Because the cannibals are wrong of course. Duh.

But in their eyes murder and cannibalism was a perfectly fine thing to do. To them cannibals weren't wrong, they probably saw us as wrong for not being cannibals.

You don't seem to get it. How hard can it be? It doesn't matter if the cannibals thought murder and cannibalism was a perfectly fine thing to do because they did wrong!

But to them it simply wasn't wrong.

They did not share in your morals.

 

Another example; some people consider abortion morally wrong - murder in fact. Others consider denying a woman the right to control her body by refusing her the right to an abortion morally wrong. There is no absolute answer to this that is written in stone. Morals are not absolute.

To them it didn't seem wrong but it was wrong.

Abortion is a terrible example becase the premises for making the moral judgement are so different.
(the belief that a fetus is a child with a soul versus the belief that it's a lump of cells without awareness or identity).

You can't just keep arbitrarily saying that that it was wrong. To them it wasn't wrong, and because you think it is wouldn't mean squat to them.

You have very little justification for drawing a line and saying "nobody thinks that this is right past this point", when there is a group of people standing over the line looking back at you.

Tell me, what in your eyes would falsify moral absolution? Because all hypotheses have to have some way of falsifying them to see if they're correct. I think I gave sufficient evidence with my case, but now I want to know where you exactly set the bar.



1.  If you're a christian, why is it so hard to believe that God started the Big Bang?  The end of the earth is explained in detail in Revelations and Daniel.  The genealogy of man is chronicled in the Old Testament up until Jesus and Jesus' life was chronicled in 5 books, but the beginning of the Earth is described in only a couple of chapters.  It's seems inconsistent with the rest of the bible and I think that God put it in the bible as a place holder because it would take multiple books to explain the universe, how it started, and how everything works.  There's a good chance that even today we really couldn't understand the universe so God just summoned up the events to keep it simple.

2.  We know that man lived with the woolly mammoth because we found that the people used the bones as houses, spears, etc...  Where are all the T-rex teeth used a spears?  Where are all the skins and such used as clothing?  There is no evidence to support the claim.



Slimebeast said:
highwaystar101 said:
Slimebeast said:

You don't seem to get it. How hard can it be? It doesn't matter if the cannibals thought murder and cannibalism was a perfectly fine thing to do because they did wrong!


I almost started off my last post by saying you don't get it. Because you genuinely can't see it when it's right there in front of you.

Look, seriously. Wrong by whose standards? Your standards? My standards? Their standards?


No, wrong by the standards of absolute morals.


Ah yes, the absolute morals that some societies follow and other societies don't. Those absolute morals.

It wasn't wrong by their standards, it was wrong by our standards. You can't have absolute standards when two or more sets of standards exist, ergo the standards are relative.



Slimebeast said:
highwaystar101 said:

 

How about something a little more ambiguous from person to person and society to society? How about abortion?

Many people think abortion is an abhorrent act, totally immoral; where as many others  think that abortion is morally acceptable and that the rights of the mother supersede the rights of the foetus. How can moral absolution be right when some people believe terminating a pregnancy should be punishable, and others believe it to be an acceptable right?

The morals aren't absolute by any means. The morals are relative, from society to society, even from person to person. You can't just say "abortion is wrong, and there is a clear defined line and everyone sits on the one side", when it is blindingly obvious that this isn't the case. There really is no defined right or wrong answer that is agreed on by everyone.

Very bad example, see above my reply to Rath.

 

No it was a good example.

I know the facts are same for everyone. The interpretation of the facts is different and that leads to an array of moral standards on the subject (which you acknowledged). There is no supernatural influence that sways people's morals in one direction if this is the case.

People are making their own minds up on moral standards in this case, that can't be absolute.



Around the Network

@ Slimebeast:

How about this example? Is it morally permissible to force people into slave labour?

It was accepted by most people a few centuries ago. Now it is seen as one of the most unacceptable things in the world, with most people lobbying against it.

Is this an example of absolute moral laws when the moral standards can change to such a degree?

...

Also, stealing is always wrong with absolute morals. So is stealing a nuclear bomb from terrorists (that they built and owned themselves) to stop them detonating it also morally wrong? Because it has to be wrong, even though it is done for the right reasons if absolute morals were in place.

...

It's past midnight and I need my sleep *yawn*



Laughable :)



I'm tired of all these threads were people basically mock the believe of God. Now I'm going to have to create a thread that will prove that God exist and that he created the universe and the earth that's in it as well as prove that the bible is true (And I'll use alot of historical facts to back up my argument as well). Don't expect it soon though (in about 2 weeks or so). Look forward to it everyone :)



ManusJustus said:

Laughable :)


Jesus is a Dinosaur!



g-value said:

I'm tired of all these threads were people basically mock the believe of God. Now I'm going to have to create a thread that will prove that God exist and that he created the universe and the earth that's in it as well as prove that the bible is true (And I'll use alot of historical facts to back up my argument as well). Don't expect it soon though (in about 2 weeks or so). Look forward to it everyone :)


I am looking forward to it.

I will admit that I doubt you will be able to prove the historical accuracy of the bible and the existence of God however.