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Forums - General Discussion - Is athiesm a belief? What is "God?"

raptors11 said:
whatever said:

If there is this all powerful being, where did he come from?


Lamest question in history. I can ask the same thing just reverse it, where did everything needed for the big bang come from?


i wonder that too sometimes,whats before the big bang and where is the universe exactly

For those who believe, no proof is necessary, for those who don't believe, no proof is possible i think thats how the saying goes

its a tough one wfz,but i guess thats what faith is,faith vs science can go on forever we'll only know when we die,or not



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wfz said:
Torillian said:

That would depend on how you qualify living, if you mean that the God created the world and then died then I would say there's no point in praying to something that can't hear you.

Same as above.

I would say that there's no point in worshipping an inanimate thing that governs you because that will have no affect on how the inanimate thing governs you.  You can thank a tree for giving you oxygen to breath but the tree doesn't really care so I as an atheist don't care to participate.  I won't scorn you for doing so if it helps you be happy, though.  Even if the tree doesn't care about you thanking it if it makes you feel better that's reason enough.

edit: the issue I think you're going to have through this discussion is that being an atheist doesn't require any specific set of beliefs so I can't talk about what all atheists believe only what I personally believe and why I personally do not pray to any god.


Ack you caught my post before i edited it. I took out worshiped because it was a blatantly wrong word to use. I don't think we should worship any God. The idea is silly to me. So yes I agree with you there. I also don't think we should pray to any God or expect any help or intervention. I didn't want you to think I meant that!

I don't think we need to thank, worship, or praise any God whether it's animate or inanimate.

When I talk of atheists "believing" I mean just the fact that they believe there is no God. It would be impossible to prove that God doesn't exist in any form, so it's a belief. Right? I don't mean it's a belief in the same sense of religious belief at all.


well yes, it is a leap of faith because you can't prove it with 100% certainty, but then science is all about lending evidence to theories and even the law of gravity is only called such because we have not seen an instence in which it was false but nothing can be known with 100% certainty because we can't test every possible situation.  Therefore I would qualify the "Law of Atheism" under the same idea that it's something that is believed as 100% true because there is no evidence to the contrary



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HappySqurriel said:

It is impossible to prove the non-existence of something, and therefore there is a leap-of-faith associated with atheism that is required to arrive at the belief that god does not exist. Agnosticism on the other hand is a perfectly rational position.

Basically, atheism is just as much of a religion as Evangelical Christianity with the primary difference being that the Christians are dramatically more organized.


Then why are people Atheists? Why aren't they Agnostics?

If the Laws of Physics are the end-all be-all has governed the existence of matter and everything for eternity, would it be wrong to classify such a system as a God? Even though it's inanimate? Or maybe something created the Laws of Physics that govern us, and that would be considered God.

 

Maybe that thing, God, hasn't even been in our dimension/world for over a gazillion years, but it's what started it all. How could we ever comprehend such a thing? But because we can't comprehend it, we deny it's existence entirely?

 

I don't understand true atheism. You have to clearly state rules about what a God is allowed to be, but why can't God be an inanimate thing such as the Laws of Physics that created and forever govern this world? Or something else we can't even comprehend.

 

if God has to be sentient, alive,  and such, then what name can we give to a creator and governer that's not any of those?



I think you are looking at it the wrong way.  God is a word that has been defined over the ages to mean something.  Remember language is nothing more than a symbol for what we see visually an interpret mentally.  God is actually just another word for deity.  And deity is a supernatural, immortal being.  There is no dispute of what we define as good.  So your question being is god inanimate... NO.  That is impossible to the definition as it is a being.  

The wiggle room for deities comes with the ability to understand what they are.  Because they aren't of our natural world that we understand (or yet to understand), it is possible they could be many things that fit the definition that we aren't able to comprehend.  Such as not being visible.  Or even have physical attributes that we usually associate with life.  So a deity by definition can't be the law of physics, although one could argue that these laws exist due to a deity depending on your interpretation.

 

My view of this matter is a rather weird one so I'll spare you on that, but I do think this is a rather interesting discussion.  But I think it only leads to one logical answer and I doubt that answer is one many would like.  And that logical answer is that the ability to understand and define that which we don't understand is a contradiction.  Instead take the Socratic method and realized you know nothing on the matter.  That is where I am on this matter although i do still uphold the belief of Atheism... but do recognize the possibility of something far greater than myself.  



Zucas said:

I think you are looking at it the wrong way.  God is a word that has been defined over the ages to mean something.  Remember language is nothing more than a symbol for what we see visually an interpret mentally.  God is actually just another word for deity.  And deity is a supernatural, immortal being.  There is no dispute of what we define as good.  So your question being is god inanimate... NO.  That is impossible to the definition as it is a being.  

The wiggle room for deities comes with the ability to understand what they are.  Because they aren't of our natural world that we understand (or yet to understand), it is possible they could be many things that fit the definition that we aren't able to comprehend.  Such as not being visible.  Or even have physical attributes that we usually associate with life.  So a deity by definition can't be the law of physics, although one could argue that these laws exist due to a deity depending on your interpretation.

 

My view of this matter is a rather weird one so I'll spare you on that, but I do think this is a rather interesting discussion.  But I think it only leads to one logical answer and I doubt that answer is one many would like.  And that logical answer is that the ability to understand and define that which we don't understand is a contradiction.  Instead take the Socratic method and realized you know nothing on the matter.  That is where I am on this matter although i do still uphold the belief of Atheism... but do recognize the possibility of something far greater than myself.  

Thank you for your reply! It's helped to clear up what God means. I've never had a stable defintion told to me, so thank you for explaining it.


Actually your belief sounds exactly like Agnosticism to me. You realize it would be impossible for us to truly comprehend such a being, so you're skeptical, but you reserve room for the fact that something much greater might exist. How do you see your view as Atheistic rather than Agnostic?

 

Thanks for your reply. ^_^



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I dont think humans can comprehend God. Are minds are just not up to the challenge. Anyways I follow the religion Islam and it makes sense.



People tend to believe more in God when they are dying.



Galaki said:

People tend to believe more in God when they are dying.


It seems that the more fear someone has in the unknown, the more likely they will want to believe in God.

 

Just a thought I had. I know it's common sense but I wanted to say it anyways.



I'd suggest you to read this.

All logical conclusions, using only human reason. It's helped me a lot on the matter, plus I'm taking philosophy and theology classes, so when I have a bit of spare time I'd like to enter the discussion.



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Here's a friendlier version of it lol.



Proud poster of the 10000th reply at the Official Smash Bros Update Thread.

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Bets with Conegamer:

Pandora's Tower will have an opening week of less than 37k in Japan. (Won!)
Pandora's Tower will sell less than 100k lifetime in Japan.
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