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Forums - General - Church plans to burn the Quran on Sept. 11

Coca-Cola said:
DukeOfLuxembourg said:

damn it, then we have to wait a bit longer for this:

Wow! 

Dont worry,  they will lose to the Muslim armies again...



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People are actually agreeing with DukeOfLuxembourg?

That makes me sad.



Final-Fan said:
Kasz216 said:
Final-Fan said:
TruckOSaurus said:
How do you figure that millions of people will suffer unneeded anguish from seeing a Mosque close to Ground Zero?

I think he is imagining massive pilgrimage to the site by PTSD sufferers who have phobic reactions to symbols of Islam. 

He can't be talking about residents in the area, as they already must be suffering from the mosque already there!  So it's the same angush either way

On a related note, Kasz, I just thought of the fact that it's not like this building is probably going to have a giant red sign painted on it saying "OMG MUSLIM BUILDING".  What makes you so sure this will be instantly identifiable to them, thus triggering the anguish, once the dust settles and the media move on? 

Well, yes.  That's actually one coping mechanism.  Besides the fact that 14% of 8 million people is already over a million.

As for knowing what it is, well that's easy, Islamic architecture is a lot different from US arhitecture. 

It looks like it might get settled anyway though, the whole thing is looking to be a huge cash making scheme.  The guy who bought the land for 5 million is now offering to sell it and not build the community center, for the low low price of 20 million.

If that was his original intention, man is a genious.

So all 8 million people living in the five boroughs of NYC go within viewing distance of the place on a regular basis??  But agreed it would be many many people.

And I would ask if the building is actually going to have "Islamic architecture", and not just be a Western-style building (remember, community center) with Islamic contents and a sign or two out front.  Just like a lot of churches no longer exhibit the fairly distinct "church architecture", I think it's fairly likely that a building that is only PARTLY mosque would not have a special style of architecture.  But then again, it might.  So:  how sure are you of this? 

And if it was just a scheme, one of those guys is a super genius because he's the #2 shareholder in Fox, which has gotten plenty of play out of this. 

I wouldn't say all 8 million, but a decent amount JUST from NY likely do.  The number of people in the US is a huge number.

As for the Islamic Arhitecture, as far as I know, you can't have a mosque without a dome.  That's what the history channel thing I last saw on mosque arhitecture said anyway. 

If the guy is a shareholder in Fox... it makes it more likely this is all a play whether it goes up or not.   I mean this sort of thing is Rupert Murdoch's standard MO. 

Fox VS Fox News paradigm shows that.   His most recent fundraisers were for Hilary Clinton, he's met with Obama and every president since like... Truman.   In the UK he supported the conservatives, until he supported the Labor party, and in Australia (where he's from)  he was a staunch supporter of the nationals.   Until he started supporting Labor.

Ruper Murdoch likes to play both sides vs the middle like nothing.



@Coca-Cola

It's pretty good for Christian history if you have to go back to the Crusades to condemn us.  Not bad at all.  There has been some in-house fighting though but still that's long long time ago.

Actually the more recent would be the forced conversion of native Americans (from both North adn South America). If it weren't for secularism we'd have a Christian Taliban on our hands for sure. The West started beeing a good place to live when religion started losing it's power.

It's true that the biggest problem with Islam is place like Afghnistan where most terrorists are not educated and ride short camels.  (I heard this on the radio today)

You're denying the fact that poverty and lack of access to education and information makes people easily manipulable, thus easy target for terrorists to recruit? Also are you denying the fact that ultra-nationalism and religious fundamentalism are perfect mindsets to create terrorists? Why isn't Turkey even 20% as bad as Afghanistan in regards to terrorism?



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                                                                               (The Voice of a Generation and Seece)

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                                                                               (pizzahut451)

Kasz216 said:
sapphi_snake said:
Kasz216 said:

14% of NY and 5% of the country doesn't count as  a "lot of people" to you?


Veterans don't HAVE to protest that kind of stuff because nobody is inconsiderate enough to put that kind of stuff next to VA hospitals and clubs.

Regardless, your arguements have been full of two much ignorance to further debate with you.   You mentioned homophobia... but in general your arguements about PTSD have had about the same intellectual knowledge as people who argue homosexuality is a choice.

 

Not enough to matter.

But whatever... I know very well what PTSD is, I just don't find it a relevant or compelling argument for your stance.


If you really do know what PTSD is (i'm guessing not) and really think moving a building 3 blocks is a big deal when it would save hundreds of thousands if not millions of people uneeded anguish.

I couldn't think any less of you without a dircet action that specifically harmed someone.

I do actuyally know what PTSD is. I find your arguments to be pretty weak.

First of all those numbers you gave are insignificant (not large enough to matter in the long run, at least in my opinion).

Second of all the numbers you posted are outdated. Those numbers represent the situation imediatelly after the attack. Most people got over their PTSD in the first 6 months after the attack (you can be sure that after almost 9 years most have probably gotten over their PTSD).

http://ptsd.about.com/od/causesanddevelopment/a/Sept11_PTSD.htm

Third of all, you have no proof that the mosque would be a trigger. The attacks involved planes crashing into buildings, so it would be more logical for a plane to be a trigger for those people, rather than a mosque.

Forth, as someone else pointed out, why would a mosque on ground 0 be a trigger for one of those people, and not a mosque in any other location? Logically those people (if mosques and Islamic symbols really would be triggers for them) would be Islamophobes (in the propper sense of the word, as in "afraid of muslims"), so they'd experience anxiety whenever they'd  see a mosque/islmaic symbol anywhere. Should muslims hide, or leave the US altogether as to not upset these people?

Of course you neglect these facts because they show how faulty your argument is. And I'm bothered by the personal attacks. You're driven by your emotions and are not analysing this situation critically.



"I don't understand how someone could like Tolstoy and Dostoyevsky, but not like Twilight!!!"

"Last book I read was Brokeback Mountain, I just don't have the patience for them unless it's softcore porn."

                                                                               (The Voice of a Generation and Seece)

"If you cant stand the sound of your own voice than dont become a singer !!!!!"

                                                                               (pizzahut451)

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They plan to burn the quran?

This is an outrage! I am outraged!



WessleWoggle said:

They plan to burn the quran?

This is an outrage! I am outraged!

Why? I thought you were the Buddha? Aren't your followers fighting with Muslims in some Asian country?



"I don't understand how someone could like Tolstoy and Dostoyevsky, but not like Twilight!!!"

"Last book I read was Brokeback Mountain, I just don't have the patience for them unless it's softcore porn."

                                                                               (The Voice of a Generation and Seece)

"If you cant stand the sound of your own voice than dont become a singer !!!!!"

                                                                               (pizzahut451)

sapphi_snake said:
WessleWoggle said:

They plan to burn the quran?

This is an outrage! I am outraged!

Why? I thought you were the Buddha? Aren't your followers fighting with Muslims in some Asian country?

What? My followers are out spreading world peace and working on the kingdom of samayim in Antarctica, a giant heated bubble that will be heaven on earth, and will be free of the laws that hold modern society back. The followers of the past Buddhas may be fighting wars, I don't know, but my followers are doing much more important things. 



WessleWoggle said:
sapphi_snake said:
WessleWoggle said:

They plan to burn the quran?

This is an outrage! I am outraged!

Why? I thought you were the Buddha? Aren't your followers fighting with Muslims in some Asian country?

What? My followers are out spreading world peace and working on the kingdom of samayim in Antarctica, a giant heated bubble that will be heaven on earth, and will be free of the laws that hold modern society back. The followers of the past Buddhas may be fighting wars, I don't know, but my followers are doing much more important things. 

Lolz, what does one have to do to get into that kingdom once it's finished? And what are these laws "that hold modern society back"?



"I don't understand how someone could like Tolstoy and Dostoyevsky, but not like Twilight!!!"

"Last book I read was Brokeback Mountain, I just don't have the patience for them unless it's softcore porn."

                                                                               (The Voice of a Generation and Seece)

"If you cant stand the sound of your own voice than dont become a singer !!!!!"

                                                                               (pizzahut451)

sapphi_snake said:
WessleWoggle said:
sapphi_snake said:
WessleWoggle said:

They plan to burn the quran?

This is an outrage! I am outraged!

Why? I thought you were the Buddha? Aren't your followers fighting with Muslims in some Asian country?

What? My followers are out spreading world peace and working on the kingdom of samayim in Antarctica, a giant heated bubble that will be heaven on earth, and will be free of the laws that hold modern society back. The followers of the past Buddhas may be fighting wars, I don't know, but my followers are doing much more important things. 

Lolz, what does one have to do to get into that kingdom once it's finished? And what are these laws "that hold modern society back"?

You have to pledge your eternal loyalty and give all your money to the project. Don't worry, your money will be returned to you with a palace and all the comforts you could imagine.  You know what laws hold modern society back, drug laws, drugs like amphetamines boost productivity. Then there's cloning laws, which have stopped us from creating perfect human specimens and also have stopped us from created human-animal hybrids.