It's very informative post if you can read beetween lines.
He doesn't say "You are wrong guys we will bring games that hardcore gamers will enjoy" and instead goes into "you will buy it anyway to get some easy achievments"
PROUD MEMBER OF THE PSP RPG FAN CLUB
makingmusic476 said:
Nobody expected the Wii to be the succes that it is, even Nintendo themselves, and both Microsoft and Sony are trying desperately to emulate the Wii's success four years later, only in both cases it seems they still don't understand just how the Wii and DS became what they are today. Nintendo approaches hardware from an entirely different perspective than Sony and Microsoft. Nintendo's software designers work directly with their hardware designers to create the technology necessary to facilitate whatever new gameplay experiences they have in mind. "Revolutions" like the Wiimote were created expressly to enable the creation of titles like Wii Sports. The balance board was designed specifically to allow players to use Wii Fit. The hardware is designed for the software, and it is the software that ultimately sells the hardware. The Wii first became a success thanks to Wii Sports, and titles like Mario Kart continued that success. The balance board ONLY sells because of the popularity of Wii Fit itself, and few other games support the peripheral as a result. It's the games that sell. You just so happen to need the hardware to play the games. It also just so happens that Nintendo makes fucking amazing games, as evidenced by their sales. On the other hand, Microsoft and Sony designed Kinect/Move first and foremost with the capabilities of the hardware in mind, and that is why thus far we've seen mostly tech demos showing off what the hardware can theoretically do (and in the case of Kinect, many of the tech demos from E309 turned out to be quite unfeasible). We've yet to see a standout showcase title for the capabilities of either device. A killer app, so to speak. In the case of Move, we've at least seen that the device can competently be used to play games in a similar manner to the Wii, but that's about it. There was no single vision behind these devices other than "let's go after the Wii's market." Nobody said "this would make a killer game, now what new tech do we need to make to do it." Instead they were thinking "we've made this new tech, now let's see if somebody can make a killer game with it." Or in the case of Move, "let's make a device that can do everything the Wii can do but more!" A much safer route, to be sure, but with far less market potential as a result. The closest thing Microsoft has to a killer app for Kinect at the moment is Dance Central, a game that could easily be substituted with the Wii's Just Dance 1/2 for most of the casual crowd, and a game that could come to the ps3 as well according to the developers. That's not gonna be enough. Both companies are trying to sell their new peripherals primarily on the potential of the hardware. As the ps3 showed back in 2006, that just doesn't work. Especially in the case of new control schemes, it's all about the software. Without a system seller like Wii Sports at launch, these devices will struggle to meet any definition of "success". |
No offense, but I never stated only Microsoft hardcore fans were wrong about anything, nor did I make any comments on Move or Kinects possibilities of success. While your response seems logical to me, and on many points I agree, I'm not sure how that is relevant to the original post.
MS employee says hardcore have been wrong before, and in this thread PS3 fans are responding like he kicked thier grandmother or something. YOU heard the podcast, he wasn't being derogatory... he was stating the opinion that the hardcore have been wrong before, and I gave an example of when they have been.
Completely ignoring the logical fallacy that correlation = causation, and also ignoring the issue of just what Toulouse considers to be a hardcore gamer (achievement whores? I dunno), I don't believe gamers in general have been all that wrong in the past, even on some of the points he mentions.
Like the Wii. It is correct that most people scoffed at the Wii when it was unveiled at E305, some even claiming Nintendo would end up third party after it failed miserably, but when Nintendo finally showed some games for the system at E306 (mainly Wii Sports and a reworked version of Twilight Princess), most gamers were quite impressed, while they were simultaneously laughing at Sony's $599 price tag for the ps3. Many people, including me, lined up for a Wii at launch when earlier they had little inclination to do so. I wouldn't consider gamers to be wrong in this case, given they did come around by launch (in stark contrast to Kinect).
The issue was that many gamers later turned on the Wii, at a time when it seemed Nintendo was focused primarily on Wii Fit and third parties were nowhere to be found. They literally wanted the system to fail. Thankfully this last E3 has brought people around again, thanks to all the crazy awesome games Nintendo showed. But like I said, once Nintendo actually showed what the Wii was all about, most people were on board.
There are also numerous instances where gamers were generally right on the money. Like when most gamers turned their back on Sony after they announced the ps3's price tag and crappy launch line up, or the general consensus that the PSP Go would be dead on arrival. Gamers weren't impressed, and both products flopped right out the gate (though the ps3 has managed quite a turnaround over the past few years).
| kowenicki said: Why dont you just comment on the actual interview topic and his main point rather than just "lol" at a couple of small throw-away comments? |
I find that if you post your opinion alongside an article, people often tend to discuss your thoughts on the article rather than the article itself. I generally try to add my own thoughts in later in the thread to avoid this.
| TRios_Zen said: No offense, but I never stated only Microsoft hardcore fans were wrong about anything, nor did I make any comments on Move or Kinects possibilities of success. While your response seems logical to me, and on many points I agree, I'm not sure how that is relevant to the original post. MS employee says hardcore have been wrong before, and in this thread PS3 fans are responding like he kicked thier grandmother or something. YOU heard the podcast, he wasn't being derogatory... he was stating the opinion that the hardcore have been wrong before, and I gave an example of when they have been. |
Hm. I think we've had a slight disconnect here. My comment was solely a reply to the underlined and bolded portion of your previous post. I'm not really sure what you think I was trying to say, but I never intended to imply you said something about one or another group of fans. Guess I should've been more clear in my post. Sorry.
The gist of my response to you was that yeah, gamers haven't exactly been on the ball when it comes to things like the Wii, but Microsoft hasn't been either. Then I just started rambling about how foolish Sony/MS are being with the whole motion control thing lol.
Yes !!! you hardocre gamer are going to buy loads of kinects for the sake of your almighty MS God !!! Then you'll have the upper hand on the forumz !!!
:waves hand to perform the Jedi's mind-control trick:
makingmusic476 said:
I lol'd at his tone when he talked about paying for multiplayer and buying clothes for avatars. And why would a console with an ethernet port not succeed? |
dreamcast
dd if = /dev/brain | tail -f | grep games | nc -lnvvp 80
Hey Listen!
makingmusic476 said:
|
From what I understand, the gist of what he is saying here is that despite "hardcore" complaining in the past, once the content is actually presented to them and they actually play it rather than bash it, they will come to like Kinect.
In other words, they don't know what is good for them. They think they no everything, but truly know nothing. In comparison to "casual" gamers, the hardcore are the true suckers. All you need to do is throw a map pack or some downloadable color options their way and they suck em like pacifiers. Give em some achievements and they'll keep their mouths closed.
Leatherhat on July 6th, 2012 3pm. Vita sales:"3 mil for COD 2 mil for AC. Maybe more. " thehusbo on July 6th, 2012 5pm. Vita sales:"5 mil for COD 2.2 mil for AC."
| RolStoppable said: Pachter has been wrong on the DS, Nintendo's handheld became the dominant market leader. Pachter has been wrong on the Wii, Nintendo's home console sits comfortably in first place. Pachter expects Kinect (and Move) to be successful and as a result a decline in Wii sales. You know what's going to happen. |
We do: third time's going to be the charm.
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