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Forums - Sony Discussion - PS2 is pretty much dead and I blame Sony.

For the umpteenth time: If Sony added BC to their PS3 line-up all along, people would flock to the PS3 while not buying PS2's (why would they?). Seeing how the PS3 had been selling at a (significant) loss all this time, they wanted to keep as many people as possible on the PS2 if they wanted PS2 games. That's a profit post for them.

Now the PS3 is profiting (apparently), they could essentially take out the PS2 and start selling those games on PSN or as Collections if they wanted.


Wanting them to have supported the PS2 from the start would've cost them more money than ever before.



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Wonktonodi said:
Mr Puggsly said:
Wonktonodi said:
you also should consider had they left it in fewer people would have bought ps2s. Fewer ps2s means fewer people who can only buy ps2 games. Most of the big sellers on the ps2 these days are games that are also on newer systems. If there were less ps2s out there more people would buy the newer version. The titles you mention that kept selling on the ps1 were just a few games that kept selling. Currently there is GTA San Andreas that still show's up in the top 50 now and again.
Most the ps2 games selling new these days aren't selling for very much. Sony doesn't make as much on them as they used to. So why would they push that as much?

Don't just look at retail, Sony could have made a ton of money from selling games on PSN.

Also, games that were only on the PS2 but released during the life of the PS3 would have likely sold better.

The PS3 has a core audience, many of them would definitely be playing PS2 games if they had the option.

God of War 2 released after the ps3.  While ps3s could still play ps2 games probably still won't be as big as God of War 3 for the ps3.

If all they wanted was the ps2 to do well they could have not launched the ps3 at all.  They want to have the next console do well.  They still can put ps2 games on psn if they so choose and if they release them that way the game itself should be able to play on the ps3 just fine.  Marvel Vs capcom 2 for instance.

Would it be better for sony to sell more ps2 games to ps3 owners or to sell more ps3 games to ps3 owners.  I think they are doing fine with the ps2 and that what you think of is dead is far from the case.

I fail to see your point about God of War 2. It was released early in the PS3s life. The few people that were willing to drop $600 probably didn't want to play PS2 games (But atleast it was an option). Its now reasonably priced, the userbase has increased greatly, but the PS2 BC is gone. So we don't know the true potential BC would have had on PS2 software sales.

You might be surprised to hear its much more expensive to port a game. Selling the original requires little or no additional work from developers. Which is why emulation has become extremely common when bringing old games to newer consoles. Marvel vs Capcom 2 on PSN/XBLA is actually a port of the original Arcade/Dreamcast game. Apparently hardcore fans complained that the PS2/Xbox felt different.

You seem to think PS3 owners aren't gonna buy PS3 games if PS2 games are an option. But I'm saying they'll buy PS3 games, and they'll dabble in PS2 games as well. Just like they do with PS1 games already.



Recently Completed
River City: Rival Showdown
for 3DS (3/5) - River City: Tokyo Rumble for 3DS (4/5) - Zelda: BotW for Wii U (5/5) - Zelda: BotW for Switch (5/5) - Zelda: Link's Awakening for Switch (4/5) - Rage 2 for X1X (4/5) - Rage for 360 (3/5) - Streets of Rage 4 for X1/PC (4/5) - Gears 5 for X1X (5/5) - Mortal Kombat 11 for X1X (5/5) - Doom 64 for N64 (emulator) (3/5) - Crackdown 3 for X1S/X1X (4/5) - Infinity Blade III - for iPad 4 (3/5) - Infinity Blade II - for iPad 4 (4/5) - Infinity Blade - for iPad 4 (4/5) - Wolfenstein: The Old Blood for X1 (3/5) - Assassin's Creed: Origins for X1 (3/5) - Uncharted: Lost Legacy for PS4 (4/5) - EA UFC 3 for X1 (4/5) - Doom for X1 (4/5) - Titanfall 2 for X1 (4/5) - Super Mario 3D World for Wii U (4/5) - South Park: The Stick of Truth for X1 BC (4/5) - Call of Duty: WWII for X1 (4/5) -Wolfenstein II for X1 - (4/5) - Dead or Alive: Dimensions for 3DS (4/5) - Marvel vs Capcom: Infinite for X1 (3/5) - Halo Wars 2 for X1/PC (4/5) - Halo Wars: DE for X1 (4/5) - Tekken 7 for X1 (4/5) - Injustice 2 for X1 (4/5) - Yakuza 5 for PS3 (3/5) - Battlefield 1 (Campaign) for X1 (3/5) - Assassin's Creed: Syndicate for X1 (4/5) - Call of Duty: Infinite Warfare for X1 (4/5) - Call of Duty: MW Remastered for X1 (4/5) - Donkey Kong Country Returns for 3DS (4/5) - Forza Horizon 3 for X1 (5/5)

Mr Puggsly said:

Had Sony not removed the BC on the PS3 I can't help but think PS2 software would be much more relevant today. Plugging in multiple boxes is a pain in the ass and that killed the PS2.

I don't get it because I thought removing the BC did help the PS2 in someway. It makes the PS2 more valuable. It's also far from dead. Just look at the charts and you will be surprise how the PS2 is still selling a lot of softwares or just  look at the recent namco bandai's recent sales forecast. PS2 beat the 360. I think that EA will still make games for it (sports game). Which is amazing for a ten years old console.

Of course their is also a massive case of people move on to the new tech. You know people can't play PS2 games forever they want the new ones. Uber graphics, uber type playing the game (Wii), uber games like uncharted, gears, Wii sports and etc.

A lot of developer's also move on to the newer console same goes for Sony.

There's also the piracy.  

So I think it's not the BC but paragraph 2-4 is the reason. Just my 2 cents

 



Mr Puggsly said:

Had Sony not removed the BC on the PS3 I can't help but think PS2 software would be much more relevant today. Plugging in multiple boxes is a pain in the ass and that killed the PS2.

I blame SONY for the death of my Walkman, i am sure discman could have external post for cassette as BC. I blame Ipod for the death of my DIscman, i am sure APPLE can have a BC for IPOD.  I blame BLU-RAY for the death of DVDs, i blame HD TV for the death of my 52cm CRT TV......i blame broadband for the death of my belove ISDN 256kbps internet access....:P



chanskie said:
Mr Puggsly said:

Had Sony not removed the BC on the PS3 I can't help but think PS2 software would be much more relevant today. Plugging in multiple boxes is a pain in the ass and that killed the PS2.

I blame SONY for the death of my Walkman, i am sure discman could have external post for cassette as BC. I blame Ipod for the death of my DIscman, i am sure APPLE can have a BC for IPOD.  I blame BLU-RAY for the death of DVDs, i blame HD TV for the death of my 52cm CRT TV......i blame broadband for the death of my belove ISDN 256kbps internet access....:P

Uhhh... no. I can listen to the same music on any portable audio device. I'm just using a different media.

I can watch the same movies on any video playback device. Only the media I use differs.

I can watch SD programming on an HDTV, and vice verse.

Broadband and ISDN take me to the same internet.

But in the case of PS2 and PS3 software, I need unique hardware for each. Hence, your analogy sucks.



Recently Completed
River City: Rival Showdown
for 3DS (3/5) - River City: Tokyo Rumble for 3DS (4/5) - Zelda: BotW for Wii U (5/5) - Zelda: BotW for Switch (5/5) - Zelda: Link's Awakening for Switch (4/5) - Rage 2 for X1X (4/5) - Rage for 360 (3/5) - Streets of Rage 4 for X1/PC (4/5) - Gears 5 for X1X (5/5) - Mortal Kombat 11 for X1X (5/5) - Doom 64 for N64 (emulator) (3/5) - Crackdown 3 for X1S/X1X (4/5) - Infinity Blade III - for iPad 4 (3/5) - Infinity Blade II - for iPad 4 (4/5) - Infinity Blade - for iPad 4 (4/5) - Wolfenstein: The Old Blood for X1 (3/5) - Assassin's Creed: Origins for X1 (3/5) - Uncharted: Lost Legacy for PS4 (4/5) - EA UFC 3 for X1 (4/5) - Doom for X1 (4/5) - Titanfall 2 for X1 (4/5) - Super Mario 3D World for Wii U (4/5) - South Park: The Stick of Truth for X1 BC (4/5) - Call of Duty: WWII for X1 (4/5) -Wolfenstein II for X1 - (4/5) - Dead or Alive: Dimensions for 3DS (4/5) - Marvel vs Capcom: Infinite for X1 (3/5) - Halo Wars 2 for X1/PC (4/5) - Halo Wars: DE for X1 (4/5) - Tekken 7 for X1 (4/5) - Injustice 2 for X1 (4/5) - Yakuza 5 for PS3 (3/5) - Battlefield 1 (Campaign) for X1 (3/5) - Assassin's Creed: Syndicate for X1 (4/5) - Call of Duty: Infinite Warfare for X1 (4/5) - Call of Duty: MW Remastered for X1 (4/5) - Donkey Kong Country Returns for 3DS (4/5) - Forza Horizon 3 for X1 (5/5)

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Mr Puggsly said:
Wonktonodi said:
Mr Puggsly said:
Wonktonodi said:
you also should consider had they left it in fewer people would have bought ps2s. Fewer ps2s means fewer people who can only buy ps2 games. Most of the big sellers on the ps2 these days are games that are also on newer systems. If there were less ps2s out there more people would buy the newer version. The titles you mention that kept selling on the ps1 were just a few games that kept selling. Currently there is GTA San Andreas that still show's up in the top 50 now and again.
Most the ps2 games selling new these days aren't selling for very much. Sony doesn't make as much on them as they used to. So why would they push that as much?

Don't just look at retail, Sony could have made a ton of money from selling games on PSN.

Also, games that were only on the PS2 but released during the life of the PS3 would have likely sold better.

The PS3 has a core audience, many of them would definitely be playing PS2 games if they had the option.

God of War 2 released after the ps3.  While ps3s could still play ps2 games probably still won't be as big as God of War 3 for the ps3.

If all they wanted was the ps2 to do well they could have not launched the ps3 at all.  They want to have the next console do well.  They still can put ps2 games on psn if they so choose and if they release them that way the game itself should be able to play on the ps3 just fine.  Marvel Vs capcom 2 for instance.

Would it be better for sony to sell more ps2 games to ps3 owners or to sell more ps3 games to ps3 owners.  I think they are doing fine with the ps2 and that what you think of is dead is far from the case.

I fail to see your point about God of War 2. It was released early in the PS3s life. The few people that were willing to drop $600 probably didn't want to play PS2 games (But atleast it was an option). Its now reasonably priced, the userbase has increased greatly, but the PS2 BC is gone. So we don't know the true potential BC would have had on PS2 software sales.

You might be surprised to hear its much more expensive to port a game. Selling the original requires little or no additional work from developers. Which is why emulation has become extremely common when bringing old games to newer consoles. Marvel vs Capcom 2 on PSN/XBLA is actually a port of the original Arcade/Dreamcast game. Apparently hardcore fans complained that the PS2/Xbox felt different.

You seem to think PS3 owners aren't gonna buy PS3 games if PS2 games are an option. But I'm saying they'll buy PS3 games, and they'll dabble in PS2 games as well. Just like they do with PS1 games already.

The point is that it had the user base of both the ps2 and the ps3 till there was no longer ps3 bc yet it's not like it was a 5 million seller.   Also when there are over 130 million consoles that can play ps2 games would another 20 million make that much of a difference.  Which is the main point.  Or how about until last year there were more ps2s sold since the launch of the ps3 than ps3s?  Maybe there could be more ps2 software sold, but maybe there would be less ps3 software sold as well.  Most people don't have the time or money to play all the games they want.  Although it won't be a 1 to 1 ratio.  If there were to have been substantially more ps2 games sold to ps3 owners there would have been fewer ps3 games sold. I know this is true for me and I know I'm not the only one.  Why would I buy rock band or the simpsons game for the ps2 when I can get it for the ps3?  The only games I'd buy for the ps2 are games that aren't on the ps3 and that's pretty much used games. 

Ps2 is far from dead since there are over 1.5 billion games out there.  It's rather amazing any new ones sell at all.  Over time sales of games for older systems even if they can be played on newer systems move to used sales.  How many new gba games moved on the ds before they took that feture out with the dsi?  How many new xbox games move on the x360 how many new gamecube games move onto the wii? 



Mr Puggsly said:
chanskie said:
Mr Puggsly said:

Had Sony not removed the BC on the PS3 I can't help but think PS2 software would be much more relevant today. Plugging in multiple boxes is a pain in the ass and that killed the PS2.

I blame SONY for the death of my Walkman, i am sure discman could have external post for cassette as BC. I blame Ipod for the death of my DIscman, i am sure APPLE can have a BC for IPOD.  I blame BLU-RAY for the death of DVDs, i blame HD TV for the death of my 52cm CRT TV......i blame broadband for the death of my belove ISDN 256kbps internet access....:P

Uhhh... no. I can listen to the same music on any portable audio device. I'm just using a different media.

I can watch the same movies on any video playback device. Only the media I use differs.

I can watch SD programming on an HDTV, and vice verse.

Broadband and ISDN take me to the same internet.

But in the case of PS2 and PS3 software, I need unique hardware for each. Hence, your analogy sucks.

People with cassettes were screwed with the cd.

People with video's were screwed with dvd.

His analogy, although lacking, doesn't suck.

And besides, you're purposely ignoring valid statements, just to focus on tackling those that you can oppose to support your claim.



Wonktonodi said:
Mr Puggsly said:
Wonktonodi said:
Mr Puggsly said:
Wonktonodi said:
you also should consider had they left it in fewer people would have bought ps2s. Fewer ps2s means fewer people who can only buy ps2 games. Most of the big sellers on the ps2 these days are games that are also on newer systems. If there were less ps2s out there more people would buy the newer version. The titles you mention that kept selling on the ps1 were just a few games that kept selling. Currently there is GTA San Andreas that still show's up in the top 50 now and again.
Most the ps2 games selling new these days aren't selling for very much. Sony doesn't make as much on them as they used to. So why would they push that as much?

Don't just look at retail, Sony could have made a ton of money from selling games on PSN.

Also, games that were only on the PS2 but released during the life of the PS3 would have likely sold better.

The PS3 has a core audience, many of them would definitely be playing PS2 games if they had the option.

God of War 2 released after the ps3.  While ps3s could still play ps2 games probably still won't be as big as God of War 3 for the ps3.

If all they wanted was the ps2 to do well they could have not launched the ps3 at all.  They want to have the next console do well.  They still can put ps2 games on psn if they so choose and if they release them that way the game itself should be able to play on the ps3 just fine.  Marvel Vs capcom 2 for instance.

Would it be better for sony to sell more ps2 games to ps3 owners or to sell more ps3 games to ps3 owners.  I think they are doing fine with the ps2 and that what you think of is dead is far from the case.

I fail to see your point about God of War 2. It was released early in the PS3s life. The few people that were willing to drop $600 probably didn't want to play PS2 games (But atleast it was an option). Its now reasonably priced, the userbase has increased greatly, but the PS2 BC is gone. So we don't know the true potential BC would have had on PS2 software sales.

You might be surprised to hear its much more expensive to port a game. Selling the original requires little or no additional work from developers. Which is why emulation has become extremely common when bringing old games to newer consoles. Marvel vs Capcom 2 on PSN/XBLA is actually a port of the original Arcade/Dreamcast game. Apparently hardcore fans complained that the PS2/Xbox felt different.

You seem to think PS3 owners aren't gonna buy PS3 games if PS2 games are an option. But I'm saying they'll buy PS3 games, and they'll dabble in PS2 games as well. Just like they do with PS1 games already.

The point is that it had the user base of both the ps2 and the ps3 till there was no longer ps3 bc yet it's not like it was a 5 million seller.   Also when there are over 130 million consoles that can play ps2 games would another 20 million make that much of a difference.  Which is the main point.  Or how about until last year there were more ps2s sold since the launch of the ps3 than ps3s?  Maybe there could be more ps2 software sold, but maybe there would be less ps3 software sold as well.  Most people don't have the time or money to play all the games they want.  Although it won't be a 1 to 1 ratio.  If there were to have been substantially more ps2 games sold to ps3 owners there would have been fewer ps3 games sold. I know this is true for me and I know I'm not the only one.  Why would I buy rock band or the simpsons game for the ps2 when I can get it for the ps3?  The only games I'd buy for the ps2 are games that aren't on the ps3 and that's pretty much used games. 

Ps2 is far from dead since there are over 1.5 billion games out there.  It's rather amazing any new ones sell at all.  Over time sales of games for older systems even if they can be played on newer systems move to used sales.  How many new gba games moved on the ds before they took that feture out with the dsi?  How many new xbox games move on the x360 how many new gamecube games move onto the wii? 

That's not the point. I'm not saying games would sell millions more if the PS3 had BC. I'm just saying over all software sales would be better and it would encourage developers to make more games. As of now, the PS2 only gets one new game a month in the US. It gets more titles in Japan, but they are low budget niche titles. Europe doesn't even have anything listed for upcoming titles.

I didn't say it was dead. I said its pretty much dead. Bearing in mind how little new software it receives. Its not much of surprise it can still sell new games. It does still move tens of thousands units every week. Unfortunately, there isn't many new titles in the horizon.

I don't know why you are using other consoles as some sort of example. Sony has to do what the other guys are doing?



Recently Completed
River City: Rival Showdown
for 3DS (3/5) - River City: Tokyo Rumble for 3DS (4/5) - Zelda: BotW for Wii U (5/5) - Zelda: BotW for Switch (5/5) - Zelda: Link's Awakening for Switch (4/5) - Rage 2 for X1X (4/5) - Rage for 360 (3/5) - Streets of Rage 4 for X1/PC (4/5) - Gears 5 for X1X (5/5) - Mortal Kombat 11 for X1X (5/5) - Doom 64 for N64 (emulator) (3/5) - Crackdown 3 for X1S/X1X (4/5) - Infinity Blade III - for iPad 4 (3/5) - Infinity Blade II - for iPad 4 (4/5) - Infinity Blade - for iPad 4 (4/5) - Wolfenstein: The Old Blood for X1 (3/5) - Assassin's Creed: Origins for X1 (3/5) - Uncharted: Lost Legacy for PS4 (4/5) - EA UFC 3 for X1 (4/5) - Doom for X1 (4/5) - Titanfall 2 for X1 (4/5) - Super Mario 3D World for Wii U (4/5) - South Park: The Stick of Truth for X1 BC (4/5) - Call of Duty: WWII for X1 (4/5) -Wolfenstein II for X1 - (4/5) - Dead or Alive: Dimensions for 3DS (4/5) - Marvel vs Capcom: Infinite for X1 (3/5) - Halo Wars 2 for X1/PC (4/5) - Halo Wars: DE for X1 (4/5) - Tekken 7 for X1 (4/5) - Injustice 2 for X1 (4/5) - Yakuza 5 for PS3 (3/5) - Battlefield 1 (Campaign) for X1 (3/5) - Assassin's Creed: Syndicate for X1 (4/5) - Call of Duty: Infinite Warfare for X1 (4/5) - Call of Duty: MW Remastered for X1 (4/5) - Donkey Kong Country Returns for 3DS (4/5) - Forza Horizon 3 for X1 (5/5)

papflesje said:
Mr Puggsly said:
chanskie said:
Mr Puggsly said:

Had Sony not removed the BC on the PS3 I can't help but think PS2 software would be much more relevant today. Plugging in multiple boxes is a pain in the ass and that killed the PS2.

I blame SONY for the death of my Walkman, i am sure discman could have external post for cassette as BC. I blame Ipod for the death of my DIscman, i am sure APPLE can have a BC for IPOD.  I blame BLU-RAY for the death of DVDs, i blame HD TV for the death of my 52cm CRT TV......i blame broadband for the death of my belove ISDN 256kbps internet access....:P

Uhhh... no. I can listen to the same music on any portable audio device. I'm just using a different media.

I can watch the same movies on any video playback device. Only the media I use differs.

I can watch SD programming on an HDTV, and vice verse.

Broadband and ISDN take me to the same internet.

But in the case of PS2 and PS3 software, I need unique hardware for each. Hence, your analogy sucks.

People with cassettes were screwed with the cd.

People with video's were screwed with dvd.

His analogy, although lacking, doesn't suck.

And besides, you're purposely ignoring valid statements, just to focus on tackling those that you can oppose to support your claim.

Well they made cassete/CD players.

They have cassete/DVD players.

Where is my PS2/PS3 player?



Recently Completed
River City: Rival Showdown
for 3DS (3/5) - River City: Tokyo Rumble for 3DS (4/5) - Zelda: BotW for Wii U (5/5) - Zelda: BotW for Switch (5/5) - Zelda: Link's Awakening for Switch (4/5) - Rage 2 for X1X (4/5) - Rage for 360 (3/5) - Streets of Rage 4 for X1/PC (4/5) - Gears 5 for X1X (5/5) - Mortal Kombat 11 for X1X (5/5) - Doom 64 for N64 (emulator) (3/5) - Crackdown 3 for X1S/X1X (4/5) - Infinity Blade III - for iPad 4 (3/5) - Infinity Blade II - for iPad 4 (4/5) - Infinity Blade - for iPad 4 (4/5) - Wolfenstein: The Old Blood for X1 (3/5) - Assassin's Creed: Origins for X1 (3/5) - Uncharted: Lost Legacy for PS4 (4/5) - EA UFC 3 for X1 (4/5) - Doom for X1 (4/5) - Titanfall 2 for X1 (4/5) - Super Mario 3D World for Wii U (4/5) - South Park: The Stick of Truth for X1 BC (4/5) - Call of Duty: WWII for X1 (4/5) -Wolfenstein II for X1 - (4/5) - Dead or Alive: Dimensions for 3DS (4/5) - Marvel vs Capcom: Infinite for X1 (3/5) - Halo Wars 2 for X1/PC (4/5) - Halo Wars: DE for X1 (4/5) - Tekken 7 for X1 (4/5) - Injustice 2 for X1 (4/5) - Yakuza 5 for PS3 (3/5) - Battlefield 1 (Campaign) for X1 (3/5) - Assassin's Creed: Syndicate for X1 (4/5) - Call of Duty: Infinite Warfare for X1 (4/5) - Call of Duty: MW Remastered for X1 (4/5) - Donkey Kong Country Returns for 3DS (4/5) - Forza Horizon 3 for X1 (5/5)

Mr Puggsly said:
papflesje said:
Mr Puggsly said:
chanskie said:
Mr Puggsly said:

Had Sony not removed the BC on the PS3 I can't help but think PS2 software would be much more relevant today. Plugging in multiple boxes is a pain in the ass and that killed the PS2.

I blame SONY for the death of my Walkman, i am sure discman could have external post for cassette as BC. I blame Ipod for the death of my DIscman, i am sure APPLE can have a BC for IPOD.  I blame BLU-RAY for the death of DVDs, i blame HD TV for the death of my 52cm CRT TV......i blame broadband for the death of my belove ISDN 256kbps internet access....:P

Uhhh... no. I can listen to the same music on any portable audio device. I'm just using a different media.

I can watch the same movies on any video playback device. Only the media I use differs.

I can watch SD programming on an HDTV, and vice verse.

Broadband and ISDN take me to the same internet.

But in the case of PS2 and PS3 software, I need unique hardware for each. Hence, your analogy sucks.

People with cassettes were screwed with the cd.

People with video's were screwed with dvd.

His analogy, although lacking, doesn't suck.

And besides, you're purposely ignoring valid statements, just to focus on tackling those that you can oppose to support your claim.

Well they made cassete/CD players.

They have cassete/DVD players.

Where is my PS2/PS3 player?

 

They had it, but it cost them a bundle. They removed it, offered some titles on PSN, while continuing to gain from the PS2 sales. When those completely die off, you'll see your PS2/3 player in the PS3 (whether it's through emulation, PSN or Collections)