http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AdH8tFpkKYA&feature=player_embedded

I don't agree with some of their view points, especially when it came to the standard car details. They said that even standard cars were massively detailed, but from what I've seen, they look a bit inferior to GT5:P models. 

Also, they said that the physics are the same than in GT5:P, which is a bit false since GT5 TT had already the new physics engine, which a lot of people complained about, due to it's difficulty. Didn't help their cause that they were using TCS at 1 or 2. At the same time, they said the feedback physics were pitch perfect, 1:1 to the feeling of the track, so that was a glaring inconsistency. 

Oh, and they said photo-mode was a new addition to the gran turismo series, when GT4 had one as well. 

Hmm. 

I believe they were refferring to the new photomode features rather than just taking pictures.

Also the feedback point isnt really contradicting. Sometimes in GT5P the feedback on the wheel doesnt coincide with what your running over on track. It's off in places.

According to my friend who played TT he said the physics werent really different. But that the throttle just seemed more touchy. He was referring to the physics of the car over curbs, switch of direction etc. So they could be referring to that? I haven't played TT so cant comment first hand. 

Well, at the time of TT I did a side to side comparison between the physics of TT and GT5:P, using the same settings (Professional, no driving assists, TCS 0 and N3 tires, just like TT) and found some major differences, especially on the grip and weight shift of the car entering curbs. 

You could feel the overwhelming difference between the normal version (non-Tuned) and the Tuned version (which had a rear wing for added downforce) especially if you tried to oversteer on long winded curbs. In GT5:P there wasn't a significant difference, even when shifting weight down and putting R3 tires on supersport cars (Ford GT-40, Ferrari F-40 and so on).

Here are a few impressions of Time Trial, shame that ISR didn't get to play it: http://gamerlimit.com/2009/12/gamer-limit-impressions-gran-turismo-5-time-trial-challenge/

http://dualshockers.com/2009/12/18/gran-turismo-5-time-trial-impressions/

Thats good to know for GT fans. 

Also there is no denying, ISR had some of the best GT5 footage around there. It is without a doubt the best looking car game ever. It's the lighting more than anything. The lighting makes it look really good. In a way that can hide any low textures, 2d trees etc. But it does such a good job, that hands down beats Forza 3. Hopefully Forza 4 in 2011- early 2012 will up it's game again. But it's to be expected when each Forza takes half the time of GT.

20 tracks is worrying though. No matter the replication. Like they mention Rally will be on rally courses. 1? 2? 2 would leave only 18 normal tracks. Then Nascar. 1 or 2? 2 would leave 16 normal tracks. COnsidering Forza 3 released with 32 different circuits. Thats not variations as such. As you know there are 20 places in Forza 3 on it's release. But Camino Viejo for example has Iberian International Circuit under it's area. Even though it's differnet from Camino Circuit. And looks completely different. Also when the do the Camino Full circuit they join the 2 circuits together. 

Not to mention the rediculous length of Almalfi Coast, Fujima Kaido etc.

70 variations compared to 115 of both releases is odd. 

It's not fair to comapre GT5 to Forza 3's current Circuit number. Forza 3 DLC has come with more.

The track number really is worrying, but even on the official US GT site, it lists them as 20 locations. If it's 70 tracks variations of the different 20 locations, it will depend if that includes also reverse, different era variations and such. In this aspects, it looks to be pretty similar to what they've done in past GTs.

At this moment, i'm just really waiting for Gamescon in August before drawing any final opinions about GT5, since itt seems that PD withheld quite some amount of information. Probably just waiting to get everything fine tuned to the final version of the game, since in E3 it was just a demo build.

Yeah same. If it offers me more than just more cars and better graphics I will seriously consider PS3 this year. As a racing fan I have to. :)

But if it's basically the same game with more cars and the odd night race and possible wet race it's not enough. Everyone pretty much expects Forza 4 12-18 months after this October. And I'm only 30% through Forza 3 after 85 hours. Sometimes I get lost for 2 hours just tinkering with my decals or tuning setups in FM3. It's almost to big in content outside of amount of cars.

People sometimes forget just how much content Forza 3 has. It's not just about amount of cars. The sheer number of tracks and events makes Forza 3 a really good purchase. But the skill of making the most of your cars ability online is also for the hardcore. The tuning options are the most Ive seen on any console racer. And they affect the car just right to.

I know Forza 4 will come, and likely with night and wet to combat GT5. So GT5 may have just simply come to late for people like me. I have been playing Forza all generation. Forza 2 for the first 3 years and now Forza 3. Forza 4 will likely take mw to Forza 5 in the new generation. 

Sadly it looks as though GT4 will be my last bought GT copy I Purchase. Turn 10 release more frequent with significant upgrades. Whereas Polyphony seem to have gone with release less frequent and put in everything up to that point that they and other games have had. I prefer the former. As you end up with cutting edge more often.

Well, I wouldn't know about lack of content in GT games, especially since GT4 was massive. It took me almost 1000 hours in 3 years of gameplay to get the 100%. I just don't see GT5 having less content than this. 

Weather has been confirmed by one of the head administrators of SCEE, though I would love for PD to confirm it too, same as a livery editor, not just for performance livery, but also the rest of the car. If the track editor is also confirmed, we could see more options than ever, in a console racing sim. 

Forza 3 has an amazing amount of content, that's for sure, but I wouldn't count out GT5 out yet. If PD are playing their cards right, we've just seen the tip of the iceberg of what GT5 will have/do.

We still comparing shots of games in development to released games on this site?

I'm sure GT5 will be absolutely worth buying. What I mean though is when it releases Forza 4 will be probably about 16 months away. Polyphony and Sony missed the mark with me. By the time I finished GT4 ( about 2 years ) I was ready for the next. And Forza 2 was there. I had a 360 so I bought it. Then Turn 10 made significant upgrades and released Forza 3. 2 games progressively better. And currently the best on consoles. 

Forza 4 will be another progressive upgrade over 3, and likely I should have finished with 3 by then. I have no time for anoother sim right now ( GT5 ) and Forza 4 will likely be king when it releases. Theres just to much time between GT's to warrant my time on them. 

Forza makes progress over 2-3 year periods. Where Polyphony seem to take 4-5 years. Rally doesnt bother me because I will likely purchase WRC. And F1 2010 is my other racing title thats a must for me.

Do you see my point? GT4-GT5 is a bigger leap than Forza 2 - 3, but I have to wait longer. And Turn 10 likely will have GT5's measure not long after it releases.

I understand completely, and I respect that. But I feel that both Forza and GT games complement each other, rather than directly compete against one another.

It's true that Forza games are feeling more frequent now, but PD themselves have stated that GT6 won't take as half the time that GT5 took. It won't be 16 months, true, but I don't see GT6 taking more than 2 years to reach the market. They've got the engine and everything set up, so it's just additions from now on. Kinda like the jump from GT3 - GT4. 

I just hope both Forza and GT fans appreciate each of the games, because in the end, with two excellent quality sims, the true winners are us, the racing enthusiasts.