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Forums - Sony - Playstation Move: or how else would we have made the controller?

Twistedpixel on 14 March 2010
joeorc said:
Twistedpixel said:

If they had the technology and didn't have the will to use it or if they didn't have the technology but still had the will then either way they copied Nintendo. The very idea of making a Wii like interface a core focus of the console was Nintendos own, the technology to make it work in an efficient and affordable way in 2006 was also Nintendos own. Sony's implementation is still more expensive and has not shown more than marginal benefits over the original Wii concept.

o'l god here we freakin go again.

derail..derail..derail.only if its a sony thread .

Stop railing on me.



Do you know what its like to live on the far side of Uranus?

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jarrod on 14 March 2010
joeorc said:
jarrod said:
joeorc said:
jarrod said:
joeorc said:
jarrod said:
Marks' work in "augmented reality" and man-machine interplay isn't really much like Wii. It's basically the next evolution of stuff that started with the EyeToy, and it's really a different implementation for motion interface entirely.

Where Sony's taken after Nintendo pretty clearly is in integrating accelerometers, the primary remote design and the "sub" controller design. That's why people post the amusingly similar PR shots, and let the photos do the talking...

o'l brother you too huh?

 clearly is in integrating accelerometers

that's like saying because my design has bluetooth also you capied me!

, the primary remote design 

EXIBIT A: the TV remote or what was the Wiimote called: a Wii remote!

 and the "sub" controller design.

gee no ball on top and add an analog stick like only Nintendo would have thought of that?

Nintendo's first accelerometer gaming product released in 2001.  They've been moving this direction for awhile, Iwata basically spearheaded it when he took over... hell, they even wanted accelerometers in the DS originally (sadly cut due to space/cost concerns, real missed opportunity).  Sixaxis was Sony hedging their bets, and it's last second implementation was pretty obvious going by the hilarious original Warhawk demos at E3 2006.  Move is more their final acceptance of Nintendo's utter market disruption... as a great man once said "follow our lead". ;)

As for the basic designs, well again, a picture's worth how many words again?

if it was last second, and hedgeing their bet's why was there a control flight pad for the playstation 1 that allowed sixaxis control for the first warhawk

that was for the playstation 1.

so both were using thing's like gyroscopes and accelerometers in their R&D

Eh.. are you talking about the Logitech pad?  The original Microsoft Sidewinder in 1995 had a tilt sensor, I guess they beat both Nintendo and Sony to the punch? :P

The only 1st party PS1 flight controller I remember was the analog joystick, which basically resembled a Virtual On stick.  And no, it had no gyroscopes or accelerometers.

The Tilt Force 2 by Pelican for PS1 was actually the first one to use it. If you don't believe me here is the link to it.

http://www.playstationmuseum.com/Features/

here is a picture:

Function:
The tactile response of the Tilt Force 2 when used in the standard style is on par with other Dual Shock compatible controllers. It?s not necessarily superior to other controllers, but it does work well. The tilt sensing feature is quite refreshing, however. The controller responds to tilting it forward, backward, left, and right, and is completely adjustable... both in range of movement, sensitivity, and ?at rest? position. This allows you to ?tweak? the response of the pad to fit both your personal style and the specific game you are playing. This goes not only for the tilt feature, but for the joysticks as well. In addition, you can swap up/down between the tilt feature and the lead joystick... which in turn, can be chosen as the left or right stick. I have never seen a controller as configurable as the Tilt Force 2. One size REALLY fits all!
http://www.psillustrated.com/psillustrated/hard_rev.php/291/tilt-force-2-playstation.html

A 3rd party pad released 2 years after Warhawk?  This has to do with Sony how?  You know Pelican also released the Tilt Pack for N64 around the same time, right?

And no, the Sidewinder released before this.



joeorc on 14 March 2010
jarrod said:
joeorc said:
jarrod said:
joeorc said:
jarrod said:
joeorc said:
jarrod said:
Marks' work in "augmented reality" and man-machine interplay isn't really much like Wii. It's basically the next evolution of stuff that started with the EyeToy, and it's really a different implementation for motion interface entirely.

Where Sony's taken after Nintendo pretty clearly is in integrating accelerometers, the primary remote design and the "sub" controller design. That's why people post the amusingly similar PR shots, and let the photos do the talking...

o'l brother you too huh?

 clearly is in integrating accelerometers

that's like saying because my design has bluetooth also you capied me!

, the primary remote design 

EXIBIT A: the TV remote or what was the Wiimote called: a Wii remote!

 and the "sub" controller design.

gee no ball on top and add an analog stick like only Nintendo would have thought of that?

Nintendo's first accelerometer gaming product released in 2001.  They've been moving this direction for awhile, Iwata basically spearheaded it when he took over... hell, they even wanted accelerometers in the DS originally (sadly cut due to space/cost concerns, real missed opportunity).  Sixaxis was Sony hedging their bets, and it's last second implementation was pretty obvious going by the hilarious original Warhawk demos at E3 2006.  Move is more their final acceptance of Nintendo's utter market disruption... as a great man once said "follow our lead". ;)

As for the basic designs, well again, a picture's worth how many words again?

if it was last second, and hedgeing their bet's why was there a control flight pad for the playstation 1 that allowed sixaxis control for the first warhawk

that was for the playstation 1.

so both were using thing's like gyroscopes and accelerometers in their R&D

Eh.. are you talking about the Logitech pad?  The original Microsoft Sidewinder in 1995 had a tilt sensor, I guess they beat both Nintendo and Sony to the punch? :P

The only 1st party PS1 flight controller I remember was the analog joystick, which basically resembled a Virtual On stick.  And no, it had no gyroscopes or accelerometers.

The Tilt Force 2 by Pelican for PS1 was actually the first one to use it. If you don't believe me here is the link to it.

http://www.playstationmuseum.com/Features/

here is a picture:

Function:
The tactile response of the Tilt Force 2 when used in the standard style is on par with other Dual Shock compatible controllers. It?s not necessarily superior to other controllers, but it does work well. The tilt sensing feature is quite refreshing, however. The controller responds to tilting it forward, backward, left, and right, and is completely adjustable... both in range of movement, sensitivity, and ?at rest? position. This allows you to ?tweak? the response of the pad to fit both your personal style and the specific game you are playing. This goes not only for the tilt feature, but for the joysticks as well. In addition, you can swap up/down between the tilt feature and the lead joystick... which in turn, can be chosen as the left or right stick. I have never seen a controller as configurable as the Tilt Force 2. One size REALLY fits all!
http://www.psillustrated.com/psillustrated/hard_rev.php/291/tilt-force-2-playstation.html

A 3rd party pad released 2 years after Warhawk?  This has to do with Sony how?  You know Pelican also released the Tilt Pack for N64 around the same time, right?

And no, the Sidewinder released before this.

yes I know the side winder was first,  OR THAT LOGITEC PRODUCED THE EYE TOY FOR SONY I was talking durring the development of tilt for console's Sony also was working on their own. the point being they all were aware, and already have used the technology at some point in their R&D before and invested  DEVELOPMENT into it.

some product's get made other's do not. that does not mean they copied someone.



I AM BOLO

100% lover "nothing else matter's" after that...

ps:

Proud psOne/2/3/p owner.  I survived Aplcalyps3 and all I got was this lousy Signature.

jarrod on 14 March 2010
joeorc said:

yes I know the side winder was first,  OR THAT LOGITEC PRODUCED THE EYE TOY FOR SONY I was talking durring the development of tilt for console's Sony also was working on their own. the point being they all were aware, and already have used the technology at some point in their R&D before and invested  DEVELOPMENT into it.

some product's get made other's do not. that does not mean they copied someone.

There's no evidence that Sony was working on their own tilt controller before Sixaxis.  There is that Nintendo was as far back as 2000 though, Factor 5 used an early prototype when they started R&D on Rogue Leader.

And again, the "copy" here is pretty plainly obvious.  Move is basically a Wiimote/M+ using an EyeToy and flipping the led/camera placement for pointer control.



joeorc on 14 March 2010
jarrod said:
joeorc said:

yes I know the side winder was first,  OR THAT LOGITEC PRODUCED THE EYE TOY FOR SONY I was talking durring the development of tilt for console's Sony also was working on their own. the point being they all were aware, and already have used the technology at some point in their R&D before and invested  DEVELOPMENT into it.

some product's get made other's do not. that does not mean they copied someone.

There's no evidence that Sony was working on their own tilt controller before Sixaxis.  There is that Nintendo was as far back as 2000 though, Factor 5 used an early prototype when they started R&D on Rogue Leader.

And again, the "copy" here is pretty plainly obvious.  Move is basically a Wiimote/M+ using an EyeToy and flipping the led/camera placement for pointer control.

Riiiight.....o'l brother like the flight pad or the flight stick was unheard of

come on man your reaching.

Is it that hard for people on here to think that maybe just Maybe.

Sony and Nintendo both had the exact same great IDEA at the same time.

But developed their own path's of technology that may do thing's alike but are not the same!

it's clear as day. Some people just do not want to admit it.

 

 



I AM BOLO

100% lover "nothing else matter's" after that...

ps:

Proud psOne/2/3/p owner.  I survived Aplcalyps3 and all I got was this lousy Signature.

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Vertigo-X on 14 March 2010
joeorc said:
Vertigo-X said:

 

 

Okay, are you people seriously saying that Sony isn't copying Nintendo here? The concept is a blatant rip-off!

hey sparky:

Sony's R&D in 2003-

His wand is made from parts of a hotel clothes hanger and has a brightly colored ball on one end

Sony's R&D in 2005-

Sony's new idea is to plug a webcam into the console, and give the gamer a handheld wand similar to a pocket flashlight. The wand has a battery, a few mouse-like buttons and several different coloured LEDs that can be switched on and off in various combinations.

By pressing the buttons and waving the wand towards the webcam, the gamer can click to shoot aliens, drag-and-drop images on screen and navigate menus.

The webcam is tuned to see only pure bright colours and map their motion in space, so it can ignore ordinary room lights. And if two people have wands with different coloured LEDs, they can play against each other.

SO HOW ELSE DO YOU MAKE AN ELECTRONIC WAND WITH A SPHERE ON TOP?

O'l and if you still think it's a copy:

Wii remote when was it first shown

The controller was revealed at the TGS on October 14, 2005, with the name "Wii Remote" announced April 27, 2006.

SONY's concept of the playstation wand :

Invention: Magic wand for gamers

For over 30 years, Barry Fox has trawled the world's weird and wonderful patent applications each week, digging out the most exciting, intriguing and even terrifying new ideas. His column, Invention, is now available exclusively online. Please send us your feedback.

Magic wand

PlayStation gamers are always looking for exciting new ways to control the onscreen action, but using a camera to track a player's body movement has not worked reliably, admits Sony. The camera gets confused by other things in the room.

Sony's new idea is to plug a webcam into the console, and give the gamer a handheld wand similar to a pocket flashlight. The wand has a battery, a few mouse-like buttons and several different coloured LEDs that can be switched on and off in various combinations.

By pressing the buttons and waving the wand towards the webcam, the gamer can click to shoot aliens, drag-and-drop images on screen and navigate menus.

The webcam is tuned to see only pure bright colours and map their motion in space, so it can ignore ordinary room lights. And if two people have wands with different coloured LEDs, they can play against each other.

Read about Sony's gaming wand here (pdf format).

http://www.newscientist.com/article/dn7890

 

so 2 month's after Sony's concept the Wii remote get's shown

 

 

Okay, I'll forgive you for missing this, but seriously: look at the fucking pictures.



The BuShA owns all!

Vertigo-X on 14 March 2010
joeorc said:
 

Riiiight.....o'l brother like the flight pad or the flight stick was unheard of

come on man your reaching.

Is it that hard for people on here to think that maybe just Maybe.

Sony and Nintendo both had the exact same great IDEA at the same time.

But developed their own path's of technology that may do thing's alike but are not the same!

it's clear as day. Some people just do not want to admit it.

 

 

You seem to be constantly missing the point.

 

SONY COPIED THE CONCEPT/PHILOSOPHY, NOT THE TECHNOLOGY!! TAKE A LOOK AT THE FREAKIN' PICTURES! THE "CONCEPT" IS 99% THE SAME!!!

 

Seriously, stop acting dumb. You should be able to understand what we're talking about, but like a stone wall you refuse to admit that Sony has copied anything here. Do yourself a favor and again look at the freakin' pictures!!

 

EDIT: If you still refuse to believe that the concept and philosophies are copied, I can go into detail. -_-



The BuShA owns all!

Vertigo-X on 14 March 2010
jarrod said:

Nintendo's first accelerometer gaming product released in 2001.  They've been moving this direction for awhile, Iwata basically spearheaded it when he took over... hell, they even wanted accelerometers in the DS originally (sadly cut due to space/cost concerns, real missed opportunity).  Sixaxis was Sony hedging their bets, and it's last second implementation was pretty obvious going by the hilarious original Warhawk demos at E3 2006.  Move is more their final acceptance of Nintendo's utter market disruption... as a great man once said "follow our lead". ;)

As for the basic designs, well again, a picture's worth how many words again?

Ooooo! That picture's much better! :D



The BuShA owns all!

joeorc on 14 March 2010
Vertigo-X said:
joeorc said:
Vertigo-X said:

 

 

Okay, are you people seriously saying that Sony isn't copying Nintendo here? The concept is a blatant rip-off!

hey sparky:

Sony's R&D in 2003-

His wand is made from parts of a hotel clothes hanger and has a brightly colored ball on one end

Sony's R&D in 2005-

Sony's new idea is to plug a webcam into the console, and give the gamer a handheld wand similar to a pocket flashlight. The wand has a battery, a few mouse-like buttons and several different coloured LEDs that can be switched on and off in various combinations.

By pressing the buttons and waving the wand towards the webcam, the gamer can click to shoot aliens, drag-and-drop images on screen and navigate menus.

The webcam is tuned to see only pure bright colours and map their motion in space, so it can ignore ordinary room lights. And if two people have wands with different coloured LEDs, they can play against each other.

SO HOW ELSE DO YOU MAKE AN ELECTRONIC WAND WITH A SPHERE ON TOP?

O'l and if you still think it's a copy:

Wii remote when was it first shown

The controller was revealed at the TGS on October 14, 2005, with the name "Wii Remote" announced April 27, 2006.

SONY's concept of the playstation wand :

Invention: Magic wand for gamers

For over 30 years, Barry Fox has trawled the world's weird and wonderful patent applications each week, digging out the most exciting, intriguing and even terrifying new ideas. His column, Invention, is now available exclusively online. Please send us your feedback.

Magic wand

PlayStation gamers are always looking for exciting new ways to control the onscreen action, but using a camera to track a player's body movement has not worked reliably, admits Sony. The camera gets confused by other things in the room.

Sony's new idea is to plug a webcam into the console, and give the gamer a handheld wand similar to a pocket flashlight. The wand has a battery, a few mouse-like buttons and several different coloured LEDs that can be switched on and off in various combinations.

By pressing the buttons and waving the wand towards the webcam, the gamer can click to shoot aliens, drag-and-drop images on screen and navigate menus.

The webcam is tuned to see only pure bright colours and map their motion in space, so it can ignore ordinary room lights. And if two people have wands with different coloured LEDs, they can play against each other.

Read about Sony's gaming wand here (pdf format).

http://www.newscientist.com/article/dn7890

 

so 2 month's after Sony's concept the Wii remote get's shown

 

 

Okay, I'll forgive you for missing this, but seriously: look at the fucking pictures.

SO HOW ELSE DO YOU MAKE AN ELECTRONIC WAND WITH A SPHERE ON TOP?

and to make it like a pointer you would need a nanlog stick of some sort.

GET over it people!

the simple truth

the Wii mote  is a "remote"

the nunchuck is a "little remote"

playstation Move is a "REMOTE"

playstation sub is "little REMOTE"

THEY ARE BOTH MODELED OFF OF THE

REMOTE

WHY?

BECAUSE THE PEOPLE THAT DESIGNED THE TECHNOLOGY BOTH USED WAND'S, BOTH SONY AND NINTENDO WAY BEFORE THE Wii an the PS3 was released was delving into THE SAME IDEA that a " Remote style of controller " was very good in it's design to controll interactive software.

notice DR. Marks used a wand with a freakin sphere on top even back in 2000' there is a reason, the technology  of the EYE TOY work's best with a colored sphere on top. a multi-colored sphere like a led that changes color can represent a muzzle flash, or rep. a paint brush to interact with the EYE TOY.

it's the freakin designer of the EYETOY he was using a wand, because that's the best way to use it.

even back in 2000'

once again  it's not a clone, not a rip off, not a duplicate.




I AM BOLO

100% lover "nothing else matter's" after that...

ps:

Proud psOne/2/3/p owner.  I survived Aplcalyps3 and all I got was this lousy Signature.

joeorc on 14 March 2010
Vertigo-X said:
joeorc said:
 

Riiiight.....o'l brother like the flight pad or the flight stick was unheard of

come on man your reaching.

Is it that hard for people on here to think that maybe just Maybe.

Sony and Nintendo both had the exact same great IDEA at the same time.

But developed their own path's of technology that may do thing's alike but are not the same!

it's clear as day. Some people just do not want to admit it.

 

 

You seem to be constantly missing the point.

 

SONY COPIED THE CONCEPT/PHILOSOPHY, NOT THE TECHNOLOGY!! TAKE A LOOK AT THE FREAKIN' PICTURES! THE "CONCEPT" IS 99% THE SAME!!!

 

Seriously, stop acting dumb. You should be able to understand what we're talking about, but like a stone wall you refuse to admit that Sony has copied anything here. Do yourself a favor and again look at the freakin' pictures!!

 

EDIT: If you still refuse to believe that the concept and philosophies are copied, I can go into detail. -_-

THE CONCEPT..YOU WANT TO TALK ABOUT CONCEPT:

of course their going to be the freakin same:

they are both based on the design of the TV remote's.

because the core concept of both nintendo an Sony's R&D were both looking at the "TV REMOTE" Style design

LOOK AT THE DATE'S

how could of sony had a :  a patent applications back in 2005

2 months

prior to the release of the nintendo Wii mote when the Wiimote was first shown

The controller was revealed at the TGS on October 14, 2005, with the name "Wii Remote" announced April 27, 2006.

hey sparky:

Sony's R&D in 2005-

Sony's new idea is to plug a webcam into the console,

and give the gamer a handheld wand similar to a pocket flashlight. IE: A FREAKIN SPHERE ON TOP

The wand has a

battery, a few mouse-like buttons and several different coloured LEDs that can be switched on and off in various combinations.

By pressing the buttons and waving the wand towards the webcam, the gamer can click to shoot aliens, drag-and-drop images on screen and navigate menus.

The webcam is tuned to see only pure bright colours and map their motion in space, so it can ignore ordinary room lights. And if two people have wands with different coloured LEDs, they can play against each other.

SO HOW ELSE DO YOU MAKE AN ELECTRONIC WAND WITH A SPHERE ON TOP?

Invention: Magic wand for gamers

For over 30 years, Barry Fox has trawled the world's weird and wonderful patent applications each week, digging out the most exciting, intriguing and even terrifying new ideas. His column, Invention, is now available exclusively online. Please send us your feedback.

Magic wand

PlayStation gamers are always looking for exciting new ways to control the onscreen action, but using a camera to track a player's body movement has not worked reliably, admits Sony. The camera gets confused by other things in the room.

Sony's new idea is to plug a webcam into the console, and give the gamer a handheld wand similar to a pocket flashlight. The wand has a battery, a few mouse-like buttons and several different coloured LEDs that can be switched on and off in various combinations.

By pressing the buttons and waving the wand towards the webcam, the gamer can click to shoot aliens, drag-and-drop images on screen and navigate menus.

The webcam is tuned to see only pure bright colours and map their motion in space, so it can ignore ordinary room lights. And if two people have wands with different coloured LEDs, they can play against each other.

Read about Sony's gaming wand here (pdf format).

http://www.newscientist.com/article/dn7890

 

so 2 month's after Sony's concept the Wii remote get's shown

BUT..BUT WHAT ABOUT THE Nunchuck

no.no Sony would have never thought about an analog controller at the same time as this only Nintendo would have,

REMEMBER Sony never innovates!/ that was sarcasm if you could not tell.

get over it. Sony did not copy the concept,

they did not copy the technology,

they did not copy it at all

Nintendo was not the only company with this IDEA for Wireless control design.

this thread more than proves that.

 

 



I AM BOLO

100% lover "nothing else matter's" after that...

ps:

Proud psOne/2/3/p owner.  I survived Aplcalyps3 and all I got was this lousy Signature.