JuliusHackebeil said:
I'm trying to frame this in regards to what I want from ND in their next game, so that it is not too far off topic. I think there is a somewhat discussion to be had about murder and torture being a good, or bad thing. Sure, we all see those things as bad, but this does not mean I cannot consume stuff (like video games) where the lessons are unintuitive, difficult, moraly revolting. I don't think ND is interested anylonger in making such games. Where the lesson in the end is: murder is difficult but just foresake some part of your humanity, become a monster, do the most horrible acts and live happier for it. Don't get me wrong, murder is almost always wrong and almost always scarring. Any balanced human being would agree with that. But perhaps playing as a balanced human being, who in the end always learns the right lesson, is boring. I would find it much more interesting and engaging to play as a psychopath who over time loses remorse over torture and killing, lives happy and walks away with the completely wrong lesson. Kind of what happened in TLoU part 1. Joel is for all intents and purposes a shitty person (how Tess put it). He lived part of the apocalyps as hunter scum. He kills all the good guys and even gravely betrays the trust of his daughter (Ellie of course). And then he walks away with her, to live a peaceful happy life in Jackson. But suddenly, in Part 2, everything is different. Suddenly people get what they diserve. And many charakters really had it coming. I want a cruel world where injustice wins. In Part 2 some cosmic forces, or karma or whatever is really at it. And everybody seems to get what they deserve. That is kiddy and boring. I might be on the wrong track with the following, but I think if you subscribe to a certain ideology and are of a certain mindset, game like that, games that I want, cannot be made. And ND at the moment is in a headspace where creating something like I described above seems impossible. The TLoU2 is deeper than most games. Sure. But it did not go far enough for me by a long shot. Part 1 excelled in comparison. And this describes a downward trajectory ND might be on. |
Okay, I now have a better grasp of where you're coming from and what it is that you would like to see.
However, I think that most "normal" games actually are already giving you what you are looking for. Just kill everything that comes in your way to reach your goals and live on happily, without giving it a second thought. Very few games try to offer any kind of moral pondering whatsoever, it's just kill X to get Y. Totally psychopathic behavior with impunity, when you think about it. To me, *that's* boring compared to what TLOU has been offering lately.
The shittiness was acknowledged in part one and part two did not drop it, but rather expanded on it. So much so in fact, that many people were completely turned off, they don't want to feel all these shitty feelings one way or the other. They want clear cut good and bad and their favorites to live on forever. How dare someone suggest that their favorites may actually be kind of bad and perhaps deserve something not so good.
Many people had it coming but some did not so much, just like in real life. Injustices were everywhere, including the fates of some main characters. People that once were nice and balanced became unhinged and consumed by their worst aspects. And in some cases, lessons were not learned until it was too late, if at all. It's complicated. Good stuff.
Yeah, I don't know what to tell you, man :) We just must have very different lenses on when playing these games.
I'd be interested to see what a game would look like if it had exactly what you are looking for here. Are there games that work for you in this regard, that you could give as an example?
