13 Dead in Shooting in Thousand Oaks California

[PAOerfulone]

o_O.Q said:

JRPGfan said:

That was 10 or more Muslim extremists, running through crowds stabbing people, in a co-ordinated terror attack.
Thats insane though...... didnt think such things happend with just knives.

 

people in this thread have mocked the idea that its not guns that kill people but its people that kill people

and to me that just exposes ignorance

the fact of the matter is that if a persons' resolve to kill is strong enough then they'll find some other alternative to harm others if you ban guns

 

and no matter how much of your freedoms you give up to your government they will never be able to guarantee you a completely safe environment

and often in the process of trying to do so they still end up killing millions and making the lives of their citizens a living hell 

 

if any of those chinese citizens had a gun in their possession they would have been able to stop that attack i'd think

1) You're right. It's people who have no business carrying a firearm that kill people.

2) Yes, that's the case. And those are exactly the type of people I am talking about! So wouldn't it make sense to limit their access to the most convenient and easiest option that can lead to the deadliest results and highest casualties? The argument of "they're going to try to kill anyways and they'll find other ways to do it besides guns" is the most counterproductive and foolish argument of this issue. All you're essentially telling them is, "Hey you guys are going to go crazy anyways. We know you're a lost cause, so.... here ya go! We'll make it easy for ya!"

3) Have you ever heard or seen a completely safe environment? There's no such thing. There never was. There is always going to be danger no matter what and we're never going to be 100% safe as long as we live in a society of free will. But that's not an excuse to not even bother trying at all. In that case, why even bother with a police force? The entire point is to limit that danger and violence as best we can. To make our environment as safe as we can possibly make it. To a point where, while we don't feel absolutely, completely safe, we do feel comfortable. And whatever problems come up, we don't just leave them unintended and allow them to get worse. We sit our asses down, put our heads together and try to come up with solutions

4) And when that happens, sooner or later, revolution occurs to overthrow the government. Some are successful, some are not.

5) And on the flip side, if that group of terrorists had guns instead of knives, the death count would have skyrocketed.
Furthermore, if those citizens had a gun in addition to the terrorists having them, then the death count could very easily climb even higher. Especially if those citizens are not properly and expertly trained in those types of situations.

It's not the 1700s anymore, when the U.S. Constitution was ratified in 1788, horse carriage was the primary method of travel, radio hadn't been invented yet, slavery was still a thing, Ludwig van Beethoven was just getting started in the music industry, there was no such thing as the FBI or CIA which wouldn't be founded until 120 and 159 years later, respectively, and George Washington had not assumed his role in office as the 1st president of the (Just 13) United States yet.

The argument that we need guns to protect us from the government was dead and long gone by the time we reached the 20th century. Now that we live in a modern age where everything, especially weaponry, has advanced to astronomical proportions, the idea that we need guns to protect ourselves from government and oppression is nothing more than a delusion we tell ourselves to cope with our own personal insecurities. If the government really wants you dead, guess what, pal? You're dead. Whether it be via bombing, plain crash, "accidental" overdose, or any other type of conspiracy theory there is in the book, or a more direct approach like the Army coming to your town. Having an AK-47, a 9 mm calibur, etc. isn't going to do jack shit to protect you at that point.

The real reason, no matter what anybody says, why people want to own guns in the 21st century is simple: "Because I want one." That's it. It's not a necessity, it's a luxury. A very dangerous luxury if placed in the wrong hands. If you want one, fine. I don't think banning guns is the answer, I actually think that would actually do more harm than good. But, a common misconception people make that they really need to get over is this: Gun Control =/= Banning Guns
If you want to own a gun, you better understand the implications and responsibility that comes with it and be willing to undergo the training, education, and prerequisites necessary in order to own one.

Last edited by PAOerfulone - on 08 November 2018