| Pemalite said:
He *helped* design. There has been a ton of work done to Ryzen since he left a few years back, otherwise if the CPU was completed before he left it would be on the market already. ;) Are you serious? Microsoft stating that the cost won't be as high as people think is somehow a more vague statement than throwing around Teraflops? Please. I never stated that the Scorpio is going to be a loss-leading product? I disagree and think Microsoft should do the opposite. |
Jim didn't do everything, but I think we can agree that he no doubt got AMD started on right path and left them in a good position so Ryzen should actually be competitve with Intel from an overall perspective, based on what we know.
Cost to the customer matters to a certain extent, but the value also matters, just not quite as much, but it does matter. You can't tell me that if PS3 was $399 and $499 to start, that sales wouldn't have been much much higher than they were early on. I'm not saying MS is going to build a $749-$999 beast like PS3 and sell it for $399, we know that $599 was even a problem for PS, but XB could definitelty build an Excavator or Ryzen + Vega APU based system for $599 ish, and sell it for $499. If PS is selling consoles at cost as they say, then Pro costs $399 to build. For another $99to$199, MS can get a WAY better APU by next fall.
XB1 price was a small part of the problem. While there were MANY issues, the fact that you could buy a more powerful console, PS4, for cheaper, was a no brainer. Thats a big reason that helped 360 go toe to toe with PS3 (360 looked more powerful for years, but we all know it wasn't at its core) I think everyone would be willing to admit, that if XB1, didn't have the DRM/online/kinect issues, and had made a console that was say 2.5 Tflops, for $499, most 360 gamers would have stayed and bought XB1, and obviously other consumers would have been inclined to get One for those reasons.
If MS decides to take that approach this time around, no gimmicks, they will be back to selling consoles closer to par with PS like they were with the 360. However, the XB1 fiasco, most certainly has left a scar, that will not be easily forgiven. The S model has helped, but its only a bandaid. A Pro style console with a better GPU, is not going to be enough to stop people from looking back at that scar and sighing. A Ryzen+Vega+12GBGDDR5 level console, for $499, would be enough for them to keep their eyes on the screen and off of the old scar.
Throwing around TFlops is pretty easy to make a close guess. They won't make it less than 6, we all know that, and sure it could end up 7, but the higher those TFlops go, the better that CPU has to be, or its all just numbers for marketing. XB has to keep things fairly simple for devs. Thats another reason PS4 hammered XB1 for the first couple of years.
When XB says price wont be higher than consoles before, we all know that means less than $599. Since Pro was a premium console at $399, we can conclude Scoprio will be $399 to $599, based on what we know.
You never said MS isnt willing to take a loss, but you also keep saying price is so important and thats part of the reason it wont be Ryzen and Vega. Well if MS decides to pull a PS3 (which truthfully, look at how they launched XB1, while its unlikely, it could happen) then they could very easily use a certain version of Ryzen and Vega in Scorpio and lightly or heavily subsidize it.
Building a slightly better Pro, and calling it Scorpio, is not going to improve sales all that much this gen. People will be paying attention to Scorpio, when it comes to what XB says they are offering, and what your getting, based on the XB1 launch. If MS says it'll be slightly better than Pro, and it is, then many people won't bother. If they say "its a beast", and its not, they will get called on it and shunned like they were back before the S model came out. If they say "its a beast", and it is a beast, for $499, many XB1 gamers will jump on it, and XB gamers who went PS4 will be tempted to go back, and other people in general, like the spec crazed individual, will want it.
