Rainbird said:
Yes and no. I think you have narrowed your vision somewhat, because while the Wii certainly is the bestselling console this generation, both PS3 and Xbox 360 are moving software. I just checked, and the 360 currently has 64 games that have sold at least a million copies, and the Wii has 41. The 360 also has a much smaller userbase than the Wii, so saying developers are 'missing the mark' with good graphics, is hard to prove. Don't get me wrong, I fully agree that gameplay is more important than graphics, but the market for people buying 'next-gen' games over 'new-gen' is not insignificant, and until it starts evaporating, or the Wii proves a greater market, developers are going to make their games for the "proven" platforms. But to prove both our points, I will bring up Left 4 Dead. Running on the Source engine, it is hardly a graphical behemoth, but it still requires the processing power and memory of a HD console (or PC of course) to run as it designed to. This should be easily provable by referring to Dead Rising, a game that hardly pushed the graphics of the 360 when it came out, but it proved that graphics are not everything with its port to the Wii. |
Fair enough. I'll concede that I overreached with that statement, and that there are plenty of folks who enjoy HD games. But two points: the first is that few HD games seem to have any appreciable "legs," and that it seems to be very hit-or-miss in terms of which games sell. In other words, there seems to be a voracious core of gamers who buy the big games, but that there are not enough of them to support a wider variety of games. Put alternatively, the big-games are very big, and the small games are very small. For that reason, I don't think we can use just the platinum-sellers to gauge appeal. But that's an assertion that will require more time to defend than I have at the moment. Perhaps another time?
| Rainbird said: I have no idea if they will be remembered, but I do know, that while some people consider some games classic for their gameplay, they certainly age. Now, I have not played Super Mario Galaxy (I want to though), but I am very confident, that if you ask someone what game they like better, between Super Mario Galaxy and Super Mario 64, the few people who will answer SM64 are probably nostalgic about it, or they would have said SMG. What SM64 did back well then, has been done better since. Classics that are remembered because of their gameplay have good memories attached to them, but if you sit down and play SM64, it will probably feel dated, because Nintendo has since put out new, better Mario games. But a classic that is remembered for something else, like its story will still hold up storywise in many years to come, because it is much more unique than gameplay. I would like to play MGS for example, so I can be told the story, and at the same time get more out of MGS4, but it has nothing to do with gameplay. And my example with God of War, was meant to illustrate that games can be remembered for other things than gameplay alone. And I do count puzzles as gameplay, but the game always gave you that feeling that the puzzle was a daunting task. And to answer your question, "What is it about being on an HD console that makes it so memorable?", I'll say this. When you think of playing MK Wii for example, you think of the fun you have with it, right? It's exactly the same with the games you like on HD consoles, but they open up the experience to another level. It is of course a different question whether developers know how to use that extra power for the better of their game, but it certainly happens. As an example, I will use Killzone 2 (in case you weren't already sick of hearing about it, but hear me out). The power of the PS3 contains is used very well, and for the better of the game. The gameplay is really good, but it is combined with exceptional graphics and sound and creates a sense of immersion few games reach these days. You are never in doubt that you are on a foreign planet, fighting a war. It never feels like you are playing a game, where the enemies' only objective is to eliminate you, but you are fighting a war like war has never been presented in a game before. Killzone 2 is like nothing that has come before it, and while gameplay is the biggest factor to the succes of the game, the fact that the developers had the means to take it an extra mile with graphics and sound, means the game is outstanding. If you want to talk Wii vs. PS360 specifically, then it of course comes down to game selection, and once there are more games I am interested in on the Wii, I will get one, but right now, it is not the case, and I am certain a lot of HD console owners feel the same about the Wii's selection of games. Finally, I feel sad that you haven't played Flower. It really is a gem of a game, one of the most unique and astounding games to have been around in a long time. |
Regarding Mario 64, I'm not sure I agree. Remember, it's been re-released for the DS, and it's sold millions once again. More importantly, it's done so by selling small but steady amounts, which to me means it's spreading by word of mouth. I've no doubt some of those were because of nostalgia, but I have a hard time believing even a fraction of the total is from nostalgia.
I appreciate your example about Killzone 2, though. My own example would have been Dead Rising, which (demonstrably) can't be replicated on the Wii. But your point is well-taken. It just doesn't seem, from my interpretation of the data we have, that immersion is as big of a selling-point with most people as "easier to control." But as you pointed out earlier, there are tens of millions who feel otherwise, and I don't begrudge them for that. I just wish more developers would be willing to try something different this time, is all.
And I fully intend to play Flower in the next round of Console Swap. My Wii is going on loan in a few weeks: a few weeks after that it will be my turn to try the PS3, and you can bet I'll make him download the game first, as I'm quite intrigued by it. Thanks for the discussion, though: I enjoyed it.
