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Nintendo has lost the core market this generation

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"Mass market is about lemmings and sheeps..."

Projection. The core flocks around things that the gaming industry touts "HD! Blu-ray! Online!" The mass market has not flocked to any of those, and Nintendo made the Wii to conform to them. They did not conform to the Wii.

A flashy-first game is awesome when it comes out. A great-first game is awesome forever.

Plus, just for the hell of it: Kelly Brook at the 2008 BAFTAs

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Ail said:
RolStoppable said:
The way I see it, the core market has split up this generation with Nintendo keeping the profitable portion of it while Microsoft and Sony are stuck with gamers who demand so much that it is hard to make money.

Now, as usual, it's portrayed as if Nintendo is in trouble, despite all the evidence against it. Have people already forgotten about Sony's wand and Microsoft's Natal? Devices that were created in the hopes to leave the sinking core market ship or at least to get the feet on solid ground for once (i.e. to generate profits).

Times are changing and gaming does as well. The companies who are able to successfully transfer their core games to the new market that is currently build up (which includes core gamers who have accepted the change), have a bright future ahead. Those who fail or resist to adapt, will slowly die while only the strongest brands will survive.

I can't say that I would miss most of those companies, their games are becoming more and more alike and they mostly focus on genres I hardly care for in the first place. At least I can be sure that the best gaming company will continue to make great games in the future, because they are several steps ahead of anyone else.

Nintendo is on the right side of the current trend, while still pretty much everyone else is hoping that the dying core market can be saved, in order to continue to do business like it was done in the past 10-15 years. But if this core market really had a future, we wouldn't see Sony and Microsoft go out of their way and introduce motion control devices, an idea which they ridiculed two to three years ago.

There's just an issue with your argument.

Nintendo won't be the king of the holydays.

Modern Warfare 2 will be.......

As for the Wand and Natal, they are just marketing toys ( the same way every car constructor shows you a prototype every year of a car that will never take off). You have to show you are looking into that direction even if that isn't your focus...

Do you really think that Modern Warfare 2 will be bigger than the Wii, NSMB Wii, Wii Fit Plus and evergreens like Mario Kart Wii combined?

But anyway, that wasn't my argument. When I said future, I meant the next few years, not months. Also, Call of Duty falls under the category of "the strongest brands will survive".

That's a good point about the Wand and Natal. They are like most third party games on the Wii. No serious efforts, just games to show to their shareholders that they are giving the Wii "support".



Legend11 correctly predicted that GTA IV (360+PS3) would outsell SSBB. I was wrong.

A Biased Review Reloaded / Open Your Eyes / Switch Gamers Club

LordTheNightKnight said:
"Mass market is about lemmings and sheeps..."

Projection. The core flocks around things that the gaming industry touts "HD! Blu-ray! Online!" The mass market has not flocked to any of those, and Nintendo made the Wii to conform to them. They did not conform to the Wii.

Before claiming Nintendo is doing so well with the market market you should compare the adoption rate of the Wii with the one of the IPod or the IPhone. ( or even Blu Ray...)

The curves don't exactly move the same way.

Lets face it many are touting how much Nintendo is innovating but what innovation exactly have they released since Wii Fit ?

Answer : WSR and soon Wii Fit+. Go innovation ! Oh and a new Mario ( which ain't exactly a new franchise...)

 



PS3-Xbox360 gap : 1.5 millions and going up in PS3 favor !

PS3-Wii gap : 20 millions and going down !

Huh, thats funny, you make alot of sense, but I dont think you're completely right. I've been gaming since 1986 and for someone to tell me I'm a "casual" because I think the wii is a better overall system than say, my 360 is just crazy. I got my 360 because I kept hearing how thats where the hardcore games were. I heard that shit so much that eventually I said what the heck and got one. I got to say the 360 is an awsome system but there's more than enough "hardcore" games on the wii that people seem to think. who is this hardcore crowd you speak of?

Wichdog69

Ail said:
LordTheNightKnight said:
"Mass market is about lemmings and sheeps..."

Projection. The core flocks around things that the gaming industry touts "HD! Blu-ray! Online!" The mass market has not flocked to any of those, and Nintendo made the Wii to conform to them. They did not conform to the Wii.

Before claiming Nintendo is doing so well with the market market you should compare the adoption rate of the Wii with the one of the IPod or the IPhone. ( or even Blu Ray...)

The curves don't exactly move the same way.

Lets face it many are touting how much Nintendo is innovating but what innovation exactly have they released since Wii Fit ?

Answer : WSR and soon Wii Fit+. Go innovation ! Oh and a new Mario ( which ain't exactly a new franchise...)

This isn't the first time that I am seeing this "innovation" argument. It's quite new and somewhat strange. Apparently the people who used to complain about too many Wii peripherals are now criticizing the lack of them.

There's a lot of things which still haven't been done with the Wii and a new Mario is one of them. You shouldn't mock a game that will beat Modern Warfare 2 in lifetime sales.



Legend11 correctly predicted that GTA IV (360+PS3) would outsell SSBB. I was wrong.

A Biased Review Reloaded / Open Your Eyes / Switch Gamers Club

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RolStoppable said:
Ail said:
LordTheNightKnight said:
"Mass market is about lemmings and sheeps..."

Projection. The core flocks around things that the gaming industry touts "HD! Blu-ray! Online!" The mass market has not flocked to any of those, and Nintendo made the Wii to conform to them. They did not conform to the Wii.

Before claiming Nintendo is doing so well with the market market you should compare the adoption rate of the Wii with the one of the IPod or the IPhone. ( or even Blu Ray...)

The curves don't exactly move the same way.

Lets face it many are touting how much Nintendo is innovating but what innovation exactly have they released since Wii Fit ?

Answer : WSR and soon Wii Fit+. Go innovation ! Oh and a new Mario ( which ain't exactly a new franchise...)

This isn't the first time that I am seeing this "innovation" argument. It's quite new and somewhat strange. Apparently the people who used to complain about too many Wii peripherals are now criticizing the lack of them.

There's a lot of things which still haven't been done with the Wii and a new Mario is one of them. You shouldn't mock a game that will beat Modern Warfare 2 in lifetime sales.

I'm not asking about new peripherals. But just you know about new games, instead of rehashing the same 15 years old franchises ( which seem to be what the fans want when you see how many people are asking for the next Mario or Zelda anyway).

 



PS3-Xbox360 gap : 1.5 millions and going up in PS3 favor !

PS3-Wii gap : 20 millions and going down !

Ail said:
LordTheNightKnight said:
"Mass market is about lemmings and sheeps..."

Projection. The core flocks around things that the gaming industry touts "HD! Blu-ray! Online!" The mass market has not flocked to any of those, and Nintendo made the Wii to conform to them. They did not conform to the Wii.

Before claiming Nintendo is doing so well with the market market you should compare the adoption rate of the Wii with the one of the IPod or the IPhone. ( or even Blu Ray...)

The curves don't exactly move the same way.

Lets face it many are touting how much Nintendo is innovating but what innovation exactly have they released since Wii Fit ?

Answer : WSR and soon Wii Fit+. Go innovation ! Oh and a new Mario ( which ain't exactly a new franchise...)

 

Not only did you not address my comment, your points here are still wrong.

50+ million sales isn't doing well with the mass market (assuming you made a typo)? Bull. It's had a slowdown (like even the PS2 had at points). That doesn't mean they aren't doing well with the market. It does mean the mass market aren't sheep, or that wouldn't be happening. Nintendo is working on ways to please them, not making the mass market conform to what they make.

iPod took a few years to take off, so it doesn't have the same curve. iPhone was boosted in attention by the iPod. That would be comparable to the next Wii. Blu-ray is still niche. It's not mass market. It's had growth, but its best titles would be great on the Dreamcast, not compared to DVD sales. Blu-ray can't be compared when it's not mass market.

Innovation isn't relevant to this at all, and you're lying about the defintion (hint, it doesn't mean new franchises). It seems you're just trying to throw Wii hate talking points rather than actually discuss things.



A flashy-first game is awesome when it comes out. A great-first game is awesome forever.

Plus, just for the hell of it: Kelly Brook at the 2008 BAFTAs

18 years from now CoD will be fondly remembered and you'll be able to download it on the Samsung Pal-station Network, meanwhile NSMB 2 will sell 50 million.

That's Nintendo, that's core.



Nov 2016 - NES outsells PS1 (JP)

Don't Play Stationary 4 ever. Switch!

This isnít 2007 anymore, simply pointing to the Wiiís phenomenal sales is no longer enough to justify the console. Record breaking sales donít give you a console that can move third party software. Record breaking sales donít give you a console with serious third party support. Record breaking sales donít give you a console with the games you want.

Most of you who are content with the Wiiís current status are either casual gamers or most likely people who prefer the 360/PS3 as their console of choice and see the Wii as only having to be a novelty supplemental console in order to make you happy. Or perhaps youíre one of those of the defeatist attitude of accepting having to own three consoles every generation to compensate for the fact that no one console has done it right.

For every impressive release for the Wii there are six more on every other platform that can be pointed out; and you can boast about Monster Hunter 3 when it sells as well as Monster Hunter Freedom Unite, you can boast about Final Fantasy Crystal Chronicles when it sells as much as the Final Fantasy Main series, you can boast about Dragon Quest X when it sells as much as VIII did on the PS2, you can boast about Tales of Graces when it sells as much as Tales of Vesperia or any of its PS2 predecessors. Until any of that happens, each of these exclusives will just serve as lessons to third party developers of what console not to give support. The Wii has for the most part lost all face with the conventional gaming industry. Third Party games are dying in sales on the Wii. Support for the Wii has stagnated and shows little sign of improving no matter how many niche titles that will be lucky to break 500k you bring up. Right now the PSP is getting more worthwhile games than the Wii and is its greatest threat in stealing Japanese third party support.

If youíre content with the way things are for the Wii, thatís one thing, but to argue that things donít need to get any better or canít be improved is just asinine.

Nintendo is going to need to expand its home consoleís demographic appeal and third party viability next generation or else they could very well lose what foothold they have in casual gaming as well. Preach the glory of Blue Ocean and disruption all you want, but its only a matter of time before the competition finds that balance between blue and red waters and the value of Nintendoís disruption as long since been negated by the growing appeal of HD gaming as the mainstay of conventional gaming this generation.

The point here is not doom & gloom. The point here is not to bash the Wii or blame Nintendo. The point is to acknowledge that Nintendo needs to take this opportunity to improve and expand. The strategy of being an ďandĒ console and not a ďorĒ console was, like the rest of the Wii, a means of playing it safe when there was no guarantee the Wii would do any better than the Gamecube. No one is suggesting the next Nintendo console be a 360 or PS3, but there is no reason it canít strive for more than the Wii or be a viable competitor in appealing to casual, core and hardcore markets.

Yea, I agree. But they haven't lost anything they weren't already losing. What they have gained, on the other hand, is an ocean of profit even bigger than the core marked.