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fatslob-:O said:
Bofferbrauer2 said:

1. Let me just quote the relevant sentence in your link, which is the very first line: "The UK is “indefinitely committed” to the Irish backstop if it comes into force". If it comes to force, which it only does if there's a deal on it. In a no deal scenario, no backstop either way. But yeah, if there is a deal, then the UK will stay in the trade union anyway, which renders the backstop pretty much moot.

4+5. There are ways to block them, like destroying the road and building a hill instead to make it impassable for vehicles (something that has been done countless times in Luxembourg when they rerouted some streets to go around town and cities instead of straight through them, so that shouldn't be much of a problem to do). They can always be rebuilt after reunification. And since these weapons would be smuggled into te UK and not the other way around, it's the UK who would need stonger security there, not Ireland. In other words, the UK is fucking themselves as there's no good way out for them here. Either the Troubles respark, or Northern Ireland votes to leave the UK, or first the Troubles and then the vote, but in either way a British NI is fucked. And they have to keep NI as close as possible, as a vote in NI will also definitely spur one in Scotland again. So, what will it be? Prison your fellow Scottish and Northern Irish citizen into your country and face the violence of that decision, or let them go, fully knowing that it will cripple the UK.

About Hammond, it doesn't matter if he follows UK government stance or not, as he's just explaining the WTO rules there which the UK are forced to follow.

And about your smuggling, lol. UK with what goods will return that favor? Those blocked in Calais and Rotterdam because border checks are going on forever, delaying production so much that BMW already said they will shut down their Mini production plant for an entire month because the parts will not flow in time anymore to make the production go as it did before Brexit?Almost all UK goods need some parts from factories outside the UK, and on food the UK can only produce about 60% of what it consumes. There's just no way that the UK will turn the tide anytime soon.

Plus, like I said before, if the UK gets caught smuggling you can bet your ass nobody in the entire world would want to trade with you anymore until that practice stops

4/5. Breaking roads won't be enough since smuggling can occur in ports, airports or railways. Hills ? They can still be destroyed or one can go around them so it's pretty clear that Ireland will need armed guards to prevent breaching especially when there's not any other realistic solution in place with over 200 crossing points. Don't worry about the security of the UK, in fact most of the arms that the Irish paramilitaries procured were from Syria when they brokered a deal with colonel Gaddafi to have them shipped directly to Northern Ireland and I doubt Ireland is keen on letting their civilians have military grade weapons so the potential for arms smuggling through the Irish border seems remote. If the worst comes to it then the UK will just increase the police force to control any violent dissidents and that's a realistic option since it's a lot easier to enforce authority over a smaller area ... 

@Bold Or Ireland can just leave the EU single market if they really care about Northern Ireland ... 

As for the rest, I don't think you understand the UK very well. Northern Ireland is not even in the same situation as Scotland since the former requires that it's own Secretary of State to call for a vote. Despite your constant fear mongering though the UK is a more functional union than the EU is and Scotland's own nationalist party (SNP) got decimated in the last general election (they lost 21 seats) AFTER the referendum so the Scots clearly aren't all that impressed with the EU to dump the UK ... (the strength of the union will be tested again during the May local elections in Northern Ireland and I suspect that the DUP will make some gains since they secured a billion quids in funding for Northern Ireland in a coalition with the Conservative party) 

The ports in Calais and Rotterdam don't block goods coming from other EU members so the if the UK has a backdoor then the same applies. While the UK's own domestic production may not be able to undercut the EU, I'm pretty sure their imported goods will and trade surpluses will start to build up for the UK ...  

It's going to be a day of reckoning once the EU and Ireland turn against each other ...

4+5: Anything that arrives in a port or airport in Ireland gets checked by customs, even if the goods come from the EU. The reason is that ships are huge and and not all goods are guaranteed to come from the same source. Also, in case of fresh foods and livestock, everything needs to be controlled no matter where it comes from due to hygiene and disease prevention (that's basically true for every island as they get counted as a whole in these scenarios, but apart from Ireland there are just a couple more islands where it applies, Borneo, Cyprus, Haiti, Papua and Timor are the only other ones that come to mind).

Hills can be destroyed... but having the UK destroying hills in Ireland would be qualified as an invasion, as they have no right whatsoever to be there. So forget about the UK even trying to do that (in case you didn't understand, just on the Ireland side would the road be covered with a hill to male it impracticable, unless the UK would want to do the same on their part of the road).

In other words, roads will be the only viable points of entry for your smuggling. You can always try off-road, but since the Trucks are not built for going oof-road you'll have to do it with SUVs - and they transport considerably less than a Truck. So unless they smuggle high-value contraband, smuggling by SUV will only amount to a drop in the ocean.

@underlined: You got a source for that? Also, you think that's still true almost 10 years after Gadaffi's death? Besides, it doesn't need military grade weaponry for guerilla tactics, plus most civilian versions of military guns can be converted into military grade by halfway skilled gunsmiths. But in any case, gun smuggling was just meant as a counterargument and showing that smuggling can go both ways. You didn't understand that, you failed the test.

@bold: Or UK lets Ireland reunify if they care for the inhabitants of Northern Ireland. Problem solved

Me, fear mongering? You are the doomsayer here, telling how supposedly Ireland and the EU will go down in flames. That's the hypocrisy of most Brexiteers by the way as far as I found out, as any Brexiteer I met or talked to acted like doom and gloom would hit everybody, but not the UK if they leave.

@italic: You seriously need some lessons in macroeconomics. I won't even try to teach you there anymore, having tried the last half dozen of posts or so.

About the last line, oh yeah it will. And since the Last Judgement is based on the thinking that the dead will raise beforehand, it will only happen after a Zombie apocalypse, so basically never  



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Just found this on Youtube: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SRMwCz_Q9b4

Looks like everybody fears the effects of Brexit on both sides of the Northern Irish border - except the DUP leadership.



EU is signing a $22+ billion a year free-trade agreement with New Zealand.... and the UK is going to be left out of it.



Number of days to reach 50M from 40M : 198 days
Number of days to reach 60M from 50M : 187 days
Number of days to reach 70M from 60M : 175 days
Number of days to reach 80M from 70M : 227 days

Necro-bump this 2020: http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/thread.php?id=229249

Bofferbrauer2 said:

4+5: Anything that arrives in a port or airport in Ireland gets checked by customs, even if the goods come from the EU. The reason is that ships are huge and and not all goods are guaranteed to come from the same source. Also, in case of fresh foods and livestock, everything needs to be controlled no matter where it comes from due to hygiene and disease prevention (that's basically true for every island as they get counted as a whole in these scenarios, but apart from Ireland there are just a couple more islands where it applies, Borneo, Cyprus, Haiti, Papua and Timor are the only other ones that come to mind).

Hills can be destroyed... but having the UK destroying hills in Ireland would be qualified as an invasion, as they have no right whatsoever to be there. So forget about the UK even trying to do that (in case you didn't understand, just on the Ireland side would the road be covered with a hill to male it impracticable, unless the UK would want to do the same on their part of the road).

In other words, roads will be the only viable points of entry for your smuggling. You can always try off-road, but since the Trucks are not built for going oof-road you'll have to do it with SUVs - and they transport considerably less than a Truck. So unless they smuggle high-value contraband, smuggling by SUV will only amount to a drop in the ocean.

@underlined: You got a source for that? Also, you think that's still true almost 10 years after Gadaffi's death? Besides, it doesn't need military grade weaponry for guerilla tactics, plus most civilian versions of military guns can be converted into military grade by halfway skilled gunsmiths. But in any case, gun smuggling was just meant as a counterargument and showing that smuggling can go both ways. You didn't understand that, you failed the test.

@bold: Or UK lets Ireland reunify if they care for the inhabitants of Northern Ireland. Problem solved

Me, fear mongering? You are the doomsayer here, telling how supposedly Ireland and the EU will go down in flames. That's the hypocrisy of most Brexiteers by the way as far as I found out, as any Brexiteer I met or talked to acted like doom and gloom would hit everybody, but not the UK if they leave.

@italic: You seriously need some lessons in macroeconomics. I won't even try to teach you there anymore, having tried the last half dozen of posts or so.

About the last line, oh yeah it will. And since the Last Judgement is based on the thinking that the dead will raise beforehand, it will only happen after a Zombie apocalypse, so basically never  

4/5. EU import procedures only apply to non-member states so they do not apply to any member states even if they arrive from ferries via Ireland. As far as hygiene or disease prevention, it is the member states job to make sure that livestock meets these regulations and not the EU so in the case of non-compliance the EU will suspend the said member from participating in the customs union ... 

UK officials wouldn't be the ones destroying the hills, it would be most likely Irish nationalists so one way or another Ireland is going to have to arm themselves against breaches because trying to create a near impenetrable hill at a length of nearly 500km isn't viable ... (those who live near the border are mostly Irish nationalists communities after all so British unionists at the east couldn't give a shit about what happens at the border) 

As for using SUVs to get around the hill, they could instead just use some 4x4 trucks and have transport trucks parked at both sides of the road so hills would only delay the inevitable by a few minutes at most. Leaving blocked crossing points unattended would be disaster for Ireland or the EU and as I've clearly laid out the case against you it's not an option for them ... 

As for sources here you go where you can start from page 9 of the document under the title 'Arms'. This is coming straight out of Ulster University's CAIN website. The summary is basically this, arms trafficking in the Republic of Ireland wasn't all that successful (I doubt it would be considering the security near the border) since Irish authorities often cracked down on arms dealing so Irish paramilitaries mostly relied on direct shipment of arms from Libya to Northern Ireland ... (this is a much more plausible theory since the majority of the weapons were confiscated within Northern Ireland rather than the Republic of Ireland)

@Bold LOL, no they can't. The civilian versions of these small firearms have very different internal components compared to their military counterparts. Gunsmiths would practically have to create a new firearm from scratch to match the military versions and they'd have to do it with CNC milling machines which cost an upwards of tens of thousands of dollars so it's not realistic to acquire military grade weapons this way but even explaining all that I have yet to divulge other issues such as magazines or explosive weapons. Your gun smuggling argument doesn't amount to much since they usually didn't arrive at the border but from the Celtic Sea to Northern Ireland ... 

The problem with your proposal is that most of the Northern Ireland representatives prefer to stay with the UK. How about the border communities just move to the Republic of Ireland instead and leave the unionists alone ? They can have 'reunification' without needing the land itself if they want to so badly ... 

You are fear mongering for the most part especially since your precious union just had another (Greenland being the first) member left. I didn't say that the UK wouldn't face issues in the process so that's just your projection but I merely pointed out that the UK as a union is in a far stronger state than the EU ... 

LMAO, what I said about the ports from the EU not checking the ferries from other member states remains true and has always been true so you strong arming me into thinking otherwise won't work when you don't even have a source claiming otherwise. I know more of the so called 'macroeconomics' than you do despite the fact that I've only taken a single course in 'microeconomics' in post-secondary school and you're failing to grasp even the basics behind the idea of smuggling which is to normalize supply and demand in a market by bringing in cheaper goods or services from another market ... (the incentive behind smuggling is to decrease demand by being able to bring in lower cost contraband to compete against domestic supply) 

The EU won't take no for an answer from Ireland no matter how much it cries after no deal ...  



Bofferbrauer2 said:

Just found this on Youtube: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SRMwCz_Q9b4

Looks like everybody fears the effects of Brexit on both sides of the Northern Irish border - except the DUP leadership.

Ugh, The Guardian is not a good media outlet.  Where the Daily Mail in the UK is an awful right wing biased and often incorrect news source, the Guardian is just the same but Left instead of right.

They use the same tabloid style unsubstantiated personal hit pieces twinned with scaremongering opinion pieces.  Never use them as a source for anything.



Sony want to make money by selling art, Nintendo want to make money by selling fun, Microsoft want to make money.

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only777 said:
Bofferbrauer2 said:

Just found this on Youtube: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SRMwCz_Q9b4

Looks like everybody fears the effects of Brexit on both sides of the Northern Irish border - except the DUP leadership.

Ugh, The Guardian is not a good media outlet.  Where the Daily Mail in the UK is an awful right wing biased and often incorrect news source, the Guardian is just the same but Left instead of right.

They use the same tabloid style unsubstantiated personal hit pieces twinned with scaremongering opinion pieces.  Never use them as a source for anything.

so, which news sources do you recommend?



Lafiel said:

so, which news sources do you recommend?

Sad truth is, there aren't really any unbiased mainstream news sources in the UK; it's divided between a small handful of heavily left-wing outlets (The Guardian, the Daily Mirror, The Independent, the BBC to some extent) and everything else is heavily right-wing.



only777 said:
Bofferbrauer2 said:

Just found this on Youtube: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SRMwCz_Q9b4

Looks like everybody fears the effects of Brexit on both sides of the Northern Irish border - except the DUP leadership.

Ugh, The Guardian is not a good media outlet.  Where the Daily Mail in the UK is an awful right wing biased and often incorrect news source, the Guardian is just the same but Left instead of right.

They use the same tabloid style unsubstantiated personal hit pieces twinned with scaremongering opinion pieces.  Never use them as a source for anything.

They really aren't that bad, and nowhere near the levels of the Daily Mail when it comes to using factual and properly sourced information (of which I'm not sure the Daily Mail even bother with). The Guardian have a definite left wing bias and have a strong tendency towards emotionally charged words but their investigative pieces tend to be well researched and they'll generally use factually correct and sourced information.

There are a lot worse publications out there.



JRPGfan said:
Theres barely a month left now.....

I suspect the UK is just going to hard crash out of the EU.
A boarder wall will be built in Ireland, and scotland seeks independence.

If I was a UK citizen I wouldnt have any confidence in my PM anymore, magically solveing the issues when she just wasted 2,5years.

Those of us with out rose tinted glasses knew the were going to be problems from the first week following the vote when the back peddling had already started and Cameron fled to Spain, fact is only one way was going to competently handle this situation but the PM was too scared to do it and wanted to come across as some tough guy MP and failed spectacularly to the point Corbyn has barely had to do anything but let her hang herself even with the entire Tory media spin doctors trying to bring him down they've collapse in huge fashion. What the daft bat should have done is have all these current talks before triggering article 51 while further research is done once all the information is on deck she should have come back to the people with all the information in and had a second referendum if yes then she triggers A51 with a plan in hand.

At this point I wouldn't be surprised if they extend the period and eventually do a U turn.



For a good laugh: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gDxBN1y5C8o



Number of days to reach 50M from 40M : 198 days
Number of days to reach 60M from 50M : 187 days
Number of days to reach 70M from 60M : 175 days
Number of days to reach 80M from 70M : 227 days

Necro-bump this 2020: http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/thread.php?id=229249