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Trump's Personal Lawyer And Campaign Manager Both Going To Prison

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Cubedramirez said:
Manafort was found guilty of filing a false tax return in each of the years from 2010 through 2014, as well as not filing a form in 2012 to report a foreign bank account as required. He was also convicted of two instances of bank fraud, related to a $3.4 million loan from Citizens Bank and a $1 million loan from Banc of California. - If you think that's going to bring Trump down, I've got secret documents to sell ya.

Oh and if you think Cohen is going to do produce anything legitimate I have another cache of documents to sell you, all authentic I promise!

I also hate to tell you legal experts this, you're being told by people emotionally and intellectually suspect that certain activities are crimes. To justify their claims they have to stretch and modify the facts in order to cater to those of you who have an emotional scar from 2016 that will only heal is Trump is brought down. However, if you do ever realize how insane and clickbait-ish the endless parade of speculation is and how it's done nothing but constantly feed into your desire for revenge for 2016, you can join the rest of us in this unprecedented economic and optimism boom.

I wonder if even that reality angers people. The fact they hate him so much, they hate everything about him and that the country is doing so damn well and benefiting from his tenure.

1. These charges are secondary.  They came out as part of the investigation.  They weren't manufactured for the investigation. 

2. Manafort has another trial soon that is more directly related to the campaign. 

3. The investigation is being led by Republicans and their appointees, not the DNC and the Democrats.

4. The economy has been doing damn well for years.  This is not new. Don't go claiming others are being blinded and then make a blind statement.



Massimus - "Trump already has democrat support."

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SpokenTruth said:
Cubedramirez said:
Manafort was found guilty of filing a false tax return in each of the years from 2010 through 2014, as well as not filing a form in 2012 to report a foreign bank account as required. He was also convicted of two instances of bank fraud, related to a $3.4 million loan from Citizens Bank and a $1 million loan from Banc of California. - If you think that's going to bring Trump down, I've got secret documents to sell ya.

Oh and if you think Cohen is going to do produce anything legitimate I have another cache of documents to sell you, all authentic I promise!

I also hate to tell you legal experts this, you're being told by people emotionally and intellectually suspect that certain activities are crimes. To justify their claims they have to stretch and modify the facts in order to cater to those of you who have an emotional scar from 2016 that will only heal is Trump is brought down. However, if you do ever realize how insane and clickbait-ish the endless parade of speculation is and how it's done nothing but constantly feed into your desire for revenge for 2016, you can join the rest of us in this unprecedented economic and optimism boom.

I wonder if even that reality angers people. The fact they hate him so much, they hate everything about him and that the country is doing so damn well and benefiting from his tenure.

1. These charges are secondary.  They came out as part of the investigation.  They weren't manufactured for the investigation. 

2. Manafort has another trial soon that is more directly related to the campaign. 

3. The investigation is being led by Republicans and their appointees, not the DNC and the Democrats.

4. The economy has been doing damn well for years.  This is not new. Don't go claiming others are being blinded and then make a blind statement.

Well, if that's not the most ignorant statement I've read in a while.. The Economy doing damn well... Don't get me wrong, your avoidance of the fact the charges against Manafort for both trails have nothing to do with Trump or Russia, your belief that the investigation under Trump by Republican careerist somehow makes spying on a opposition candidate from the previous administration justifiable (source: James Clapper testimony), but your economy statement... Jesus, that's some biblical level of ignorance if I've ever read one.

Can't expect anything less from here on out I guess. 

I won't go into detail because honestly I don't think discussing durable goods and hard goods orders, or business investment, capital repatriation, confidence and optimism indexes would have any impact on your convincing argument that the economy was doing "damn well".

If you're anything close to intellectually honest then you can take your grossly ignorant self over to the Bureau of Economic Analysis to educate yourself on whether or not the economy was doing "damn well" for years.  

I guess when you're a leftist avg 2.2% yearly GDP growth is doing damn well... 

Simply wow...

P.S. The previous admin stated repeatedly that there was NO WAY Trump could ever create an environment where 10 million jobs would be created.  He's not even two years into it and 4 million plus have been created.... 





Machiavellian said:

EricHiggin
Comey did admit he told the President, but gave the reasoning I provided as to why he didn't want to tell the public. If Comey's opinion of Trump doesn't matter, why put him on TV, the former head of the FBI, an evidence based individual, and have him constantly talk about how he felt about Trump? This wasn't some new TV show, it's accusing the President of firing the head of the FBI, supposedly because he's a Russian spy/puppet with no worthy direct evidence.


Ok, lets just back up here for a second. Since we are on Comey, you stated in your previous post that Comey was asked by Trump to say he was not personally part of the Russia investigation publically but Comey refused because he could be later. You state that Comey has done this before but I ask you when he did this for Clinton what happen. You remember when he said the investigation was done but then had to reopen it back up when they got that laptop full of emails. How did that go down. Why would he make the same mistake twice.

So it seems you are equating Comey decision on not publicly putting Trump in the clear in an ongoing investigation that is not done but involves already people personally under Trump to being part of Comey opinion on Trump. Am I correct with this assumption. I just want to make sure I understand where you are going with whatever personal opinion Comey has or had concerning Trump compared to how we got here today with Mueller investigation directly against Trump.

Also you nor I have absolutely no clue what information Mueller has on Trump personal involvement in the Russian meddling. I highly doubt you will see anything until he makes his report especially since his department seems to be air tight when it comes to leaks.

Well he said she was off the hook, and then on the hook again, and then off the hook, even though it seemed clear she should have been on the hook. What's the problem with this? If he realized he made a mistake and knew how to fix it going forward, then why didn't he make it clear to Trump that at the immediate present, he wasn't under investigation, but since the investigation was ongoing, he obviously couldn't know if Trump would end up involved. Odds are he knew this might anger Trump and get him fired, I'd assume, so he just told Trump he wasn't being investigated. Which is why Trump wouldn't be able to understand why Comey wouldn't let the public know. Comey made it clear this is how it went down, and had no problem telling the public through the media that Trump could become a suspect, but didn't tell Trump. He's the President. Comey's job is to inform the President as clearly as humanly possible, and at the highest level, since he was the head of the FBI. 

No leaks? What about recently with Manafort and Cohen?

Machiavellian said:

Machiavellian said:

What makes you believe Trump is innocent of working with Russia. If anything, everyone of the people who were asked if they had any previous contact with Russia during his campaign have been found lying. Flynn, Session, Trump JR and Krusher, Manford hell you name it. Just maybe if their reflex was not to lie first and be proven guilty first they maybe you would have a point.

EricHiggin
You mean the people who were legally aloud to have contact with the Russians, but were being demonized for doing so because Hillary and the Dems said they are the epitome of evil, since they hacked her server and found a tonne of dirt? The same Hillary and Dems who helped the Russians to acquire a sizable amount of American uranium not all that long ago?

Yes, I mean exactly those same people. You know the one who got fired because he lied about the meeting. The other guy who recused himself from the investigation because he lied about the meetings. I guess if they had legal rights to contact and have these meetings why did they have to lie about it. Maybe you should ask yourself why they lied in the first place if they were in their rights to have these meetings. So as always we end up exactly where we continue to go with this administrations. Everyone lies until caught then they have to pay the price, unless you are the president. Again I see you are throwing Hillary and the Dems as your scapegoat but not putting the blame directly on the decisions made by the people in question. Its everyone else fault besides them. You even threw in the nice uranium conspiracy theory in there as well, nice touch.

As I explained earlier, when every Dem and lefty and the majority of the media are after you and are willing to spin everything you do or say to try and make a fool of you, what tends to happen is those 'victims' tend to lie, since they are, or would be, lied about anyway. Maybe the left and the media should try to be honest for a while, and see if anything changes, because it just might. You don't know if you don't try. Why bother though right? Trump and his people are liars, because they just are. Everyone knows it just because. Trump = Hitler. It's basic math...



The Canadian National Anthem According To Justin Trudeau

 

Oh planet Earth! The home of native lands, 
True social law, in all of us demand.
With cattle farts, we view sea rise,
Our North sinking slowly.
From far and snide, oh planet Earth, 
Our healthcare is yours free!
Science save our land, harnessing the breeze,
Oh planet Earth, smoke weed and ferment yeast.
Oh planet Earth, ell gee bee queue and tee.

Cubedramirez said:
SpokenTruth said:

1. These charges are secondary.  They came out as part of the investigation.  They weren't manufactured for the investigation. 

2. Manafort has another trial soon that is more directly related to the campaign. 

3. The investigation is being led by Republicans and their appointees, not the DNC and the Democrats.

4. The economy has been doing damn well for years.  This is not new. Don't go claiming others are being blinded and then make a blind statement.

Well, if that's not the most ignorant statement I've read in a while.. The Economy doing damn well... Don't get me wrong, your avoidance of the fact the charges against Manafort for both trails have nothing to do with Trump or Russia, your belief that the investigation under Trump by Republican careerist somehow makes spying on a opposition candidate from the previous administration justifiable (source: James Clapper testimony), but your economy statement... Jesus, that's some biblical level of ignorance if I've ever read one.

Can't expect anything less from here on out I guess. 

I won't go into detail because honestly I don't think discussing durable goods and hard goods orders, or business investment, capital repatriation, confidence and optimism indexes would have any impact on your convincing argument that the economy was doing "damn well".

If you're anything close to intellectually honest then you can take your grossly ignorant self over to the Bureau of Economic Analysis to educate yourself on whether or not the economy was doing "damn well" for years.  

I guess when you're a leftist avg 2.2% yearly GDP growth is doing damn well... 

Simply wow...

P.S. The previous admin stated repeatedly that there was NO WAY Trump could ever create an environment where 10 million jobs would be created.  He's not even two years into it and 4 million plus have been created....

You understand what a trend is, correct? We are largely continuing a trend that began after the last recession.

 

As for the 10 million jobs in his first term promise, he's not going to be able to hit that.  You just said 2 years and 4 million jobs.  That's a rate that would produce 8 million in 4 years.  And his job growth rate is no greater than under Obama.  In fact, his actual promise was 25 million jobs over 10 years.  At 2 million per year, he will be short by 5 million jobs.

 



Massimus - "Trump already has democrat support."

EricHiggin said:
Machiavellian said:

EricHiggin
Comey did admit he told the President, but gave the reasoning I provided as to why he didn't want to tell the public. If Comey's opinion of Trump doesn't matter, why put him on TV, the former head of the FBI, an evidence based individual, and have him constantly talk about how he felt about Trump? This wasn't some new TV show, it's accusing the President of firing the head of the FBI, supposedly because he's a Russian spy/puppet with no worthy direct evidence.


Ok, lets just back up here for a second. Since we are on Comey, you stated in your previous post that Comey was asked by Trump to say he was not personally part of the Russia investigation publically but Comey refused because he could be later. You state that Comey has done this before but I ask you when he did this for Clinton what happen. You remember when he said the investigation was done but then had to reopen it back up when they got that laptop full of emails. How did that go down. Why would he make the same mistake twice.

So it seems you are equating Comey decision on not publicly putting Trump in the clear in an ongoing investigation that is not done but involves already people personally under Trump to being part of Comey opinion on Trump. Am I correct with this assumption. I just want to make sure I understand where you are going with whatever personal opinion Comey has or had concerning Trump compared to how we got here today with Mueller investigation directly against Trump.

Also you nor I have absolutely no clue what information Mueller has on Trump personal involvement in the Russian meddling. I highly doubt you will see anything until he makes his report especially since his department seems to be air tight when it comes to leaks.

Well he said she was off the hook, and then on the hook again, and then off the hook, even though it seemed clear she should have been on the hook. What's the problem with this? If he realized he made a mistake and knew how to fix it going forward, then why didn't he make it clear to Trump that at the immediate present, he wasn't under investigation, but since the investigation was ongoing, he obviously couldn't know if Trump would end up involved. Odds are he knew this might anger Trump and get him fired, I'd assume, so he just told Trump he wasn't being investigated. Which is why Trump wouldn't be able to understand why Comey wouldn't let the public know. Comey made it clear this is how it went down, and had no problem telling the public through the media that Trump could become a suspect, but didn't tell Trump. He's the President. Comey's job is to inform the President as clearly as humanly possible, and at the highest level, since he was the head of the FBI. 

No leaks? What about recently with Manafort and Cohen?

 

Machiavellian said:

Machiavellian said:

What makes you believe Trump is innocent of working with Russia. If anything, everyone of the people who were asked if they had any previous contact with Russia during his campaign have been found lying. Flynn, Session, Trump JR and Krusher, Manford hell you name it. Just maybe if their reflex was not to lie first and be proven guilty first they maybe you would have a point.

EricHiggin
You mean the people who were legally aloud to have contact with the Russians, but were being demonized for doing so because Hillary and the Dems said they are the epitome of evil, since they hacked her server and found a tonne of dirt? The same Hillary and Dems who helped the Russians to acquire a sizable amount of American uranium not all that long ago?

Yes, I mean exactly those same people. You know the one who got fired because he lied about the meeting. The other guy who recused himself from the investigation because he lied about the meetings. I guess if they had legal rights to contact and have these meetings why did they have to lie about it. Maybe you should ask yourself why they lied in the first place if they were in their rights to have these meetings. So as always we end up exactly where we continue to go with this administrations. Everyone lies until caught then they have to pay the price, unless you are the president. Again I see you are throwing Hillary and the Dems as your scapegoat but not putting the blame directly on the decisions made by the people in question. Its everyone else fault besides them. You even threw in the nice uranium conspiracy theory in there as well, nice touch.

As I explained earlier, when every Dem and lefty and the majority of the media are after you and are willing to spin everything you do or say to try and make a fool of you, what tends to happen is those 'victims' tend to lie, since they are, or would be, lied about anyway. Maybe the left and the media should try to be honest for a while, and see if anything changes, because it just might. You don't know if you don't try. Why bother though right? Trump and his people are liars, because they just are. Everyone knows it just because. Trump = Hitler. It's basic math...

As for leaks from the Manafort or Cohen trials, you show me any evidence where anything came from Mueller team.No, I am sorry but that is just another excuse.  It would be different if Trump behaved differently before becoming president.  It would be different if he had a career of being honest but that is not the case even from his own mouth. Trump lying has been his MO for decades.  There are piles or cases where the man shows at every turn he cannot tell the truth no matter what the occasion is. You really should stop trying to find a defense for the man's constant lying it really do not help your case. 

You should really listen to yourself.  It's everyone else fault for Trump lying.  Everyone seems to be at fault when something goes wrong but Trump.  

No Trump is not a liar just because.  This is where I believe your problem comes from.  Trump is a liar because its been proven countless times that he lies.  I never compared Trump to Hitler, I compare him to your average con man.  He tells you want you want to hear.  He will make up whatever story that satisfy what you believe or think and he will take you to school when you blink.  Trump probably only wish he could be even close to Hitler.  The man is not anywhere close to being in that league of villains.

Still, if you are investigating or could investigate your boss, why would you need to make anything public until after the investigation.  Trump was already out of line for asking for this since he is suppose to separate himself from the investigation.  In other words he was trying to influence public opinion before any results were found.  The same way that he continue to do today.  Instead of letting things run their course he wants to continue to put himself within it.  Its his constant butting in that probably has fueled things to where they are today.  With the lies and butting in, he continue to throw more logs on the fire keeping things hot but knowing you, it's everyone else fault.

As for Manafort and Cohen trial, why don't you show me any leaks that came from Mueller team.



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Machiavellian said:
EricHiggin said:

Well he said she was off the hook, and then on the hook again, and then off the hook, even though it seemed clear she should have been on the hook. What's the problem with this? If he realized he made a mistake and knew how to fix it going forward, then why didn't he make it clear to Trump that at the immediate present, he wasn't under investigation, but since the investigation was ongoing, he obviously couldn't know if Trump would end up involved. Odds are he knew this might anger Trump and get him fired, I'd assume, so he just told Trump he wasn't being investigated. Which is why Trump wouldn't be able to understand why Comey wouldn't let the public know. Comey made it clear this is how it went down, and had no problem telling the public through the media that Trump could become a suspect, but didn't tell Trump. He's the President. Comey's job is to inform the President as clearly as humanly possible, and at the highest level, since he was the head of the FBI. 

No leaks? What about recently with Manafort and Cohen?

As I explained earlier, when every Dem and lefty and the majority of the media are after you and are willing to spin everything you do or say to try and make a fool of you, what tends to happen is those 'victims' tend to lie, since they are, or would be, lied about anyway. Maybe the left and the media should try to be honest for a while, and see if anything changes, because it just might. You don't know if you don't try. Why bother though right? Trump and his people are liars, because they just are. Everyone knows it just because. Trump = Hitler. It's basic math...

As for leaks from the Manafort or Cohen trials, you show me any evidence where anything came from Mueller team.No, I am sorry but that is just another excuse.  It would be different if Trump behaved differently before becoming president.  It would be different if he had a career of being honest but that is not the case even from his own mouth. Trump lying has been his MO for decades.  There are piles or cases where the man shows at every turn he cannot tell the truth no matter what the occasion is. You really should stop trying to find a defense for the man's constant lying it really do not help your case. 

You should really listen to yourself.  It's everyone else fault for Trump lying.  Everyone seems to be at fault when something goes wrong but Trump.  

No Trump is not a liar just because.  This is where I believe your problem comes from.  Trump is a liar because its been proven countless times that he lies.  I never compared Trump to Hitler, I compare him to your average con man.  He tells you want you want to hear.  He will make up whatever story that satisfy what you believe or think and he will take you to school when you blink.  Trump probably only wish he could be even close to Hitler.  The man is not anywhere close to being in that league of villains.

Still, if you are investigating or could investigate your boss, why would you need to make anything public until after the investigation.  Trump was already out of line for asking for this since he is suppose to separate himself from the investigation.  In other words he was trying to influence public opinion before any results were found.  The same way that he continue to do today.  Instead of letting things run their course he wants to continue to put himself within it.  Its his constant butting in that probably has fueled things to where they are today.  With the lies and butting in, he continue to throw more logs on the fire keeping things hot but knowing you, it's everyone else fault.

As for Manafort and Cohen trial, why don't you show me any leaks that came from Mueller team.

https://wjla.com/news/nation-world/25-leaks-about-the-mueller-investigation-and-the-problems-they-may-cause

https://www.cnn.com/2018/05/24/politics/special-counsel-leaks-klayman/index.html

http://www.latimes.com/la-ol-enter-the-fray-the-mueller-questions-leak-1525186933-htmlstory.html

https://www.politico.com/story/2018/05/14/mueller-leaks-hearing-trump-586555

Plenty of reasons that sure make it look like there have been plenty of leaks from Muellers team, whether the leaks went straight to the media or through another source. No hard evidence really at this point in time though, but you don't name your sources when those sources are helping your agenda behind the scenes. Considering his team has gone out of their way to push back court dates, and try to weasel their way out of hearings because they are so honest and can't be bothered by outside matters, since the investigation is so much more important. Sounds quite familiar, like Trump saying he's innocent and doesn't want to be bothered by outside matters like the media and left, constantly bashing him for something that has nothing to do with him specifically, and that it's also holding back his political agenda which is much more important.

The unbiased media however, goes out of their way to bash Trump because it's quite clear that he's guilty, yet makes it seem like Mueller and his people were appointed by the Lord our God to speak nothing but the truth, untouchable by evil. More than a few people have already been booted off Muellers team since it's inception for abusing their power. Talking about track records...

How about the media? How squeaky clean have their stories been over the decades? I'd bet they lie just as much if not more than Trump does. That doesn't matter though because the media said Trump was bad and a liar, and their the truth tellers, so no point in looking into their own character. They aren't the President either, so what power do they really have, and why care about them right? It's not like people go to them to find out who's ahead in the political polls, how much wine a day is the healthiest, and weather or not it's going to rain.

I also am having a hard time differentiating between what is fact and what is excuses. For some reason it seems like the only thing I can come up with are excuses, and the only thing you can come up with is fact. I would have thought by now at least one thing I've mentioned was more than just personal bias, and at least one thing you've mentioned wouldn't be solid fact...



The Canadian National Anthem According To Justin Trudeau

 

Oh planet Earth! The home of native lands, 
True social law, in all of us demand.
With cattle farts, we view sea rise,
Our North sinking slowly.
From far and snide, oh planet Earth, 
Our healthcare is yours free!
Science save our land, harnessing the breeze,
Oh planet Earth, smoke weed and ferment yeast.
Oh planet Earth, ell gee bee queue and tee.

EricHiggin said:
Machiavellian said:

As for leaks from the Manafort or Cohen trials, you show me any evidence where anything came from Mueller team.No, I am sorry but that is just another excuse.  It would be different if Trump behaved differently before becoming president.  It would be different if he had a career of being honest but that is not the case even from his own mouth. Trump lying has been his MO for decades.  There are piles or cases where the man shows at every turn he cannot tell the truth no matter what the occasion is. You really should stop trying to find a defense for the man's constant lying it really do not help your case. 

You should really listen to yourself.  It's everyone else fault for Trump lying.  Everyone seems to be at fault when something goes wrong but Trump.  

No Trump is not a liar just because.  This is where I believe your problem comes from.  Trump is a liar because its been proven countless times that he lies.  I never compared Trump to Hitler, I compare him to your average con man.  He tells you want you want to hear.  He will make up whatever story that satisfy what you believe or think and he will take you to school when you blink.  Trump probably only wish he could be even close to Hitler.  The man is not anywhere close to being in that league of villains.

Still, if you are investigating or could investigate your boss, why would you need to make anything public until after the investigation.  Trump was already out of line for asking for this since he is suppose to separate himself from the investigation.  In other words he was trying to influence public opinion before any results were found.  The same way that he continue to do today.  Instead of letting things run their course he wants to continue to put himself within it.  Its his constant butting in that probably has fueled things to where they are today.  With the lies and butting in, he continue to throw more logs on the fire keeping things hot but knowing you, it's everyone else fault.

As for Manafort and Cohen trial, why don't you show me any leaks that came from Mueller team.

https://wjla.com/news/nation-world/25-leaks-about-the-mueller-investigation-and-the-problems-they-may-cause

https://www.cnn.com/2018/05/24/politics/special-counsel-leaks-klayman/index.html

http://www.latimes.com/la-ol-enter-the-fray-the-mueller-questions-leak-1525186933-htmlstory.html

https://www.politico.com/story/2018/05/14/mueller-leaks-hearing-trump-586555

 

Lets just address the first link.  Nowhere in that article did it provide not one veritable proof that any leak came from Mueller team.  If anything it shows that leaks come from everywhere including the white house.  

Your second link provided absolutely nothing.  It's about Freedom watch wanting records pertaining to the Flynn case.

The third link is about the 50 questions leaked to the press.  Anybody who was paying attention knows that the white house leaked those questions.

https://abovethelaw.com/2018/05/why-did-trumps-lawyers-leak-the-mueller-questions-a-few-theories/

The last link is about as supportive as the others.  In other words you did a google search and found these links but did not read any of them.  If anything, all the leaks within Trump administration seems a direct result of confidence in him.  There seems to be this image from people within Trump admin that he is an idiot.  This seems to be proven time and again when he opens his mouth or tweets.  Anyway, continue your google search, you might find something worth pinning on Mueller team instead of everyone else trying to make money off of this idiot in office.



EricHiggin said:

Plenty of reasons that sure make it look like there have been plenty of leaks from Muellers team, whether the leaks went straight to the media or through another source. No hard evidence really at this point in time though, but you don't name your sources when those sources are helping your agenda behind the scenes. Considering his team has gone out of their way to push back court dates, and try to weasel their way out of hearings because they are so honest and can't be bothered by outside matters, since the investigation is so much more important. Sounds quite familiar, like Trump saying he's innocent and doesn't want to be bothered by outside matters like the media and left, constantly bashing him for something that has nothing to do with him specifically, and that it's also holding back his political agenda which is much more important.

The unbiased media however, goes out of their way to bash Trump because it's quite clear that he's guilty, yet makes it seem like Mueller and his people were appointed by the Lord our God to speak nothing but the truth, untouchable by evil. More than a few people have already been booted off Muellers team since it's inception for abusing their power. Talking about track records...

How about the media? How squeaky clean have their stories been over the decades? I'd bet they lie just as much if not more than Trump does. That doesn't matter though because the media said Trump was bad and a liar, and their the truth tellers, so no point in looking into their own character. They aren't the President either, so what power do they really have, and why care about them right? It's not like people go to them to find out who's ahead in the political polls, how much wine a day is the healthiest, and weather or not it's going to rain.

I also am having a hard time differentiating between what is fact and what is excuses. For some reason it seems like the only thing I can come up with are excuses, and the only thing you can come up with is fact. I would have thought by now at least one thing I've mentioned was more than just personal bias, and at least one thing you've mentioned wouldn't be solid fact...

Let me help you with the excuse part since you do not know what I consider an excuse.

Trump lies, my response, he is a liar

Your response

As I explained earlier, when every Dem and lefty and the majority of the media are after you and are willing to spin everything you do or say to try and make a fool of you, what tends to happen is those 'victims' tend to lie, since they are, or would be, lied about anyway. 

This is a classic example of what I consider a excuse to excuse Trump behavior.  What you basically try to do here is say that Trump lying is a result of everyone else.  Its everyone else fault he lies not because he is just a lier.  Actually if we are going to use the term correctly he is what you call a bullshitter.  In that one line, you tried to make Trump out to be some type of victim.  Most of your post is trying to make Trump some type of victim.  The media and the left is why he does what he does.

So within the body of text you have written, you have found an excuse to ignore or dismiss behavior you probably would not tolerate from anyone else.  These are used as excuses so you do not have to deal with parts that you do not like.

So here is my expectation from anyone not just Trump.  To be as honest as you possible can.  If you are caught lying, what I do not expect you to do is cover up with another lie.  I do not expect to have to keep checking to see if you are lying the majority of the time and I definitely do not expect to have to constantly question anything that you say.  This is where I am at with the President.  Everytime he opens his mouth about anything, I am at the point to believe he is lying first not telling the Truth.  Maybe you like to be BS all the time but at some point in time, I willing to believe even you will get tired of it.



Machiavellian said:

Lets just address the first link.  Nowhere in that article did it provide not one veritable proof that any leak came from Mueller team.  If anything it shows that leaks come from everywhere including the white house.  

Your second link provided absolutely nothing.  It's about Freedom watch wanting records pertaining to the Flynn case.

The third link is about the 50 questions leaked to the press.  Anybody who was paying attention knows that the white house leaked those questions.

https://abovethelaw.com/2018/05/why-did-trumps-lawyers-leak-the-mueller-questions-a-few-theories/

The last link is about as supportive as the others.  In other words you did a google search and found these links but did not read any of them.  If anything, all the leaks within Trump administration seems a direct result of confidence in him.  There seems to be this image from people within Trump admin that he is an idiot.  This seems to be proven time and again when he opens his mouth or tweets.  Anyway, continue your google search, you might find something worth pinning on Mueller team instead of everyone else trying to make money off of this idiot in office.

They don't prove beyond a doubt Cohen and Manafort, but they do point out questionable behavior regardless, and you pretend like the rest doesn't matter, only the one specific point made. Your the one using Trump and all his lies over time to justify specific points here and now, which don't include those past lies apparently, so why can't I? Excuses much?

Machiavellian said:

Let me help you with the excuse part since you do not know what I consider an excuse.

Trump lies, my response, he is a liar

Your response

As I explained earlier, when every Dem and lefty and the majority of the media are after you and are willing to spin everything you do or say to try and make a fool of you, what tends to happen is those 'victims' tend to lie, since they are, or would be, lied about anyway. 

This is a classic example of what I consider a excuse to excuse Trump behavior.  What you basically try to do here is say that Trump lying is a result of everyone else.  Its everyone else fault he lies not because he is just a lier.  Actually if we are going to use the term correctly he is what you call a bullshitter.  In that one line, you tried to make Trump out to be some type of victim.  Most of your post is trying to make Trump some type of victim.  The media and the left is why he does what he does.

So within the body of text you have written, you have found an excuse to ignore or dismiss behavior you probably would not tolerate from anyone else.  These are used as excuses so you do not have to deal with parts that you do not like.

So here is my expectation from anyone not just Trump.  To be as honest as you possible can.  If you are caught lying, what I do not expect you to do is cover up with another lie.  I do not expect to have to keep checking to see if you are lying the majority of the time and I definitely do not expect to have to constantly question anything that you say.  This is where I am at with the President.  Everytime he opens his mouth about anything, I am at the point to believe he is lying first not telling the Truth.  Maybe you like to be BS all the time but at some point in time, I willing to believe even you will get tired of it.

You point out Trump is a liar, always has been, always will be, with so much hard evidence... I point out so has the media, and for much longer and much more substantial than Trump since he hasn't been Prez for long. You completely ignore this and point out again how only Trump and his administration can be wrong. I call that excuses.

It's hard to know when someone is being victimized, when there are so many playing victim, and doing an award winning job at it. Some not so much. So if I don't have a problem with the behavior and tolerate it, then it's not excuses? Because I don't for the most part. Problem solved then?

There is also just dropping and bypassing an argument completely, like some people tend to do over the course of a conversation... Would you rather everyone turn a blind eye when they can't, beyond a shadow of a doubt, back up their claims, yet reply with another non related argument to try and make their case?

A bunch of the points I made point out how both sides could be viewed as just as bad as the other, and instead of agreeing with any of them, you always take the side against Trump. The weather is never always just too hot or too cold, too wet or too dry, etc. If it ever was, you would definitely know there was a problem.

Last edited by EricHiggin - on 17 September 2018

The Canadian National Anthem According To Justin Trudeau

 

Oh planet Earth! The home of native lands, 
True social law, in all of us demand.
With cattle farts, we view sea rise,
Our North sinking slowly.
From far and snide, oh planet Earth, 
Our healthcare is yours free!
Science save our land, harnessing the breeze,
Oh planet Earth, smoke weed and ferment yeast.
Oh planet Earth, ell gee bee queue and tee.

EricHiggin said:
Machiavellian said:

Lets just address the first link.  Nowhere in that article did it provide not one veritable proof that any leak came from Mueller team.  If anything it shows that leaks come from everywhere including the white house.  

Your second link provided absolutely nothing.  It's about Freedom watch wanting records pertaining to the Flynn case.

The third link is about the 50 questions leaked to the press.  Anybody who was paying attention knows that the white house leaked those questions.

https://abovethelaw.com/2018/05/why-did-trumps-lawyers-leak-the-mueller-questions-a-few-theories/

The last link is about as supportive as the others.  In other words you did a google search and found these links but did not read any of them.  If anything, all the leaks within Trump administration seems a direct result of confidence in him.  There seems to be this image from people within Trump admin that he is an idiot.  This seems to be proven time and again when he opens his mouth or tweets.  Anyway, continue your google search, you might find something worth pinning on Mueller team instead of everyone else trying to make money off of this idiot in office.

They don't prove beyond a doubt Cohen and Manafort, but they do point out questionable behavior regardless, and you pretend like the rest doesn't matter, only the one specific point made. Your the one using Trump and all his lies over time to justify specific points here and now, which don't include those past lies apparently, so why can't I? Excuses much?

I read two of your links, and it seems like you're trying to use a "where there's smoke there's fire" argument, only you can't even say the smoke is coming from Muller, just that smoke exists somewhere in the world.  Not really compelling to anyone who isn't desperate to see Muller in the wrong. 

For example, hypothetically, if you proved conclusively that "either the White House or Muller leaked stuff", and Trump's White House has been proven in the past to leak like a sieve, you can't reasonably expect us to believe that it's evidence Muller leaked stuff. 

Again, you are coming at this with a whole boatload of assumptions that just aren't a reasonable starting point. 



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